Spinning Wheel Question

I am a new member. I refinish antiques (10+ year hobby) and am currently working on the spinning wheel in the first picture below. I do not know what the part in the second picture is called nor how it is used with the spinning wheel. Thank you. ... Gary

I believe the second part is simply called a "yarn winder." It...well...winds yarn, lol.

I asked Mr. Google who said, "The orifice is the opening at the bottom of the flyer that allows the newly spun yarn to wind onto the bobbin."

Hello and welcome.

I do a lot of repair of vintage and antique spinning wheels.  It's loads of fun.  Many of the wheels I use regularly are about 200 years old and have another couple of hundred years worth of use left in them.  

The biggest problem is fixing the mistakes from poor restoration.  Putting glue on things that need to move, using grease instead of fine oil (sewing machine or finer - having a thin oil is vital as it not only lubricates but also cleans out the fluff).  That sort of thing.  

The wheel looks like it can easily be working again.  Just needs a bit of fine-tuning and cleaning.  

For me the first step is to find out if there is anything historical about this wheel.  For example, some wheels have a very high value like the JO wheels.  But the paint and patina are a big part of that value and I've seen several where they aggressively cleaned off that ugly yellow paint thinking it's a modern addition only to find out it was original and that they now have some pretty firewood.  

The Spinning wheel Sleuth is a good place to learn more about wheel history and tradition.  

The Big Book of Handspinning is a great primer on wheel mechanics.  He deep dives into all sorts of math.

Or you can post more photos and I can see if I recognize anything about it.

Once we know if it's not of historical value (aka, more valuable broken than fixed), the next step is to decide the goal.  Make pretty, make working, make pretty and working.  Make pretty in an original way or make pretty in a modern aesthetic.  Lots of options.  

The second piece is called a reel, blocker, or yarn winder.  A more modern word is skeiner.  It's used for removing the yarn from the wheel and many production spinners will dry the yarn on this after finishing the yarn.  It can also be used for reeling silk.  The key thing here

Jordan Holland wrote:I believe the second part is simply called a "yarn winder." It...well...winds yarn, lol.

Thank you. A straightforward but helpful response.

Anne Miller wrote:I asked Mr. Google who said, "The orifice is the opening at the bottom of the flyer that allows the newly spun yarn to wind onto the bobbin."

Thank you, Anne. I did a lot of searching but never got that much detailed feedback.

r ranson wrote:Hello and welcome.

I do a lot of repair of vintage and antique spinning wheels.  It's loads of fun.  Many of the wheels I use regularly are about 200 years old and have another couple of hundred years worth of use left in them.  

The biggest problem is fixing the mistakes from poor restoration.  Putting glue on things that need to move, using grease instead of fine oil (sewing machine or finer - having a thin oil is vital as it not only lubricates but also cleans out the fluff).  That sort of thing.  

The wheel looks like it can easily be working again.  Just needs a bit of fine-tuning and cleaning.  

For me the first step is to find out if there is anything historical about this wheel.  For example, some wheels have a very high value like the JO wheels.  But the paint and patina are a big part of that value and I've seen several where they aggressively cleaned off that ugly yellow paint thinking it's a modern addition only to find out it was original and that they now have some pretty firewood.  

The Spinning wheel Sleuth is a good place to learn more about wheel history and tradition.  

The Big Book of Handspinning is a great primer on wheel mechanics.  He deep dives into all sorts of math.

Or you can post more photos and I can see if I recognize anything about it.

Once we know if it's not of historical value (aka, more valuable broken than fixed), the next step is to decide the goal.  Make pretty, make working, make pretty and working.  Make pretty in an original way or make pretty in a modern aesthetic.  Lots of options.  

The second piece is called a reel, blocker, or yarn winder.  A more modern word is skeiner.  It's used for removing the yarn from the wheel and many production spinners will dry the yarn on this after finishing the yarn.  It can also be used for reeling silk.  The key thing here

Wow! So much feedback. Thank you very much. I need to digest tomorrow and provide more feedback.

