After a delayed 'absorbing' of this conversation, I recognize some stuff that strongly resonates. I also am often totally 'captured' by the 'screen'... the dopamine that is supposedly triggered by 'learning something new' is a seriously addictive 'drug' for me. 'Curiosity', typically so highly valued, may be a danger for me. I have to remember that 'moderation in all things' applies in spades for the draw the internet/computer has for me. Being 'here and now' is my antidote... and nothing brings me 'back' to here and now like stepping out my back door... into reality : ) (Oh, and also, gratitude assists!)
I'm not often in the 'city' (Seattle), so it still has the appeal of a 'different' experience, plus childhood memories, that I can appreciate and enjoy, but even there, my attention goes to the natural world... the plants : ) I'm wondering, now, if the 'artificial screen' world vs the 'real plant' world doesn't reflect the 'thinking' vs 'being' dichotomy? the head vs heart (however those are defined by each of us)? And, that my challenge (as always!) is practicing the discipline to 'moderate'... for me, personally, that is :) Thanks, Nicole... got my work cut out... er, clarified?... for me. (Hope this isn't too OT :)
I'm getting so inspired by ..hostas! especially the old fashioned fragrant ones : ) Thanks! I have a few of the 'fancy' variegated ones, but now must get the others... and use en masse as ground cover :) Also, in my explorations, I ran across this name for the 'pieces' that are 'split off' and shared... 'passalong plants'...and, hostas and sedums easily qualify :) (Also, I've found that 'slips' -as my grandmother called them - i.e., 'cuttings', often surreptitiously obtained :) of geraniums, fuschias, hydrangeas, sedums, echevarias, mints, et al, not to mention houseplants, will happily root in a glass of water. (What have I left off?)
Shawn... hang in there!! I'll skip the physical book, keep the $15 pledge... I'll stay with my original $10 reward... call any difference a 'donation'. Thanks for all your hard work...much appreciated.
I got a 'weird' email, too. I guess I upped my original $10 pledge to $15, which added the physical book. But the $15 doesn't cover shipping? Or.... ??? I'm confused... just throw in another e-treat for the extra $5... we'll call it even :) (Don't think there's any shipping involved.. ?) Or... keep the $15, and provide the $10 stuff... I'll consider it a donation to my favorite 'charity' : )
Been cutting my own hair since I paid at a beauty shop, then came home to 'fix' it. That might have been age 30, and now 72. I cut it short at one time, and now it is easy that it is long and pinned up. My secret was the discovery of 'thinning shears'... can't make a bad cut if you go cross the end of each cut with the thinning shears... it all blends in :)
Hopefully not wandering too far off topic, but, Jondo, re: Baxter's experiments, there is a recently noticed problem with scientific research ... the 'decline effect' and 'replication crisis' (see Wiki articles on both). It seems that trials and experiments, when repeated, often no not produce the trusted results that the originals had, no one knows why. It is causing concern in the scientific community. I, personally, have a problem with 'scientists' who have already decided what is possible and what is impossible, before using the scientific process to explore a hypothesis (seems to drift into 'dogma' and undermines science's specialty!)
BTW, another great book on animal intelligence is 'Animal Wise' by Morrell... re: fish, see the chapter on the archer fish. Frans de Waal has long explored animal emotions... especially in primates. I, too, find this subject utterly engrossing!
Some one mentioned 'books', and here's a new one that might provided needed scientific research (not subsidized by Big Ag, et al) to counter the suspect rationales in the 'EAT Lancet' report: (I've already put in a 'Purchase Request' at my library :)
'Nutrition in Crisis', by Feinman, published by Chelsea Green, 2019.
There is an interesting article by Michael Pollan in The New Yorker - 'Plant Intelligence' on this research... note how 'sensitive plants' (a kind of mimosa?) remembered that being dropped was not dangerous enough to cause them to fold their leaves up. : ) Google 'plant intelligence pollan new yorker'
And, hey, here's from the 'Biochar vs Hugelculture' thread in biochar forum...."The very first thing I am going to do with the next batch of available char is spread it in the chicken cave. I did this on a very tiny scale last year with some char from a laboratory and it seemed to have a great effect. Once the chickens tilled it in the air sweetened up because the char absorbs so much." It's from Marc Flora's (long) posting (2009) on how he planned to handle zillons of tons of bug-killed conifers north of Helena, MT.
