Wife’s not sleeping. We need help!

I don't know how my advice will be received here, but these are a few things that have helped me . My partner and I have massage sessions & care sessions in the evenings. We know that going to a massage therapist would be awesome, but we would rather do it for ourselves! Sit cross legged across from each other, and massage each others shoulders & necks or feet! This will make both of you feel easier and more at peace before bed, therefor setting a good tone for the following morning.
Do it how you feel comfortable.

On the mental side of things, try to have a quiet time before bed and during that time of settling in for the night, play this music from you tube called Frequency Music. Find a good one for how you are feeling!

And no matter how bad you are in pain, try to exercise that one thing that is not in pain. PLEASE!

Spend time with each other and remember that everyone deserves a peaceful home to live in, no matter the circumstances.

Tessa Dawn Nunlist wrote:I don't know how my advice will be received here, but these are a few things that have helped me . My partner and I have massage sessions & care sessions in the evenings. We know that going to a massage therapist would be awesome, but we would rather do it for ourselves! Sit cross legged across from each other, and massage each others shoulders & necks or feet! This will make both of you feel easier and more at peace before bed, therefor setting a good tone for the following morning.
Do it how you feel comfortable.

On the mental side of things, try to have a quiet time before bed and during that time of settling in for the night, play this music from you tube called Frequency Music. Find a good one for how you are feeling!

And no matter how bad you are in pain, try to exercise that one thing that is not in pain. PLEASE!

Spend time with each other and remember that everyone deserves a peaceful home to live in, no matter the circumstances.

Theres a lot there that we should improve on. I used to massage her almost every night and she still struggled to sleep but I’ve gotten away from that lately. Ive actually gotten away from HER lately and I’m starting to wonder if the lack of attention from me is contributing to her stress levels. Its also hard to have quiet time before bed as the last hour or two of the night is usually the only time of day we can talk about much together, and a lot of what we end up talking about generates some stress: relationship issues, possible job changes, covid restrictions, conspiracies…

Its easy for me to talk about that stuff and then just go to sleep anyway, but I think she stays in an elevated stress state for a while afterwards which probably interrupts her sleep cycles.

She did just bring up frequencies yesterday, so it’s interesting that you mentioned it as well. Maybe there’s something to that!

And I agree with you about exercise, but that doesn’t help my wife. She says shes so tired of being tired that she has no energy or motivation to exercise. I understand that and cant blame her. But when I explain how junky I feel when I DONT exercise and try to get her to just get some exercise despite her being tired, she refuses. I dont know if it would help or not, but it seems worth a try to me!

Brody Ekberg wrote:
Theres a lot there that we should improve on. I used to massage her almost every night and she still struggled to sleep but I’ve gotten away from that lately. Ive actually gotten away from HER lately and I’m starting to wonder if the lack of attention from me is contributing to her stress levels. Its also hard to have quiet time before bed as the last hour or two of the night is usually the only time of day we can talk about much together, and a lot of what we end up talking about generates some stress: relationship issues, possible job changes, covid restrictions, conspiracies…

Its easy for me to talk about that stuff and then just go to sleep anyway, but I think she stays in an elevated stress state for a while afterwards which probably interrupts her sleep cycles.

Talking/thinking about stressful things right before bed most DEFINITELY makes for a difficult time getting to sleep, for me. It also has a detrimental effect on my quality of sleep, and those two things leave me tired and grumpy, the next day. Knowing this is an issue for me, I've learned that if I feel my stress levels going up, right before bed, it's time to change the subject - very bluntly, if necessary. But, that's my style - I've learned to pay attention to how things affect me, and make my needs known. She may not even be aware that this could be part of her exhaustion. So, maybe you could find a way to steer your night time conversations to something more relaxing, restorative, uplifting... positive. It helps me, immensely.

Although I've not tried it myself, a friend of mine uses Rescue Remedy, he says it works great and it seems to have very good reviews online.
They apparently offer two types, one formula for stress/anxiety, the other for sleep.  It's also relatively inexpensive (about $15-20)

  Rescue Remedy for sleep:  https://tinyurl.com/3sjkt6b9

  Rescue Remedy for stress/anxiety:  https://www.amazon.com/dp/B08H6JB5R2?linkCode=ogi&th=1&psc=1&tag=sofferscom1-20

...comes in drops, gummies and sprays, (some of these are alcohol-free).
They even make it for pets (my friend gave it to his cat and says it works)

Hope you find some relief.