Gary Fera wrote:

r ranson wrote:Hello and welcome.

I do a lot of repair of vintage and antique spinning wheels.  It's loads of fun.  Many of the wheels I use regularly are about 200 years old and have another couple of hundred years worth of use left in them.  

The biggest problem is fixing the mistakes from poor restoration.  Putting glue on things that need to move, using grease instead of fine oil (sewing machine or finer - having a thin oil is vital as it not only lubricates but also cleans out the fluff).  That sort of thing.  

The wheel looks like it can easily be working again.  Just needs a bit of fine-tuning and cleaning.  

For me the first step is to find out if there is anything historical about this wheel.  For example, some wheels have a very high value like the JO wheels.  But the paint and patina are a big part of that value and I've seen several where they aggressively cleaned off that ugly yellow paint thinking it's a modern addition only to find out it was original and that they now have some pretty firewood.  

The Spinning wheel Sleuth is a good place to learn more about wheel history and tradition.  

The Big Book of Handspinning is a great primer on wheel mechanics.  He deep dives into all sorts of math.

Or you can post more photos and I can see if I recognize anything about it.

Once we know if it's not of historical value (aka, more valuable broken than fixed), the next step is to decide the goal.  Make pretty, make working, make pretty and working.  Make pretty in an original way or make pretty in a modern aesthetic.  Lots of options.  

The second piece is called a reel, blocker, or yarn winder.  A more modern word is skeiner.  It's used for removing the yarn from the wheel and many production spinners will dry the yarn on this after finishing the yarn.  It can also be used for reeling silk.  The key thing here

Wow! So much feedback. Thank you very much. I need to digest tomorrow and provide more feedback.

Wed. Aug. 31 8:22AM

Again, thank you for the detailed feedback.

The customer would like the spinning wheel refinished and functional.

With 10+ years refinishing experience, this being project #215, I am fairly sure I can manage the refinishing aspect. I have only started assessing the old finish that is present and how to remove it. I am planning to not do aggressive sanding. There is a lot of "texture" (paint and patina) to the wood, and I want to preserve that.

I have no experience with or knowledge of spinning wheels and will no doubt have questions as I go and will post such questions on this blog.

Thanks for the selection of names for the second piece.

I have posted some additional pictures that might be helpful. One picture shows that there are in fact 2 yarn winders (small one and large one). The other picture shows that there are a couple of loose small parts that I need to re-install but have not yet figured out where they go.

Gary

The long piece is the footman; it, along with a bit of leather, connect the wheel and the treadle. Th other two pieces look to be part of the mother-of-all. See diagram here.

Restoring a spinning wheel is a bit different from restoring furniture—it’s a machine and the restoration needs to take that into consideration. Highly recommend checking out a book on spinning from the local library and/or watching some videos on spinning wheel restoration before going too much further.

The wheel looks like it is mounted backwards. The pitman will go from the end of the skinny board sticking out on the bottom (tied with leather thongs) to the crank on the wheel (which appears to be on the wrong side currently.) The spool assembly is rotated 90 degrees. It needs to face the broken maiden area, and each end rides in a leather bearing. Hopefully the broken maiden will fit together well enough that it can be fixed.

1)
Before going any further, have a closer look for any maker marks.  Use a UV light if you have any as this will help show up if the maker mark is in ink.  Scratches in the bottom of the bench or dent marks are often used as maker marks.  

I've seen too often someone "repairing" or "restoring" a wheel that is worth thousands (or tens of thousands) in crap condition, now looking beautiful but not worth more than $20 for a prop.  

more photos from different angles and closer would help as sometimes the camera can see writing our eyes can't.

It's unlikely to be anything, but well worth spending a day or two having a look in different lights.  

2)
Dust off the library card and borrow The Big Book of Handspinnig by Amos.   They should have it, but if not, they can interlibrary loan as this is a foundation guide to spinning wheels with diagrams by a woodworker.  The author is the best repairer and maker of spinning wheels of the 20th century and writes for both woodworkers and spinsters.  