This serendipitous series of articles, and JW's practice, etc. reminds me of Thoreau's "if one advances confidently in the direction of his dreams (er... theories?) ... he will meet with a success (a Cornell article?) unexpected in common hours" : )
Maybe tangential, but your mention of "using wide roof over hangs as auxilary space" reminded me of the traditional Japanese house as described in 'Just Enough' by Asby Brown (may have been discussed in a Permies podcast sometime back). But it is totaly square :) And also, 'hempcrete' ... hmmm
Thanks all, for the good info!! Stacy, I've got a gallon jar of lemon peels in distilled vinegar... probably a year old! Good to hear of your experience. I found the idea on Erica Strauss' (now archived) website. https://nwedible.com/diy-weedkiller/ (it has tons of great info + very entertaining, especially re: PNW)
BTW, I think I 'made' approximately 20% vinegar by freezing a known amount of regular 5% distilled, then put it out to start defrosting. I poured the liquid off as it thawed, until I had a quarter of the beginning amount. (Acetic acid has a lower freezing point than H2O). So... at 5% vinegar, does that mean my 1/4 amount is about 20% ... maybe ? (I did the math, but it's not my strong suit :)
"--Approximately 1-2 days before the carrot plants were expected to emerge, the now very weedy
bed was sprayed with a mixture of water, vinegar and citrus oils. This burns down the weed
growth in full sun light and allows the emerging carrots full use of the bed with little or no competition.
--40 days into the season, a half hour of hand weeding was sufficient to clear any late-germinating
weeds from within the 4 rows of carrots. This was the only weed control time spent for the test
PNW - bindweed, for sure. Re: English ivy, I have to cut it back/down, every year, but now consider it 'harvestsing biomass', as the 'bundles' make effective mulch. And quack grass, I just sit on my stool, and 'fork' the roots out... just a delaying tactic, but at least it's sitting down work (same for the ivy... I can sit on a burlap sack to clip it.)
Wow, indeed, JW! Thanks for posting this. I'd read about 'SRI' years ago, it's amazing results in production (and profits) for Asian rice farmers... and the push back from the agricultural, industry & academic institutions who found it incredible, and said so quickly and loudly. Now I'm off to track down Mark Fulford (sp ?)... thanks again!!
Well, there are some folks who don't think they're getting any value unless they pay for it (what else to do with their $$). And others who have to count their pennies and are experts at finding the 'free' stuff. Being one of the latter, I find permaculture info is quite available, in pieces, on line (like right here!), and in whole at the library (books, CD's etc galore - does anyone need a list of authors/titles?). I'm just glad that the principles, in their various flavors, are seeping into the zeitgeist... through many channels and labels. (Of course, I have a personal 'problem' with 'true believers' of every stripe, i.e, the 'my way or the highway' types...maybe being raised Catholic, it started when I learned that the Pope was supposed to be 'infallible' lol!)
FWIW, I posted the OP to alert to the large and powerful 'political' campaign to limit (by a number of means) our access to meat. I don't really care how any one eats (althuogh sharing personal stories is fun and educational :), but I do care about an effort to limit our options... as this certainly is... IMO : ) I didn't intend to trigger a debate over which of the many 'diets' is better... just want meat eaters to be aware of this threat (not to mention the damage to our environment that could result from erasing animals from our agriculture).
Here again, with more reaction to 'EAT Lancet' report, an email from Chris Kresser, a functional medicine guy I really trust (foot notes all his information etc)...
EAT-Lancet: the latest attack on meat
From: Chris Kresser
To: n sutton
Feb 21 at 5:03 AM
Hi, everyone, I’m sure you’ve heard about the EAT-Lancet study by now.
It’s the latest in a seemingly endless parade of agenda-driven editorials masquerading as scientific research with the intention of promoting a vegetarian/vegan diet.
Frankly, after many years of writing 3,000- to 5,000-word articles systematically picking apart studies like this, I simply couldn’t muster the energy to respond to this one. I spent many weeks researching and preparing for my debate on the Joe Rogan show with vegan doctor Joel Kahn, and during that process I wrote more than 25,000 words on this topic. All of those articles are organized by category on this page - https://chriskresser.com/why-eating-meat-is-good-for-you/ Everything you need to know about why meat and animal products are not only essential to our health, but to our ecosystem, can be found there.
As for more specific critiques of the EAT-Lancet study, fortunately, many others have risen to the challenge. My three favorite articles are:
20 Ways EAT Lancet’s Global Diet Is Wrongfully Vilifying Meat, by Diana Rodgers
Should You EAT Lancet?, by Marty Kendall
The EAT Lancet Diet Is Nutritionally Deficient, by Zoë Harcombe
...Unfortunately, studies like this aren’t going to stop. They’re part of a coordinated plant-based agenda that continues to pick up steam.
For example, back in November of ’18, researchers at Oxford University called for a “meat tax,” claiming that it would save $172 billion in healthcare costs.
I don’t know if or when this will happen, but there’s a considerable amount of support for it in the mainstream health and political worlds.
We’ve still got work to do ...
P.S. … and part of that work is countering the vegetarian and vegan health and environmental narrative. The best way to do that is with a film. .... Fortunately, there’s one in the works (called Sacred Cow), and I’m an advisor and supporter and will be featured in it. Will you consider helping out? Click here to learn more.