Brody Ekberg wrote:Theres a lot there that we should improve on. I used to massage her almost every night and she still struggled to sleep but I’ve gotten away from that lately. Ive actually gotten away from HER lately and I’m starting to wonder if the lack of attention from me is contributing to her stress levels. Its also hard to have quiet time before bed as the last hour or two of the night is usually the only time of day we can talk about much together, and a lot of what we end up talking about generates some stress: relationship issues, possible job changes, covid restrictions, conspiracies…

I think you're probably right about the lack of attention contributing. I know when I'm feeling disconnected from my partner, it stresses me immensely and it's hard to fall asleep next to him when I'm feeling hurt by his behavior. I second what Carla said about needing to avoid tense topics before bedtime. It really sounds like your wife is already way too activated and tends towards fight/flight/freeze. Of course, the relationship stuff is important and necessary to talk about. Perhaps you could make a point of scheduling talks about that and setting a time limit? Preferably not before bed, if at all possible. Maybe using a framework of some sort, like intentional dialogue? Having something like that can really help keep things calmer and more focused. And letting your wife know that it's okay to stop or take a break if she feels like it's getting to be too much.

On the note of nervous system activation, I'd be wary of the Wim Hof method for her. It can be quite powerful, but since it activates the sympathetic nervous system (fight/flight/freeze) it might not be the best for someone who is already way too in that, as suggested by her difficulty sleeping. It doesn't sound like she can necessarily bring herself back to a state of nervous system regulation on her own right now. Gentle things that help get her into the parasympathetic state (rest and digest) seems like the way to go.

Carla Burke wrote:
Talking/thinking about stressful things right before bed most DEFINITELY makes for a difficult time getting to sleep, for me. It also has a detrimental effect on my quality of sleep, and those two things leave me tired and grumpy, the next day. Knowing this is an issue for me, I've learned that if I feel my stress levels going up, right before bed, it's time to change the subject - very bluntly, if necessary. But, that's my style - I've learned to pay attention to how things affect me, and make my needs known. She may not even be aware that this could be part of her exhaustion. So, maybe you could find a way to steer your night time conversations to something more relaxing, restorative, uplifting... positive. It helps me, immensely.

I agree 100%! But she would say that falling asleep isnt her issue, its getting back to sleep once she wakes up in the middle of the night. And unfortunately, the few hours before bed are about the only time of the day that we have to discuss anything, and we do have a lot to discuss!. But I would almost rather not talk at all than contribute to her suffering by talking!

My mom was struggling with insomnia and I got her a dodow sleep light after reading a ton of reviews. Dodow light Even after I got it I was thinking there was no way it would work, but I figured what the heck, she won't do pills. She has been using it and said it actually worked for her! She was super skeptical of it but was amazed that she just falls asleep easily with it. It works similar to meditation where it slows your breathing down while you breathe in and out to the pattern of light it emits. It is completely silent, which mom likes and it turns itself off and is small/ fits easily on her nightstand.

Denise Kersting wrote:My mom was struggling with insomnia and I got her a dodow sleep light after reading a ton of reviews. Dodow light Even after I got it I was thinking there was no way it would work, but I figured what the heck, she won't do pills. She has been using it and said it actually worked for her! She was super skeptical of it but was amazed that she just falls asleep easily with it. It works similar to meditation where it slows your breathing down while you breathe in and out to the pattern of light it emits. It is completely silent, which mom likes and it turns itself off and is small/ fits easily on her nightstand.

Thank you, I’ll run this by her!

If you do want to try the light, I've seen a few on Ebay and a few of the other online resale sites for less than retail. I actually just got one including shipping for under $19 for myself.

Denise Kersting wrote:If you do want to try the light, I've seen a few on Ebay and a few of the other online resale sites for less than retail. I actually just got one including shipping for under $19 for myself.

Good thinking!

Brody, maybe I missed it, but I don't think anyone has mentioned hormone testing to see if this is a contributor to your wife's condition. I have had insomnia for decades along with progressive pain from back surgery and degenerating discs in my neck along with many old injuries coming back to say Hi.

This is just my experience, but when I started taking DHEA, I started sleeping much better. Instead of always having a 2 hour wake up period in the middle of the night, or not getting to sleep until 4 am, I now wake up briefly twice a night then go right back to sleep. My chronic pain is much reduced. I also started taking pregnenolone, which is a pro-hormone that is metabolized into DHEA, estrogens, cortisol, and testosterone, so your body converts it into what's needed, which I like. I take 20 mg of pregnenolone and I noticed within two days that I was much calmer and yet more alert - like the engine inside me wasn't constantly revving up like it has been doing my whole life. One odd benefit of taking pregnenolone is that I now have nice finger nails. The low-level agitation is gone so I'm not picking at my nails anymore.

