How to search for land/property to live on

Where does one begin their search for land/property to live on?  Is there a beginner's guide somewhere?  I'm nowhere close to ready for any of it but I'd like to begin my search now to prepare myself.  Any advice to guide me in the right direction would be forever appreciated.  Thanks in advance!  =)

Not sure if there is any rule against posting links here to sites selling land, but if you search for 'land and farm' there are several good listing sites where you can mess around with the pricing and size you're looking for.

There are some sites that specialize in 'turn-key' farms if you want a full on 'farm' that someone is selling with all the 'stuff' included, but they are pricey.

Right now it is a seller's market for sure, everything seems to be very inflated, even in areas where that was not the case a few years ago. Where I am (North Dakota) there are some good prices in remote areas where people take a long time to sell, or they need to move or are retiring from the heavy workload. But one prob is that large families sometimes keep the land in their family, so it's hard to come by and when it presents itself, it sells quickly.  When it's hundreds or thousands of acres it's pricier, but any small 'homestead' type of property sells like a hotcake, even in the most remote town. For example, not far from me was an 8 acre property with a house, quonset building, and three car garage for around $100k. They were right outside the city limits so that means you could have animals/bees. But that sold in no time, lol. And then sometimes there is land that is super cheap but they restrict what you can do on it.

Definitely research the town you are looking at, depending on what you want to do on a homestead or farm, and see what they allow. Look at the taxes as well--they are cheap in my neck of the woods but some places are pretty crazy. The Hill Country in Texas, for example, their taxes have gone up a crazy lot over the years.

That makes me think of properties that are sold for back taxes--it is a way to get something cheaper, but look into the legalities. If the owner comes back and pays the back taxes and fees within a certain timeframe, they can reclaim the property and you lose whatever you spent on it. So weighing out how much you're willing to lose if you try to do that is important. Most states have some sort of pro bono Legal Services where you can ask specific real property questions and get the proper legal advice.

And then there is working in exchange for living on a farm--not the same as owning but some people basically lease out their operation in exchange for you doing the work there. You get the home, a vehicle, equipment, etc but you don't own it. It can be a way to get some experience, which you could use later to get a loan to start your own agro related business. I used to see adverts for this in Mother Earth News, and there are newsletters/papers in shops in towns that will have ads like this.

Lots of ways to either find land or start using land before you have yours, sometimes just talking with people involved in things like beekeeping or small scale farming can lead to info or a connection to someone who has what you're looking for.

Happy searching!!

I have been buying land to live on for many years.

Our first several properties have all been sold to buy other properties.

I've never read any books on this.  I do use realtor.com and have looked at other websites and always go back to realtor.com.

I have found that the best buys are properties with older homes, especially fixer-uppers.

These properties come with utilities which is why these properties are the best buys.  It costs a lot of money to dig wells and have electricity brought in.

Much of the details have to do with the person making the purchase.  I find a lack of water and a lack of trees to be a deal breaker.  There are many people here who would not agree with me.  In the 70s a book came out called Country Women ....the first chapter or two had good information on a propterty search.  

A typical land search would begin with your own "requirements" ... what do you need, what do you want, etc.

We needed to escape the heat, the population, the lack of public lands, and so on in TX; we wanted trees, acreage, rural, no nearby neighbors, little to no restrictions, and so on, which led us to western states, which led us to CO.

On top of that, as this was our first homestead rodeo, we went from raw land to a full, mortgage-free, off-grid homestead. Took about 5 years, and we've lived on it for 5 years or more now. So, we had to put in all kinds of infrastructure, and learn how to do everything. Much more to do ...

We learned how to build things fast in CO, as there is a short building season each year; it also had to be built right (for our area), to hold up to extreme winter conditions. We already knew we would be off-grid, because the grid kept giving us grief everywhere we went in life. We knew we would be mortgage-free, because of all the madness around mortgages, codes, insurance, etc.

We got there ... mortgage-free and off-grid ... wasn't easy, but was possible. And then, someone (you know who you are) had to put up this website, and introduce us to Permaculture. Now, we've got to both understand it, and overlay it onto the 40 acres. Thanks a lot (but, many thanks as well!) ...

So, from the above, just start making lists of everything you want ... reads lots of homestead materials *and* permaculture materials. Integrate them in your mind (to avoid our mistake), and then start drawing up the perfect site plan that accommodates it all. A virtual exercise ...

Finally, start looking, in almost every state, for areas that *allow* you to do everything you want. My guess is that, depending on your requirements, it won't be the cities or densely populated areas. It won't be highly restrictive areas, with zoning, hoa's, codes, etc. Replace your virtual site plan with acreage or sites in those states that fit the requirements.

Look around in Google Earth first ... but then drive there, if at all possible, as nothing beats seeing it in person. Once all the ducks are in a row (and those critters are hard to get lined up), make your offer on that perfect piece of land ... now all of your work will hopefully transfer over perfectly.