Lately, it's occurred to me that most of the currently popular 'new' diets (paleo, PHD, carnivore, 30-day, keto, LCHF, etc), which seem to result in better health, may do so primarily because they all prohibit sugar! and, yes, grains and processed food. The one diet that is the exception, vegetarian and vegan, has only one prohibition - animal-sourced foods. Hmmm..... food for thought : )
I think intermittent fasting would be very beneficial, but I have one problem.... I don't know what effect it might have on afib (also high blood pressure). I suspect it would be beneficial, but can't find evidence to support my 'hope'. Anyone know of any, one way or the other? Thanks : )
I found #1 piqued my curiosity about all the plants...I'd want more info... and #2 wasn't a clear enough message (I'm lazy and untidy, too, but it doesn't help me much ;), and #3 was a tad 'plain jane' for me. But I'm weird : )
FYI there are several links here to 'NutritionFacts' which is the work of Dr. Michael Greger, an avowed vegan, with a serious bias. I think it is a disservice to compare him to Dr. Mercola. BTW, a very entertaining, well footnoted, and unbiased book on the history of the 'nutrition industry' is 'Death by Food Pyramind' by Winger, which includes the Ancel Keys "fat is death" fiasco (how many people avoided animal fat, ate 'innocent' sugar, and died prematurely?... all the while trusting 'science'?) Also, check out Wiki: 'Replication Crisis' and 'Decline Effect' for more info.
When 'science' declares areas of study out of bounds and unworthy of research, scorns 'anecdotal' evidence, requires 'extraordinary proof', etc., I think it is betraying 'real science', and promoting 'scientism'. (After all, the basis of the 'scientific method' is the hypothesis, which is based on observations, anecdotes et al.) I think 'scientism' is assuming the respectabilty of 'the scientific method', and largely buffaloing, and milking, us trusting folk.
Re: peas... they grow better in early cool spring weather, if 'chitted', i.e., soaked and pre-sprouted indoors, then planted in the ground. (And I've had some self-planted peas sprout and grow through our Zone 7-8 winter... don't know about this one, as we've had an exceptionally cold couple of weeks.)
Thanks for letting us 'be there' with you, Chris. And I see you have stand to cut up wood.... I built one, also, a couple of years ago... had to 'google' for the instructions, and the name: sawbuck : )
I agree with the 'devolution' of agriculture, that's why I find 'Essex Farm' in NY so interesting. Re: scaling biochar, I think they can 'char/burn' almost any kind of carbon...IIRC. And am excited with seeing if your char can/will capture the escaping ammonia. And your use of canes and prunings for biochar. I'll check the biochar threads to see if you've posted your system there, but wonder if they only work for you when dried out... I have to make some sort of covered area to dry, I think.
Wow, that article is ... revolutionary!! Only 1/3 way thru, and it seems like a stationary, long term system that processes manure with fungi to produce an extremely superior compost !! Claims our current bacteria heavy method is bad for soil... have to get back to reading it! And the building instructions show an easy peasy 'bioreactor', i.e., compost pile! Good stuff : ) Thanks
update... finished article 'power of microbes' - Holy Mackeral! 'Innoculation' might explain the success of OP California pasture results!! Innoculating the seeds... and minimum applied to pastures.... might explain why the Biodynamics practice with cow horns packed with manure, and buried for.. a year? ... are so powerful. Amazing. (Makes one wonder what other 'new - old' stuff is waiting to be discovered!! Monsanto (er, Bayer now?), et al, look out!
I don't know how, or if, this ties in some way or other with the first article, but this TED talk really thrills me. Especially the sauerkraut juice aspect, that kind of got lost (in the biochar compost stragegy). I think 'bokashi' is another way of pickling organic 'stuff' (including manure...maybe human manure!) with lactobacillus bacteria, so that it doesn't 'rot' until it is put into the 'compost pile' for the 'bugs' to eat it up. Enjoy!
I think they want to attract a maximum # of eyeballs, and 'dirt' works better for the 'surprise/intrigue' value. I think that is a very good strategy in order to spread the word to the 'clueless' (who probably really want the clues! : )
OK, I bought the $25 MagTorch (on Amazon). And did have the apparently-common trouble starting, but called customer service and Laurie was enthusiastically helpful, with detailed instructions and explanations, and insisted call back if needed. (BTW.. NEVER look up the tube ; ) Her instructions were spot on, and it now works fine. I only expected it to work on the early 'thread stage' annual weeds, and it seems to do that (although spring came in December here... Seattle area, so they're bigger than I'd like for flame weeding) It will never 'get rid of' quack grass, bindweed, or any other perennial weeds (but I find it gratifying to manually remove them - it's sit-down work, on my stool :) (I have suburban lot)
And agree with Dale, pulled annual weeds leave perfect tiny beds for more weeds to sprout (plus the annuals will keep growing in our moist springs... so have to be gathered & removed). (Digging out perennials does, too, but those areas are more easily 'spot mulched', for me.)
And I do wonder if possibly the reduction of sugar, that I see in many personal accounts, may account for much of the health improvement that is attributed to the reduction of meat.... ? (We'll probably never know :)