One thing that's really interesting is that I did the elimination diet last year for food sensitivities and found many that set my heart racing. Now that I'm on the DHEA and pregnenolone, I'm not nearly as sensitive to these foods.

If your wife's hormones are out of whack, which is almost guaranteed with the level of stress she's been under, it's really difficult to get a handle on anything else. I would advise seeing a doctor that will check her hormone levels and approach it from this angle.

BTW I am a trained herbalist and although both western and Chinese herbs helped, nothing seemed to fix the underlying issue, which for me seems to be low hormone levels. If you do some searching, you'll find that low hormones can cause many of the symptoms that your wife is experiencing.

The mold you mentioned definite needs to get fixed for your health as well as hers. I used to do mold assessments in a previous job so if you want more info let me know and I can give a few pointers.

[quote=Robin Katz]

Brody, maybe I missed it, but I don't think anyone has mentioned hormone testing to see if this is a contributor to your wife's condition. I have had insomnia for decades along with progressive pain from back surgery and degenerating discs in my neck along with many old injuries coming back to say Hi.

This is just my experience, but when I started taking DHEA, I started sleeping much better. Instead of always having a 2 hour wake up period in the middle of the night, or not getting to sleep until 4 am, I now wake up briefly twice a night then go right back to sleep. My chronic pain is much reduced. I also started taking pregnenolone, which is a pro-hormone that is metabolized into DHEA, estrogens, cortisol, and testosterone, so your body converts it into what's needed, which I like. I take 20 mg of pregnenolone and I noticed within two days that I was much calmer and yet more alert - like the engine inside me wasn't constantly revving up like it has been doing my whole life. One odd benefit of taking pregnenolone is that I now have nice finger nails. The low-level agitation is gone so I'm not picking at my nails anymore.

One thing that's really interesting is that I did the elimination diet last year for food sensitivities and found many that set my heart racing. Now that I'm on the DHEA and pregnenolone, I'm not nearly as sensitive to these foods.

If your wife's hormones are out of whack, which is almost guaranteed with the level of stress she's been under, it's really difficult to get a handle on anything else. I would advise seeing a doctor that will check her hormone levels and approach it from this angle.

BTW I am a trained herbalist and although both western and Chinese herbs helped, nothing seemed to fix the underlying issue, which for me seems to be low hormone levels. If you do some searching, you'll find that low hormones can cause many of the symptoms that your wife is experiencing.

The mold you mentioned definite needs to get fixed for your health as well as hers. I used to do mold assessments in a previous job so if you want more info let me know and I can give a few pointers.

[/quote]

Hi Robin, and thanks for the input!

My wife got her hormones “tested” a few years ago (i don’t remember what that entailed) and was told she had hormone levels comparable to someone going into menopause, which is pretty special considering she isnt even 30 years old yet and we’ve had no children! I don’t remember what/if she was taking anything for the hormone imbalance, but her doctor ended up needing a heart transplant and quitting his practice. She has since gotten sensitivity testing, allergy testing, done elimination diets and found a new naturopathic doctor who is quite fond of traditional Chinese medicine. Lots of things help, but like you said, nothing has been a fix.

Interesting you mentioned fingernails because hers have always been weak, brittle and grow slow. She actually rarely even has to cut them because they wear off and grow so slow.

Ill have to tell her about what you said so she can bring it up with her doctor.

Also, as far as the mold goes, you may be able to help me out with that too! What did your mold assessments consist of? Im trying to think of ways to figure out if/how much mold may be in walls without destroying the walls in the process. I considered extendable cameras like for clogged pipes. Is there some clever way to know what I’m getting into without literally cutting into a wall? I’m so worried that I’ll start destroying stuff and not even find mold where I think it is!

Brody,

If she's already shown abnormal hormone levels at her age, then re-testing and treatment would be first on my agenda. And in my own experience, I felt better fast. Instead of dragging myself through the day, where every task required strength of will to make it happen, I feel like a human being again. For me, the hormone drop came on slowly so I'd forgotten what it felt like to want to do things without effort. It is considered normal to have certain hormone levels drop as you get older, but stress and our good old American lifestyle can drain us quicker. Also, exposure to plasticizers and other endocrine disruptors such as certain pesticides/herbicides plays havoc with our systems.

