I am setting up an off grid camper trailer to live in as I build and this stove might be the thing for me to keep warm in the winter and cook on.
So with that, I'm looking to keep the weight down of course. I won't be towing the trailer around though and will support the floor.
Any thoughts on tweaking things things here and there in the design to keep it as small as possible?
It's a fine line to balance the weight issue in a trailer with having a nice mass to keep the heat in over the night. I wonder where that line might be when installing this kind of stove in a camper trailer? I certainly can't be running the propane furnace all winter in Ontario to stay warm and cook with...
Any way. Great stuff here Matt. I'll post my build if I do end up putting this design in the trailer. Thanks for the videos, they are super helpful!
So I guess Geoff is trying something different this year with his online pdc. He is running this one on a referral basis. He has given out links to folks who have completed one of his earlier pdc (like me) and we are allowed to refer our friends and family.
So you guys at permies are my friends and I am going to give out the invite here for anyone looking to sign up. This link is only good for a limited time, so if you are interested in participating in this pdc, you better act sooner rather than later. Apparently this pdc is going to be bigger and better than the previous ones and he wants to give his full attention to the folks signing up. Thus he doesn't want a million people signing up.
Here they are. The ones I opened. I clicked on them both and they opened in separate tabs both with the security warning. Then I added the exceptions, but I still see the little warning symbol in the address bar.
I went to follow some links from the dailyish today and got a warning from firefox that this site was not trusted and I should not be here. The security certificate was not right in some way or another. Of course I added the exception and continued on, but not so good for regular folks.
As far as places where the local farmers gather, I'm not sure. They have community events, like bingo, cards, and fundraising dinners at the legion, but different people show up to different events. There are the churches in town as well, which many people attend. This would probably be a good place to meet and chat with folks. We basically told everyone we met that we were looking for a place and if they knew of anything to let us know. But that requires spending significant amounts of time in the area. There are a few rich people there who own a significant amount of different properties who you could track down and ask if they might sell something.
I don't know what your situation is, but it would be good if you could get up there and spend time talking to folks. It's best to do that when all the cottagers aren't there, so after labour day or before July.
I think the group you had contact with, who are looking to buy a very large piece of land and create an intentional community on, are farther south into the bush from South River off highway 11. That is a different area from where we are looking. The people I was referring to are just random folks who have moved to the area and purchased their own respective properties and are doing their own thing, but still getting together and trading, talking, making community. Port Loring is on highway 522, north more, closer to North Bay. Google map it. It is still part of the same large section of unorganized area that the other folks are looking to purchase in, but it is more in the "middle of nowhere".
For income we are going to be running our herbal tea business at local area markets in the summer and selling online all year. We are also going to be farming/gardening to provide ourselves with food and sell some down the road. We are also going to be setting up an education space where we will teach about herbalism, permaculture, wild plants/foraging, all that good stuff. There is a group of us who have just formed an organization to get some government funding to get some cool things going, focused on, arts, history, environment, and recreation, so this may lead to other income streams.
We are looking for a smaller scale set up, around 10 acres, probably with a home already built, so we can jump right in a get the things going we want to see happen.
Are you in a position to be able to go spend some time in the area talking to folks? I still think knocking on doors is a good idea. If not knocking, then driving by and looking for farmers who are outside and then walking up and talking to them. They are really quite friendly in the area and do like to talk.
We have been looking for land in unorganized townships for some time now as well. We have settled on the Port Loring area, which is a great little community. We have lived up there the last two summers working at the farmers market selling our herbal teas and getting to know the locals. Land there is reasonably priced, not as cheap as way up north near Kirkland lake, but it is only 3.5 hours from Toronto, making it the closest unorganized area in Ontario to the major cities. There is a decent amount of farmland in the area, but not a lot for sale on the market.
The best thing we have found when looking for land there is to spend some time in the area and get talking to the locals. Go knock on some farmer's doors and see if they would sell you some land. They are pretty friendly in the area and like to talk. A lot of the farmers are quite old now and some have many hundreds of acres. I think this approach is also the only way you are going to get an owner held mortgage. I highly doubt you will get that going through a real estate agent. You basically have to get the people to like you and want to help you out, which requires spending time there and talking to the locals.
There is movement happening of cool people moving to the area and looking to do cool things with the lax regulations. There is a large influx of cottages in the summer which really helps the local economy and makes the farmers market very good. Now is the time to buy up there, as things are really starting to sell in the last year or so. We are moving up there permanently coming this spring, as we get the last of our business sorted out in the city here (Windsor).
I'm happy to give you more advice or help out however I can in this space.
Karen Layne wrote:Awesome work Simon! You are obviously resourceful and quite handy. Great pictures. I love that there's a dog's butt in 4 of them. Did i see a German short-hair pointer?
Im going to have to get some pallets. I think i know of a source.
Thanks Karen! The pups like to be close and see what's going on There is one german short hair and one blue heeler / border collie.
Tyler Ludens wrote:How large is the actual growing space? It looks pretty big!
The space is 18' x 30'. Not huge, but should be a good start. Half the back yard is driveway and we figured better let the pups have a little grass at the end to do their business on, and it just worked out to this size with the 2x4s we had.
We only did the pallet fence where the driveway was along the back of the property. The other half of the property has a few fairly large ceder trees along the edge. So we cut down a couple shrubs which were in our garden area, as well as the lower branches from the ceders and wove them between the trees to create an impenetrable natural fence. This worked out swimmingly. There is no way the dogs will get through this either and it looks cool.
With the new berm in place keeping the water from the alley out of our driveway, we also made a little drainage trench over to the low spot in the lawn for the water that does collect on the drive to drain into.