3)
Spinning wheel repair is not much like woodworking and much more like machine repair.  Many techniques that are common sense to a woodworker can make a wheel function poorly or not at all.  Be cautious with your confidence.  

4)
a good place to start while you are learning wheel repair is to turn more bobbins.  If the wheel is going to be used, the spinster will want at least four well-ballanced bobbins, especially for modern-day spinning styles.  (I personally like a bushing in each end of the bobbin hole where it fits on the flyer shaft but have a look at how this wheel was done and maybe take inspiration from that.)

This gives us some names to work from https://www.joyofhandspinning.com/wheel-parts.shtml

We want to look at the Motherofall (flyer, bobbin, and maiden assembly)  

Some more words for us thanks to: https://nzspinningwheels.wordpress.com/spinning-wheel-ailments/



This picture is set up as a scotch tension wheel, but it's originally designed like yours, as a double drive wheel.  But don't worry about the bands yet.  Lots of fun stuff to do with wood first.  

Your wheel has a strong 1920s vibe, probably eastern North American made.  (the spinningwheel slueth will help give a better date - I suggest recommending this to the client - if you are doing more wheel repair in the future, they have their back catalogue on thumbdrives which is awesome!).  Although the split table in your wheel is interesting and makes me wonder if it's not late 1940s.  Keep looking for that maker's mark.  

This wheel is a double drive saxony wheel (words you will need later)

What we want to do is to remove the whorl from the flyer.  This is where the age comes into it.  At this age, there is a 50/49/1% chance that whorl untwists from the flyer shaft clockwise (aka opposite to modern undoing twisty things) (50% chance) or counterclockwise (aka, what we think of as normal) (49% chance) or comes of without twisting (not common pre 1950, but I have seen it earlier, especially in New Zealand wheels) (1% chance).  

It is highly likely this will be caked on with old, solidified oil.  Warmth (not heat) and gentle working back and forth will find out which direction the whorl unscrews.  The flyer assembly (flyer, whorl and bobbin) is by far the hardest part to repair and most important to get the balance right so I usually take a few days to get the whorl off the shaft as I hate having to fix this.   If this isn't perfect, the wheel will be difficult to use and the client will get frustrated.   When I'm spinning the flyer is going around 30-100 revolutions a second so it's highly noticeable when the balance is off.  

That should get you started.  

looking at the wheel, you probably won't need any glue or woodfiller whatsoever.  It will be tempting, but try to avoid it.

When it comes to choosing chemicals, it is possible this is finished with real shellac so do a sample somewhere first.  If so, I often find a rub of alcohol will freshen up the finish better than stripping and refinishing - a lot less work too.  

Shawn Foster wrote:The long piece is the footman; it, along with a bit of leather, connect the wheel and the treadle. Th other two pieces look to be part of the mother-of-all. See diagram here.

Restoring a spinning wheel is a bit different from restoring furniture—it’s a machine and the restoration needs to take that into consideration. Highly recommend checking out a book on spinning from the local library and/or watching some videos on spinning wheel restoration before going too much further.

Shawn, the information you provided is very helpful ... especially the diagram showing part names.

I have looked at a few short videos. This is very different than antique refinishing. I assumed that before I started and now I am starting to appreciate just how different this journey will be.

Gary

Jordan Holland wrote:The wheel looks like it is mounted backwards. The pitman will go from the end of the skinny board sticking out on the bottom (tied with leather thongs) to the crank on the wheel (which appears to be on the wrong side currently.) The spool assembly is rotated 90 degrees. It needs to face the broken maiden area, and each end rides in a leather bearing. Hopefully the broken maiden will fit together well enough that it can be fixed.

Jordan, if I popped the wheel in backwards then it is a very good thing that I discovered this site to get the help that I need. And the crank on the wrong side. Snickers are in order, and I deserve them. I do realize that I have lots to learn, and I am willing to learn. Thank you.