Hope this helps ...

Here is an article from Australia on the matter
buying-farm-land-top-tips-small-farmers
Anne says she did not read any books on the matter, but I have found things may happen sooner if you do.
As John Dean says, lack of water is a deal breaker.
I would also add notes about soil, which way the block slopes and access.
Annes point about connected services is important to just make it easier and often better value.

Hi James,

Besides resources that other have mentioned, if you are in the US, in general, commercial sites such as Zillow, Realtor, Redfin, etc. are a good place to start. Also Craigslist, still, believe it or not. Also, for the New England area (MA, VT, NH, ME, CT, RI), you can try New England Farm Finder, which is great because it shows not only places for sale, but also those with alternative arrangements like lease, jobs, etc.

I'd recommend starting first with identifying which region/area/state etc. you want to live in. For each of those locales, there might be unique resources beyond the list above that you can look into as well, including local Facebook groups for towns/areas that you're interested in.

We just bought our place recently after almost two years of searching and about fifteen rejected offers. If you could find something that you could comfortably lease, own outright without a mortgage, or work in exchange for housing, that would probably be much less painful than what we went through. The key is to keep looking, reading/learning from sites like this and others who have done it, and start as soon as the thought that you might one day be interested occurs to you -- which is what you're doing now, and that's awesome!

Good luck!

Lily

Something to keep in mind, off-grid properties can be difficult to get loans for. Other people had made offers on the property that we bought but they couldn't acquire funding. We came in with cash and got it.

Hi James,

A point I consider is how far is the property from building supplies, groceries, and medical resources.   This is largely a personal choice.  I have always tried to be within 10 miles of a community with basics, 30 miles of a community with some big box options, and 100 miles of a larger city with serious medical  providers.

John F Dean wrote:Hi James,

A point I consider is how far is the property from building supplies, groceries, and medical resources.   This is largely a personal choice.  I have always tried to be within 10 miles of a community with basics, 30 miles of a community with some big box options, and 100 miles of a larger city with serious medical  providers.

Yes, I am a half hour away from basic supplies and an hour away from a median sized city. That's an 'at least' for me personally. I'd prefer to never need anything medical, but you never know.

I was going through the list of ads on permies a few weeks ago and saw one for landsearch.com. Is there something about landsearch.com which preferable over sites like, say, landwatch.com?

I would assume that being allowed to advertise on permies means it’s a decent site, right?

I've got a pinterest thread on this topic: https://www.pinterest.com/btnutrition0140/finding-a-clean-homesteading-site
It covers climate, finances, off-grid & natural building zoning, quality of life, and known toxins in the region's air, water and soil—SuperFund sites, radiation, radon, lead, heavy metals, pesticides, GMOs, fracking, smog, PM2.5 and more.

Each place has PROs and CONs, of course. So it's a matter of what you are looking for.

Jeanne Wallace wrote:I've got a pinterest thread on this topic: https://www.pinterest.com/btnutrition0140/finding-a-clean-homesteading-site
It covers climate, finances, off-grid & natural building zoning, quality of life, and known toxins in the region's air, water and soil—SuperFund sites, radiation, radon, lead, heavy metals, pesticides, GMOs, fracking, smog, PM2.5 and more.

Each place has PROs and CONs, of course. So it's a matter of what you are looking for.

That’s an impressive collection. I wish I could find a map of where building codes are lax in Michigan. I tried emailing the state code people but they said I need to contact each local agnecy for that info.

I bought the book ‘Finding & Buying Your Place In The Country’ because it is highly recommended by Rob Roy in his book ‘Mortgage Free’. The newest edition is still a bit old and I imagine some things have changed and I’d like to know what those things are.

There is a lecture from Permaculture Voices where two guys talk about buying land. One guy recommended hanging around bars in the area because in his area bars are kind of like the community center, which seems  to be the case in parts of the upper peninsula where I’m looking. He said most people he talked to knew someone who wanted to sell land. This strategy takes a bit of ground work, but it makes sense.

Is there a thread here where people just add things that might be included on a property search list? Kind of like Paul’s giant residual income strategy list. If not, should I start one? I would start by adding items I wrote down from Paul’s quest for land podcast, Geoff Lawton’s property checklist, that permaculture voices presentation I mentioned, and lists I’ve seen on other threads here. It could include both property checklist items as well as methods of searching and communication strategies. What do you think?

Also, I’d still like to know if anyone has used landsearch.com and why they might be preferable over others like Landwatch.com

Keith wrote:

"That’s an impressive collection. I wish I could find a map of where building codes are lax in Michigan. I tried emailing the state code people but they said I need to contact each local agency for that info."