If her nails are brittle and slow, growing, that is one of the major symptoms of hypothyroidism. Another symptom is, oddly enough, the outer third of the eyebrows thin or non-existent. Feeling cold and/or having a low body temperature is another symptom. Again, there is lots of information about this on the web. I've had my thyroid levels checked and they are "normal" yet I had nearly all the symptoms of hypothyroidism. It's really frustrating to get help when this happens. I started taking the DHEA and pregnenolone to let my body make what it needs, and even though pregnenolone doesn't make thyroid hormones, my thyroid symptoms improved dramatically. The endocrine system is very complex with some hormones affecting other hormones, etc. I started out with very low doses and am still fine tuning it. My doctor doesn't seem to be keen on doing anything other than fixing major, measurable problems like a torn hamstring, so I feel like I'm on my own with this. We live pretty far away from a city so finding a naturopath nearby hasn't worked so far. At some point I plan to make a trip to get testing done with a naturopath since I don't want to over-do anything and cause harm to myself. So far, though I feel tons better but I'm being careful.

As far as mold goes, it all comes down to how the moisture is getting into the structure. If it's due to condensation then, it can affect everything since the water will condense in any convenient cold spot. If you have mold due to water intrusion from the outside, or from a water leak, then look for water-stained surfaces. Drywall has paper coating, and when this gets wet and stays wet for a few days, mold will grow. OSB is particularly susceptible to mold since the wood is essentially pre-chewed for the mold to grow, with lots of surface area. When I would write a recommendation, it always started with stopping the source of water for the mold to grow. Unless you do this, it will be back. Then, if it's due to a specific leak/intrusion, find all the visibly damaged drywall, insulation, carpet, underlayment, etc. and remove it plus an extra 2-4 feet. Solid wood like 2x4s could be treated in place if they were still structurally sound.

Water has an amazing ability to travel along surfaces due to capillary action. Spaces between 2x4s allow it to move up the wall or along the ceiling for several feet. I've seen it go over 8 feet along a ceiling, wetting the drywall as it traveled. Also, this should be done in an area sealed from the rest of the house and under negative pressure so that removal doesn't spread spores all over the rest of the house. This is why mold remediation companies charge what they do. Also, the workers are in respirators and Tyvek suits so that they don't get sick from the mold. After the works is complete and before any drywall or flooring is put back, the air would be tested to make sure the area was clear.  I'm sure this isn't what you wanted to hear, but that's what I used to recommend 15 years ago. Things may have changed, but I doubt they've changed too much. Since I don't really know all the details of your situation this is the best I can do right now.

*Edit*: All of my experiences came from cases with extensive water/mold damage that ended up in litigation. If your water/mold damage is small, there are guidelines put out by the government on how to address this. There is a lot you can do yourself, but that would be up to you to decide how to approach this. I suggest reading the latest information before trying to remediate yourself.

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4378297/  

Get a copper wire and a silver screen for a window, plug in wire to ground outside window, not above underground electric lines. Helps sleep.

First I will confess to only skimming other comments, and then offer up two quick notes.   Have you read Paul's info about incandescent light and similarity to natural sunset?    And then has she tried banana tea?   Or banana peel tea, if like me, she's avoiding so many carbs/sugars?   Organic banana peel tea before bed helps me with menopausal sleep issues a LOT.   But unfortunately not seemingly consecutive /multiple nights.  

H

If there was only her in the world, she would wake up in the middle of the night and live her life until she fell asleep during daytime - not giving two hoots about what people thought. If you has kids she probably think it is more important for a normal yadda yadda yadda, and if she has work she is basically ruined. So she needs a computer, games and a command to go play at night until she is tired again (or other/any activitiy) and then always sleep when she can.

Difficult to behave like her health needs her to behave... Difficult to accept that she is now an outsider in many ways - even to her husband. Which should say to her that she wants her to sleep as much as possible, and live as fully as she can alone at night: In that way, when your rythms actually co-incide it be better

I have experienced the value of getting up and doing something before trying to sleep.  I wouldn't recommend computer time myself because there is some evidence that suggests the blue light from screens acts on the brain much like a chemical stimulant.  There are programs that are supposed to shift that light frequency for people using their computers late, but when I try it I find I can't focus on what I am reading or doing.  Probably a good indicator that the program works, but I find that very frustrating.

I just joined permies and oh boy, am I glad. Excited about Rocket Heaters and compelled by this thread all in one morning!