Gary

r ranson wrote:1)
Before going any further, have a closer look for any maker marks.  Use a UV light if you have any as this will help show up if the maker mark is in ink.  Scratches in the bottom of the bench or dent marks are often used as maker marks.  

I've seen too often someone "repairing" or "restoring" a wheel that is worth thousands (or tens of thousands) in crap condition, now looking beautiful but not worth more than $20 for a prop.  

more photos from different angles and closer would help as sometimes the camera can see writing our eyes can't.

It's unlikely to be anything, but well worth spending a day or two having a look in different lights.  

2)
Dust off the library card and borrow The Big Book of Handspinnig by Amos.   They should have it, but if not, they can interlibrary loan as this is a foundation guide to spinning wheels with diagrams by a woodworker.  The author is the best repairer and maker of spinning wheels of the 20th century and writes for both woodworkers and spinsters.  

3)
Spinning wheel repair is not much like woodworking and much more like machine repair.  Many techniques that are common sense to a woodworker can make a wheel function poorly or not at all.  Be cautious with your confidence.  

4)
a good place to start while you are learning wheel repair is to turn more bobbins.  If the wheel is going to be used, the spinster will want at least four well-ballanced bobbins, especially for modern-day spinning styles.  (I personally like a bushing in each end of the bobbin hole where it fits on the flyer shaft but have a look at how this wheel was done and maybe take inspiration from that.)

This gives us some names to work from https://www.joyofhandspinning.com/wheel-parts.shtml

We want to look at the Motherofall (flyer, bobbin, and maiden assembly)  

Some more words for us thanks to: https://nzspinningwheels.wordpress.com/spinning-wheel-ailments/



This picture is set up as a scotch tension wheel, but it's originally designed like yours, as a double drive wheel.  But don't worry about the bands yet.  Lots of fun stuff to do with wood first.  

Your wheel has a strong 1920s vibe, probably eastern North American made.  (the spinningwheel slueth will help give a better date - I suggest recommending this to the client - if you are doing more wheel repair in the future, they have their back catalogue on thumbdrives which is awesome!).  Although the split table in your wheel is interesting and makes me wonder if it's not late 1940s.  Keep looking for that maker's mark.  

This wheel is a double drive saxony wheel (words you will need later)

What we want to do is to remove the whorl from the flyer.  This is where the age comes into it.  At this age, there is a 50/49/1% chance that whorl untwists from the flyer shaft clockwise (aka opposite to modern undoing twisty things) (50% chance) or counterclockwise (aka, what we think of as normal) (49% chance) or comes of without twisting (not common pre 1950, but I have seen it earlier, especially in New Zealand wheels) (1% chance).  

It is highly likely this will be caked on with old, solidified oil.  Warmth (not heat) and gentle working back and forth will find out which direction the whorl unscrews.  The flyer assembly (flyer, whorl and bobbin) is by far the hardest part to repair and most important to get the balance right so I usually take a few days to get the whorl off the shaft as I hate having to fix this.   If this isn't perfect, the wheel will be difficult to use and the client will get frustrated.   When I'm spinning the flyer is going around 30-100 revolutions a second so it's highly noticeable when the balance is off.  

That should get you started.  

looking at the wheel, you probably won't need any glue or woodfiller whatsoever.  It will be tempting, but try to avoid it.

When it comes to choosing chemicals, it is possible this is finished with real shellac so do a sample somewhere first.  If so, I often find a rub of alcohol will freshen up the finish better than stripping and refinishing - a lot less work too.  

You are being incredibly kind to a fellow Canadian (I live in Sault Ste. Marie, Ontario). I would appreciate knowing your name if that is not too forward to ask.

The amount of knowledge and information is overwhelming to a spinning wheel neophyte. I have read your second large response twice and there is still more for me to digest. I will respond tomorrow with comments interspersed in your input because there are so many issues hit upon. This is a hobby and I have 3 other open projects so finding ample time to digest everything is slowing me down.

"Thank you" does seem to do justice to the help and guidance you are providing.