My trick for quickly guess-timating building codes across a state is to run quick real estate searches (via zillow, for example) for features that wouldn't be permitted in counties with stringent building codes. It's not foolproof, but it's quicker than contacting each country. I'll run a keyword search for "straw bale," "earthbag," "cordwood," "off-grid" and similar keywords.

Several "natural building" blogs and groups also have the skinny on codes across counties.

This might help narrow it down to a handful of counties, then you can contact these for greater detail. I've also found it helpful for finding areas with like-minded neighbors!

Found mine of all places, on Facebook Marketplace as a "For Sale By Owner"

I used the term "acres" in my search, as I was looking for more than just a building lot.

We were working with a realtor and I was scouring all the real estate sites, but after visiting about half a dozen of their suggestions we still didn't find something that fit.

I had some anxiety about doing the deal with the owners and no realtor involved, but decided to drive out and check out the property one morning after having a nice phone conversation with the owner (who lived out of town). I liked what I saw, and a week later the owner met me and mom there and we all walked the place together, went over the surveyed plat paper, and discussed how it all would go down.

I know a lot of people don't like Facebook (myself included) but the marketplace is an amazing spot to find what you need...Craigslist used to be my go-to but there are a lot of scams and limited postings over the last few years on the site, so it's worth creating a FB account just for that access!

My land, and several of my tractor attachments have come from it so far.

Facebook is only bad if you engage with bad peole.
I use it extensivly to catch at with people all around the world, its great.
Marketplace is a good source of 'stuff'.

Great suggestions. I recently became aware of a blog that may be useful for local information on codes. I’ll spend the next few weeks reading, contacting people, etc. and then I’ll drive up north to test it out many of these strategies. I may just camp, or may find a place to rent. I’m in Grand Rapids, which is too far away from the UP to make day trips. I really feel I should just be staying up there to get a good feel for each section, each local community I investigate. I may camp or I may rent a place. Camping would give me an opportunity to test out and get comfortable with the lifestyle I’ll be living while building a temporary shelter. That way when I find the property I’ll already be in the groove of my camp setup and worked out most of the major kinks, knock on wood.

I believe that looking for like minded people is something I will consider a higher priority now. I didn’t really think it was possible until I took greater interest in cordwood building and discovered how many people in the UP have made cordwood homes.

Facebook marketplace is also something I hadn’t considered. Thanks for all these suggestions.

Thank you for initiating this post. I’m in the same boat with all the same questions. So all the recommendations are super helpful. I’ve been perusing realtor.com and Zillow just to keep an eye on the market and what’s available out there. Something I discovered not that long ago was that Zillow has a for sale by owner option. On my phone app it’s the second tab at the top that says “other”. It’s opened a whole new world on searching. I will also get back on FB only to peruse marketplace. And I’ll check out those land watch and land search sites also. Meantime I’m learning as much as I can from sites like permies and homesteaders with vlogs while I get closer to being able to own a little piece of dirt I can convert into an amazing paradise of soil. With a cozy home, of course. ;-)

I wish I had known more about invasive species prior to purchasing our 27 acres three years ago.  I have learned A LOT about them since that time.  Lol....

Joshua - I have learned a lot as well about our invasive species but they don't seem to be as much of a problem as I thought they were. As we've stopped mowing and disturbing the soil so much, they have really stopped being so prevalent. I encourage some weeds that can outcompete the ones we don't like.

I did some initial research of my own, and found LaMar and his solarcabin channel on YT. He has a two-part video series where he discusses topics like managing expectations when buying cheap land, auction websites, researching local building/zoning code, and so on. I found his two-part series very informative. Hopefully it will be useful to you, provided you have about an hour and a half to spare.

Here's a link to part 1, where he discusses the basics and the 'intro' topics.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wRNftek7WNg

Part 2 seems more interesting, as he shows a few websites to demonstrate how to find affordable land parcels (that might need a lot of work). He also discusses right-of-way and having egress to a property you purchase.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LiYNRNoUDSQ

A lot of great information has been given. I would like to add that if you are planning on being offgrid, make sure the property will work for your choice of energy production. i.e. wind requires you to be above the treetops. Would be hard to do in a pine forest. Solar needs a south facing area for the panels. My favorite is micro hydro but it needs a year round stream with enough "head" (incline) to operate.

We ended up building on a medium size river which is great for foraging. This is worth considering if available.

There is going to be compromises. Prioritize your requirements and decide up front which are written in stone and which ones you can work around.

Once you locate the area you want to grow in, try to connect with local permaculturists.  They may know of someone who wants to sell or bequeath land. For instance, our ultimate plan for our land is to find a younger person or family to live here and eventually inherit our place. Paul's OTIS program (I might be getting the same wrong) is about connecting older land owners with younger people looking for land.

Oops sorry, the correct name is SKIP!

Lots of good advice has been given, I will echo some in my experience.
  Internet searches for property to identify possible that meet your requirements.