Brody - you are amazing for so diligently responding to everyone's thoughtful responses. If you happen to read mine, please don't feel you need to, but I do want to chime in. Some of this is a cathartic sob story and some I hope helpful to you or others. I am grateful to everyone who has added their own stories here. I cried as I read through them and felt much less alone.

I have chronic insomnia (if I get 3 hours a night I'm lucky) and am (touch wood) slowly seeing a light at the end of the tunnel after a 4-month mystery chronic illness and depression. I wasn't in severe pain like your wife, but achy joints and muscles. (I'm a 51 year young female who was very healthy, slim, and health-conscious). The worst of it all was the fatigue. I literally could not get up the stairs or stand long enough to shower sometimes. Then I developed severe stomach issues which resulted in not being able to go anywhere and loss of weight. I developed allergies to everything. I was losing my hair. Basically, my immune system was shot. I had several C19 antibody blood tests - all negative (even though I'm on the fence with that whole drama anyway). I am not vaccinated.

I couldn't work (self-employed), garden, care for my animals in the way they really needed, or keep up with housework. This made me even more depressed. The house became a disgusting mess - my partner couldn't keep up and I resented the additional overwhelm. I had incredible brain fog - like a black cloud of smog lived in my head. My partner is a naturopath but didn't really have the time to do the research that I did. As a former nutritional therapist, I had some key understandings but implementing what's best for yourself under these conditions is next to impossible. When you are that depressed and tired, your brain is not working right at all. You literally can't see the forest for the trees. When people would make suggestions to me, I could tell if they had experienced this same black fog or not, based on what they said. And it's a joke to tell someone who has zero energy to go and exercise. Period.

I went down many rabbit holes including:
- Mold (really scares the crap out of you and we likely have it)
- Mold avoidance (even scarier - you basically have to move to the moon)
- SIBO
- CFS (which basically means we don't know what the f$%! is wrong with you)
- Epstein Barr Virus
- Hormone testing of every flavor (highly recommend The DUTCH test, which also tests cortisol/adrenals/etc. - if nothing else do this one)
- Lyme (I am positive for)
- Parasites
- Wilsons T3 Therapy
- Testosterone Therapy
- B12 shots
- High dose C IV
- TH8? Some kind of pot that isn't pot but crazy strong!
- CBD
- Demons!
- Many others

I'm currently going down the Peptide rabbit hole which sounds very promising for many things, including mold. If of interest, be sure to only go to a qualified doc, which you can find on this site. https://peptidesociety.org/. I haven't done this yet but am considering it, now that I can leave my home without fear of embarrassing stomach issues.

I take Ambien on occasion, usually after 3-4 nights of zero sleep. It helps for that night only, but it doesn't solve anything long-term. I took Adderal to try to make it through the day - stupid idea for insomnia but allowed me to slightly function. NOT RECOMMENDED - it screws up your dopamine levels.

I feel like my para/sympathetic nervous system is upside down. Melatonin didn't help.

I STRONGLY recommend against Kratom, which basically does the same thing to your noggin' as opiates do. It is highly addictive and creates horrible withdrawals and a whole host of issues to get off of it (trust me, I know). Much of it is contaminated with heavy metals and, possibly mold. There is a quitting kratom forum on reddit for anyone in need or in need of convincing to not try it. I realize it can be helpful for people who are trying to come off heroin etc.

When things got really bad, I told myself that if there were no improvement in 7 months I would shoot myself, and I meant it. I was keenly aware of the toll this was taking on my partner who wasn't really doing a lot to help (he didn't know how, I get it)  besides ordering tests that I requested and not offering to do the shooting of me for me!!!  I felt very alone.

What I actually wanted and felt I needed was someone  I trusted and respected to take charge, because I wasn't able to. I didn't want empathy, I wanted to hear this:  "right, this is not good and we need to get it fixed no matter what it takes. I've made you appointments here, here, and here because x, y, z.  I've done the research, spoken to these people, and want you to try this plan. I'm going to make you these smoothies every day, and we're going to hire a cleaner and someone to help with the animals. Your job is to receive and rest. When you're well enough, I'm booking you at (some kind of health clinic getaway) to help speed your recovery..." (you get the picture!). Note: I have contributed to GoFundMe campaigns for people who are going through hell, so if money is an issue, I'm sure others would do the same.

I am not suggesting the above is what your wife wants but boy, it's what I wanted and needed.