Gary

r ranson wrote:1)
Before going any further, have a closer look for any maker marks.  Use a UV light if you have any as this will help show up if the maker mark is in ink.  Scratches in the bottom of the bench or dent marks are often used as maker marks.  

I've seen too often someone "repairing" or "restoring" a wheel that is worth thousands (or tens of thousands) in crap condition, now looking beautiful but not worth more than $20 for a prop.  

more photos from different angles and closer would help as sometimes the camera can see writing our eyes can't.

It's unlikely to be anything, but well worth spending a day or two having a look in different lights.  

2)
Dust off the library card and borrow The Big Book of Handspinnig by Amos.   They should have it, but if not, they can interlibrary loan as this is a foundation guide to spinning wheels with diagrams by a woodworker.  The author is the best repairer and maker of spinning wheels of the 20th century and writes for both woodworkers and spinsters.  

3)
Spinning wheel repair is not much like woodworking and much more like machine repair.  Many techniques that are common sense to a woodworker can make a wheel function poorly or not at all.  Be cautious with your confidence.  

4)
a good place to start while you are learning wheel repair is to turn more bobbins.  If the wheel is going to be used, the spinster will want at least four well-ballanced bobbins, especially for modern-day spinning styles.  (I personally like a bushing in each end of the bobbin hole where it fits on the flyer shaft but have a look at how this wheel was done and maybe take inspiration from that.)

This gives us some names to work from https://www.joyofhandspinning.com/wheel-parts.shtml

We want to look at the Motherofall (flyer, bobbin, and maiden assembly)  

Some more words for us thanks to: https://nzspinningwheels.wordpress.com/spinning-wheel-ailments/



This picture is set up as a scotch tension wheel, but it's originally designed like yours, as a double drive wheel.  But don't worry about the bands yet.  Lots of fun stuff to do with wood first.  

Your wheel has a strong 1920s vibe, probably eastern North American made.  (the spinningwheel slueth will help give a better date - I suggest recommending this to the client - if you are doing more wheel repair in the future, they have their back catalogue on thumbdrives which is awesome!).  Although the split table in your wheel is interesting and makes me wonder if it's not late 1940s.  Keep looking for that maker's mark.  

This wheel is a double drive saxony wheel (words you will need later)

What we want to do is to remove the whorl from the flyer.  This is where the age comes into it.  At this age, there is a 50/49/1% chance that whorl untwists from the flyer shaft clockwise (aka opposite to modern undoing twisty things) (50% chance) or counterclockwise (aka, what we think of as normal) (49% chance) or comes of without twisting (not common pre 1950, but I have seen it earlier, especially in New Zealand wheels) (1% chance).  

It is highly likely this will be caked on with old, solidified oil.  Warmth (not heat) and gentle working back and forth will find out which direction the whorl unscrews.  The flyer assembly (flyer, whorl and bobbin) is by far the hardest part to repair and most important to get the balance right so I usually take a few days to get the whorl off the shaft as I hate having to fix this.   If this isn't perfect, the wheel will be difficult to use and the client will get frustrated.   When I'm spinning the flyer is going around 30-100 revolutions a second so it's highly noticeable when the balance is off.  

That should get you started.  

looking at the wheel, you probably won't need any glue or woodfiller whatsoever.  It will be tempting, but try to avoid it.

When it comes to choosing chemicals, it is possible this is finished with real shellac so do a sample somewhere first.  If so, I often find a rub of alcohol will freshen up the finish better than stripping and refinishing - a lot less work too.  

I suspect this is an unconventional way to respond to a detailed and complex set of guidance. There are so many issues addressed that I want to respond to. I hope this will be ok. My comments are in CAPITALS.   … Gary

Original second set of input from “r ranson” with my comments in CAPITALS

1)
Before going any further, have a closer look for any maker marks.  Use a UV light if you have any as this will help show up if the maker mark is in ink.  Scratches in the bottom of the bench or dent marks are often used as maker marks.