  Make a list of what you want and prioritize list. You may not get everything so you need to know what is most important to you.

   Identify suitable property and do the leg work. Visit property you are interested in with agent listed with, they  can be a wealth of local knowledge. In my case extremely helpful on matters not even related to the sale of the property.

   Do not get discouraged, I lost a property that meet nearly all of my requirements only to find one that was nearly perfect! Better location, traded small stream for a River, already had a very good well and a serviceable small house until I built a new one.

It usually doesn’t happen overnight......see point above.

   Trust you instincts....Spirit knows best!

Good point Scott.  Regarding property searches, I read somewhere that “the dream” comes first.   First decide what you want. Also decide what you will not do without.

I see so many good ideas as to where and how to find property on this list. There are some I don't see here. Our world is quickly changing as we all see on the news. That's why we all want to do our own thing and create our own safe space of course !
  Something I didn't notice in the ones I viewed was considering location as to the trending world views. Meaning.... politics. No matter what side of the fence a person is on in today's crazy totally upside down world we are seeing the political views of our government and others influence our daily lives. Depending on where your located an how you feel about things that can be a good thing or a terrible thing !
  No matter what your thoughts and beliefs are on politics and in some cases religion it is a good idea to live in a area that is similar in your way of doing and thinking about things. If you get a place that is totally different than what you feel like your beliefs are it can cause a lot of stress for you and your family that you don't need and may be so much less stress if you live in a area that is more along your families ideas and beliefs.
   If you really want to go crazy you may want to avoid locations within so many miles of or down wind of nuclear reactors and possible government targets that could effect your families safety if things went sideways some day.
  Other than that..... someplace you can easily grow food, good weather temps, moisture and depth of good growing dirt. Comfortable temps in cold or hot weather so you can afford any utilities you may require because the politics are determining that in some areas.  
   Maybe room for relatives close by or close to relatives to have the moral support and help if needed in those crazy times we all have sometimes.
Love
Ranchmama

For over the past decade I've been casually looking for properties. So far, I bought one, put an offer on another one (and thankfully it was rejected), and am about halfway through the tax-sale process for acquiring a third (fingers crossed the owners don't pay their back taxes). My searches are fairly narrow in geographic scope (~15 minutes from where I currently live) so I have it set so that I receive alerts from Zillow on new properties that meet my criteria. I also have called a few "for sale by owner" signs with no luck, and I've attended the county tax sale auctions.

I suppose since your thread is here on the premies blog, you're interested in homesteading or farming with permaculture.  So far the thread seems like an excellent course in starting out.  I'd like to add three things. 1. Climate today gone tomorrow.  Be sure you've researched best scientific models of future climate and extreme weather (i.e. heat waves, fires of both forest and community, droughts, floods, tornados, hurricanes, etc.)  2. Location, location, location for all the previous reasons but also add soil type and quality, planting zone, and seasonal light durations and intensity. 3. Water, water, water - quantity and quality available as rain, streams, or well water; same for public utility water if available, and 4) I did say four things didn't I? yeah I think I did... It's always nice to know if you're going to get along with your neighbors, especially for working together during times of crises.  Good luck in your searches!  

In today's climate, I would suggest that local politics if you're rural aren't going to matter so much, in the US at least. Don't expect them to help but they aren't organized enough to really be a threat. Society is breaking down. Don't rely on current climate conditions, especially in Europe, if the gulf stream changes you are screwed. And you are too far north to really grow enough crops. Things are going to get bad, I don't know what else to say.

Yes, I happen to own the book Country Women.  I find the books and magazines written during this time to be the best as far as providing the pros and cons of everything.  I just bought volumes 1 - 125 of the original Mother Earth News as the knowledge level is invaluable.

What I would do for some land! I am pretty much poor compared to most Americans. I recently got into hand tool woodworking for money but wood is ridiculously expensive right now. I don't like society much and I just want to peace out to the woods, harvest some green wood and make some simple structures while I get a food forest going... Unfortunately that's illegal and I can't afford the alternative.

I've searched high and low. I might have to find someone that is willing to finance some.

I've got pretty much every high end hand tool I'd need to build a log house (why I am poor)... from multiple axes to lifetime chisels, a froe, adze, timber chisels, hand saws, planes, bit braces, etc... just no land.

A great resource Book:
Finding And Buying Your Place In The Country by Les Scher 1974

Best Wishes

When I was searching for property, I made use of GIS software. - https://qgis.org/en/site/  QGIS is open source and free to download.  GIS stands for Geographical Image System.  It is used by most government offices for planning.  So you can get GIS data maps from many different sources and then overlay them in QGIS.

I got maps for landfills, drilling maps, power plants, flood plains, utilities, rainfall, and many more.

Really made the whole process a lot easier.

Hope this can help someone else.

Marc