We also needed to fence the dogs out of the part of the yard where we are going to be growing things, so we made more pallet fence. This one isn't as high, but it worked out just as nicely. We only needed one 2x4 along the top of the pallets to keep it together. We also staked a couple supports into the ground to hold it up.
I am super happy with the way these fences turned out. If you look for them, there are many nice looking, high quality pallets of the same size just waiting to be used for fencing.
To make the actual garden we decided to go with cardboard and wood chips to kill the grass. We went with this method because we could get chips and cardboard for free and we wanted a garden which we could leave for periods of time and not have to weed as much. I am aware of the cardboard toxicity, but I figure we are living in the dirty city anyway and who knows what the people did to the lawn before we moved in. The ground is undoubtedly somewhat toxic as is, so a little cardboard is surely not going to make it worse. And we want a fairly low maintenance set up, so cardboard and wood chips it is.
We called up a local furniture store and had them collect some large cardboard boxes for a few days for us and we had a family member working for the parks department who hooked us up with one of their large piles of wood chips. So we made a few tips with the trailer and got a nice pile of each.
After getting some cardboard and chips down, it started to rain pretty good, so we kept at it and got the whole fenced in area covered as it got nice and soaked. It's been pretty rainy since then, keeping everything nice and soggy.
We also set up a little compost bin with some smaller pallets and chicken wire we had lying around. It's working out nicely as well. Keeping the dogs out.
Thus far I am pleased with how things have turned out on our little project. We have ordered a bunch of seeds and will plant those in a few weeks. We would really like to get some bushes, trees and shrubs in, but we don't have any money for those right now. We'll keep our eyes and ears open for any sweet deals and add them into the project as they come.
This is as far as we have come right now, but I'll keep updating this as we progress.
We are getting a little garden going in our back yard this year and I wanted to share some of what we have going on.
The first thing we did was go out and get a bunch of nice pallets to make a couple fences out of. A quick Kijiji search lead us to a massive pile of pallets of all different sizes we could pick from. We needed to keep the dogs in the yard and not have them roam around the alley. We also want to do this project as cheaply as possible. So free pallets for a fence is perfect.
Before we started standing the pallets up to make a fence, we had to do some earthworks at the end of the drive way. There is a low spot in the alley right at the end of our driveway and our driveway is even lower than the alley, so whenever it rained all the water would run into our place and make a huge mud puddle at the end of the drive. So we shovelled all the built up mud and gravel from the end of our drive and made a nice little berm at the end of the drive. We drove over it a few times with the car while we were bringing loads of stuff in making it nice and compacted.
A couple days later we had a torrential downpour and the berm worked perfectly. The water level was noticeably higher in the alley than in our driveway. It worked so well that the water was actually able to flow down the alley to the sewer drain where it was supposed to go. You can see the water level in the second picture a bit. It's hard to tell from the pictures.
Making the pallet fence was incredibly easy. We just stood them up on end and screwed a 2x4 along the top and the bottom to hold it together. We then anchored one end to a tree and the other end we secured to the concrete driveway. We also put in a gate, by securing another pallet perpendicular to the fence into the ground, then attaching hinges. The gate works great. This fence is solid and about 5' high. No dogs are going to jump it or crash it down.
Not only is the fence almost free, super strong, and easy to build, but it looks sweet. From the alley, you would almost never know it was made of pallets. It looks every bit as good as any of the neighbour's expensive fences and better than the cheap ones.
Nothing yet. Mostly it's all pretty expensive. I'm moving up to the area next month for the summer though, so I'll be able to talk with the locals and see if someone wants to sell but isn't on the market. We'll see what happens and I'll post here if I find something.
I came across this ad on Kijiji a couple weeks ago while looking for land around the North Bay area. There is a group of people looking to start up a community in the area and have been putting in some pretty serious leg work over the past 3 years. They have a nice meet-up group online with lots of discussion happening regarding all aspects of the community. They have been scoping out a really nice piece of land and are getting ready to start making some moves on it. Anyone who is even remotely interested in this type of living should check this out. The buy in price is super reasonable with a sizable lot for you to build on. The land is also in unorganized township, so you can build something cool without the inspector hassling you. I messaged the guy and joined the group right away.
This is something I would love to build this summer. Where I am the sun doesn't always shine and the wind can be cold, making for a less than ideal solar shower situation. A nice hot bath heated with a rocket stove would be so nice.
As far as having the tub above the barrel/bell to get the most heat, maybe sinking the rocket stove in the ground is better than raising the tub above the barrel.
Julia Winter wrote:Satamax wants to have the tub on top of the bell, since that's the hottest part of the system.
Just for clarity sake Julia, I believe the hottest part of a rocket stove/mass heater is somewhere around half way up the inside of the insulated heat riser. Of course this doesn't really help us when designing to heat water in a tub though and for the sake of that I think you are correct in saying the hottest place to capture heat for the tub is from the top of the barrel/bell.
The results were: "the ring of fire" - a rocket mass heater shaped in a circle with glass to show the burn; an outdoor rocket mass heater/cooker/smoker; A "batch box style" rocket mass heater with measured output cleaner than anything we have ever encountered; An indoor rocket stove, griddle and water heater.
Under the about this project description it says:
The trick is to mix modern science with knowledge from hundreds of years ago: Burn the smoke; capture heat from the exhaust; focus on the more efficient forms of heat (radiant and conductive heat are favored over convective heat); and, most of all, use a mass to hold the heat for days.
The use of capitals after the colons and semicolons is inconsistent. I am not sure of the "proper way" to go about this, but I suggest at least being consistent and following the same procedure throughout.