I HAD CAREFULLY CHECKED FOR MARKINGS AND FOUND NONE. I AM TRYING TO BORROW A UV LIGHT TO GET TO THE NEXT LEVEL.

I've seen too often someone "repairing" or "restoring" a wheel that is worth thousands (or tens of thousands) in crap condition, now looking beautiful but not worth more than $20 for a prop.  

more photos from different angles and closer would help as sometimes the camera can see writing our eyes can't.

It's unlikely to be anything, but well worth spending a day or two having a look in different lights.

NICE GUIDANCE HERE. THE LAST THING I WANT TO DO IS DEVALUE A TRUE ANTIQUE.

2)
Dust off the library card and borrow The Big Book of Handspinnig by Amos.   They should have it, but if not, they can interlibrary loan as this is a foundation guide to spinning wheels with diagrams by a woodworker.  The author is the best repairer and maker of spinning wheels of the 20th century and writes for both woodworkers and spinsters.  

I WAS NOT PLANNING TO GET TO THIS LEVEL OF KNOWLEDGE AND LEARNING BUT I WILL DO SOME INVESTIGATIONS.

3)
Spinning wheel repair is not much like woodworking and much more like machine repair.  Many techniques that are common sense to a woodworker can make a wheel function poorly or not at all.  Be cautious with your confidence.  

SOUND ADVICE. I SENSED THIS WOULD BE THE CASE. YOUR MESSAGE IS CLEAR AND APPRECIATED.

4)
a good place to start while you are learning wheel repair is to turn more bobbins.  If the wheel is going to be used, the spinster will want at least four well-ballanced bobbins, especially for modern-day spinning styles.  (I personally like a bushing in each end of the bobbin hole where it fits on the flyer shaft but have a look at how this wheel was done and maybe take inspiration from that.)

This gives us some names to work from https://www.joyofhandspinning.com/wheel-parts.shtml

We want to look at the Motherofall (flyer, bobbin, and maiden assembly)  

Some more words for us thanks to: https://nzspinningwheels.wordpress.com/spinning-wheel-ailments/

WAY BEYOND MY SKILL LEVEL AND INTENTIONS. I WILL TREAD CAREFULLY HERE.

This picture is set up as a scotch tension wheel, but it's originally designed like yours, as a double drive wheel.  But don't worry about the bands yet.  Lots of fun stuff to do with wood first.  

Your wheel has a strong 1920s vibe, probably eastern North American made.  (the spinningwheel slueth will help give a better date - I suggest recommending this to the client - if you are doing more wheel repair in the future, they have their back catalogue on thumbdrives which is awesome!).  Although the split table in your wheel is interesting and makes me wonder if it's not late 1940s.  Keep looking for that maker's mark.  

THE WHEEL ITSELF HAS NO NAILS OR SCREWS THAT I HAVE YET DISCOVERED … ONLY A FEW METAL RODS/JOINERS. THE YARD WINDERS HAVE LOTS OF NAILS SUGGESTING THESE ARE FROM A DIFFERENT ERA.

This wheel is a double drive saxony wheel (words you will need later)

What we want to do is to remove the whorl from the flyer.  This is where the age comes into it.  At this age, there is a 50/49/1% chance that whorl untwists from the flyer shaft clockwise (aka opposite to modern undoing twisty things) (50% chance) or counterclockwise (aka, what we think of as normal) (49% chance) or comes of without twisting (not common pre 1950, but I have seen it earlier, especially in New Zealand wheels) (1% chance).  

THIS IS UNFORESEEN TERRITORY FOR ME.

It is highly likely this will be caked on with old, solidified oil.  Warmth (not heat) and gentle working back and forth will find out which direction the whorl unscrews.  The flyer assembly (flyer, whorl and bobbin) is by far the hardest part to repair and most important to get the balance right so I usually take a few days to get the whorl off the shaft as I hate having to fix this.   If this isn't perfect, the wheel will be difficult to use and the client will get frustrated.   When I'm spinning the flyer is going around 30-100 revolutions a second so it's highly noticeable when the balance is off.  