Here are some things I found to be compelling or helpful but, over everything else, the best thing to do is to find a doctor who really knows their stuff and cares. They are a rare breed for sure. My partner cares, but he is a primary care ND & too busy to really get into the weeds. Functional Medicine Doctors will go further and perform a lot of tests. Conventional doctors have no idea. Every doc has biases that have to be contended with and accounted for.
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EDUCATION/RESEARCH:
The Huberman Podcast  https://hubermanlab.com/welcome-to-the-huberman-lab-podcast/
Dr. Rhonda Patrick: https://www.foundmyfitness.com/ (check out her smoothy recipes)
Mycotoxins and Chronic Illness Symposium (free) where they also discuss peptides: https://spiritualgrowthevents.com/events/mycotoxins-and-chronic-illness-summit-2022/

A product I want to try and could help your wife is Red Light Therapy. The panels are very expensive, but all you have to do is lay underneath it, which is what someone who is very tired would need. This guy on YouTube has done a lot of the research and there are scientific papers coming out about how it helps mitochondria. It doesn't hurt that it can also reduce wrinkles, apparently!! https://www.youtube.com/c/AlexFergusdotcom

NMN with Reservatrol - research before buying. Helping me a little and helped others I know.

There are loads of supplements but you have to be careful - taking one can bugger up something else - best to do with help of functional medicine doc or a nutritional therapist.  

Also, you likely know that gut issues can $%@ everything else up.

If you have room on your property and wife is willing (maybe include some extra special touches, a massage, etc.), consider pitching a tent away from the house to stay/sleep in for a few nights to see if it helps. Not only do you get away from the possible mold, but also the EMFs etc. Make it a really special and sweet, no-pressure-on-her, relaxing evening where she isn't expected to do anything whatsoever.

Finally, this is so very hard on both of you. Couples or individual therapy might be very helpful too. I have a recommendation for someone I just started with - he offers free consults and is a spiritual, down-to-earth, wonderful human being so PM me if interested.

To everyone's well-being in this wild, wild world.
xoxo

https://drgominak.com/

If its gotten that bad, you are beyond the traditional sleep fixes which are all very repetitive.

Dr. Gomniak has some sleep therapies based on new research and she has had much success where others have failed.

It could be as simple as buying her online course for those that want to self help or you could actually see her.

She works with simple vitamin deficiencies and also correcting the timing of the different sleep phases.

You may be taking the correct vitamins for years, but lacking the correct gut bacteria to convert these to the active form of that vitamin, which can actually enter the bloodstream and reach the brain...

So there's likely nothing wrong with your brain. There's something wrong with your enzyme production, preventing the vitamins from digesting properly, leaving you deficient for many years.

There is also simple mechanical adjustments which can be made at home to get you into the deep sleep phases at the correct time.

The deep sleep phase is when the non-essential muscles become paralyzed and healing can take place.

Even "okay sleepers" can benefit from improving in these areas.

Many people are only sleeping with 1/2 of the brain asleep, and the other 1/2 awake, but this is not possible in deep sleep phase.

Well, I think we’ve narrowed down my wife’s sleeping issues at least somewhat. Shes been taking progesterone and that seems to be helping. Shes also tightened up het diet and is avoiding dairy, processed food and refined sugars which cuts inflammation way down. And we’ve been sleeping in a different bedroom to distance ourselves from the moldy wall in our bedroom.

I finally tore into that wall and it was just about as bad as I expected. The aluminum siding backer board was black and rotten, the plywood sheeting was black and rotten to the point of me being able to rip it apart with my hands. The insulation looked gross, some studs had black mold and surprisingly, the drywall looked pretty good with very minimal damage. Very thankful I started on the outside of the wall and not the inside! So, I sprayed toxic nasty poison on any discolored spots on the drywall, sanded the mold off the studs, replaced insulation, repaired carpenter ant damage (and dusted with diatomaceous earth and filled the holes they were coming in from), replaced the plywood sheeting, replaced the tar paper with tyvek, replaced the backer on the siding and put the siding back up. I did most of this with a tyvek suit, gloves, glasses and an N95 mask on. Now we’re in the process of replacing the closest window due to it being musty, moldy and no longer having a sound seal between the panes.

The bedroom smelled much better almost as soon as the siding was removed. But now that its all put back together, even with the window removed, we still smell the stink. I think the mold smell and spores probably spread through much more of the wall than what has physical damage to it. We may have to replace all the siding on the house one of these years, along with all the windows in order to totally remove the smell. In the meantime, I’d really like ti install this new window but am also trying to let the wall breathe a bit since it still stinks. Kind of feel like I’m stuck at the moment.