That should get you started.  

THIS IS SCARY.

looking at the wheel, you probably won't need any glue or woodfiller whatsoever.  It will be tempting, but try to avoid it.

THIS WOULD BE A NEW APPROACH FOR ME.

When it comes to choosing chemicals, it is possible this is finished with real shellac so do a sample somewhere first.  If so, I often find a rub of alcohol will freshen up the finish better than stripping and refinishing - a lot less work too.  

I WILL DO SOME TESTING TO ASSESS WHAT THE ORIGINAL FINISH IS. THE YOUTUBE VIDEO BELOW IS INTRIGUING. COULD THIS BE A VALID APPROACH?

(16) Spinning Wheel restoration - YouTube

I didn't get a link to a video

r ranson wrote:I didn't get a link to a video

Hopefully this will work.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dD8LyQUrVZw

He's working with wood that doesn't have a protective layer on it.  Naked wood or wood that has been stained loves this kind of treatment.  It looks like his wheel is very thirsty.

Yours looks like it has a finish.  

If the finish is real Shellac then it should dissolve in alcohol.  



I like linseed oil if the wood is naked or dry.  I'll spend a few weeks applying this once or twice a day until the wood is no longer thirsty, then apply a wax layer.  

Since I love to keep as much of the age as possible when restoring wood, I will often give a very light clean (being careful to do a test first and not to let moisture pool in one spot) with a mix of murphy oil soap and water.

Give it a day to dry.

Then if it still needs something decided if simply using a furniture wax (tried and true at Lee Valley - the original one which is just beeswax and linseed oil or even better, Ashford Wheel and Loom Wax which you can get at most yarn shops only needs one application and can be polished immediately and not having to wait a few hours like tried and true.)  

Alternatively, if it is real Shellac, then I get some denatured alcohol from the DIY shop and steel wool that is OOOO (4-o's or finer) and, working in small sections and quickly, dissolve the finish and redistribute it.  

The second option brings it up a treat and makes it glow.  It also puts a lot of the dirt into the divots and cracks which makes the patina look amazing while helping the grain of the wood shine through.  linseed is especially nice because it oxidizes and firms and provides an extra layer of protection that many other oils don't give as easily.  

r ranson wrote:He's working with wood that doesn't have a protective layer on it.  Naked wood or wood that has been stained loves this kind of treatment.  It looks like his wheel is very thirsty.

Yours looks like it has a finish.  

If the finish is real Shellac then it should dissolve in alcohol.  



I like linseed oil if the wood is naked or dry.  I'll spend a few weeks applying this once or twice a day until the wood is no longer thirsty, then apply a wax layer.  

Since I love to keep as much of the age as possible when restoring wood, I will often give a very light clean (being careful to do a test first and not to let moisture pool in one spot) with a mix of murphy oil soap and water.

Give it a day to dry.

Then if it still needs something decided if simply using a furniture wax (tried and true at Lee Valley - the original one which is just beeswax and linseed oil or even better, Ashford Wheel and Loom Wax which you can get at most yarn shops only needs one application and can be polished immediately and not having to wait a few hours like tried and true.)  

Alternatively, if it is real Shellac, then I get some denatured alcohol from the DIY shop and steel wool that is OOOO (4-o's or finer) and, working in small sections and quickly, dissolve the finish and redistribute it.  

The second option brings it up a treat and makes it glow.  It also puts a lot of the dirt into the divots and cracks which makes the patina look amazing while helping the grain of the wood shine through.  linseed is especially nice because it oxidizes and firms and provides an extra layer of protection that many other oils don't give as easily.  

I appreciate all your comments and suggestions about dealing with the finish on my customer's spinning wheel. I am going to focus on this aspect of the project for a while. I will provide feedback and/or ask more questions as I go. I have posted some additional pictures which will show the condition of the finish that I am dealing with. Thank you again.

r ranson wrote:
chance that whorl untwists from the flyer shaft clockwise (aka opposite to modern undoing twisty things)

The reason for reverse screw threading is functional (not age-related). It's required when a part is subject to some counter-clockwise twisting in normal use and standard threading would tend to loosen the part.

David Wieland wrote:

r ranson wrote:
chance that whorl untwists from the flyer shaft clockwise (aka opposite to modern undoing twisty things)

The reason for reverse screw threading is functional (not age-related). It's required when a part is subject to some counter-clockwise twisting in normal use and standard threading would tend to loosen the part.

Sort of.

The right and left screws on the flyer shaft have clear lines of time and place that we can follow and often use to help discover the history of the wheel.  As I said, the Spinning Wheel Sleuth is a good starting place to learn about this and they cite other resources if you want to geek out about it.  

There are two main issues in play here (and many smaller ones I'm not going to dive into).

To start with, the standardization of 'righty tighty' doesn't come into full swing until the 1800s in "the west" and globally until the 1900s.  It roughly follows mechanized production and mass manufacturing of fasteners like screws.  

However, wheel production - especially pre-1920s - often keeps with local traditions as this part of the wheel would be forged by hand by the wheelwright or local crafts person.  Circa 1880, we do see some wheel parts being mass manufactured, particularly near New England, but this is mostly for the Walking or Great wheel's motherofall and acceleration unit.  Not so much the flyer wheels like we have here.  

Local traditions and the spread of industrial manufacturing influences the direction of the screw.

Secondly, there is the use case as, depending on the part of the world, the spinsters might be spinning mostly clockwise, widdershins or, like is more common in these days, both.  

Some of this will be influenced by local traditions, however, in Europe we see wool spun with a Z twist, which is produced clockwise on a wheel, and linen is often spun with a S twist, or widdershins on a wheel.  In pre-industrial times, they are usually spinning for weaving, so the yarn needs to be thin and have a fairly tight twist.  There is always worry that the whorl would come undone as the friction of the driveband might grab hold of the whorl...

However, using antique wheels, I find this doesn't happen no matter which way it spins.  So I feel this theory of 'not wanting it to come undone while spinning' doesn't hold up.  Several woodworking books from the 1920s also feel the same way I do.  I don't remember what The Big Book of Handspinning had to say on this, but I do remember he had strong opinions.  

On the other hand, semi-modern wheels (1945-1990) that use a screw to attach the whorl do come undone and easily if spun the 'wrong' way.  These have been manufactured, usually with machine threading (quite fine) which seems to make them extra susceptible to untwisting... but that's a rant for a different thread.

Back to time.

As manufactured parts become available, so too does industrially manufactured clothing.  The need to spin our own clothes diminishes and there becomes a break in the craft between the generations.  We see this in England in the late 1700s and in North America between 1830 and 1900s (with a few pockets holding out).  

When the resurgence in the craft comes along, in the 1920s, 1930s, 1945, 1974, 1984-ish, late 1990s, etc... the people who pick up the craft of spinning aren't following local traditions (for anyone who wants to deep dive into those dates, there is a direct correlation between economic and social upheaval and the resurgence of textile crafts).  The local wheelwrights are no more.  So the local building traditions are gone - along with the 'reverse' threading.  

What's more, they have a very different style of spinning.  They are no longer spinning yarn so as not to be naked.  They are spinning for fun, profit, those great big textile works banks used to buy in the 1970s... They are also spinning more for knitting and crochet, so plying (spinning both ways) yarn is more common.  Thus the push on whorl... if they use a whorl at all.  

We don't see much of that push on whorl until the 1974 resurgence of spinning, although if memory serves Ashford does start this sooner.  

As you can see, the threading directly correlates with time and place and the history of flyer spinning wheels (as opposed to spindle spinning wheels which has a more diverse history).  Use might be part of it, but it's more complex than that.


Also, I oversimplified things a lot.  But I'm not in the mood to write that book today.  
I am, however, hoping to start a youtube project with a family member where we evaluate and restore various antique and vintage spinning wheels.  Just got to clean up the workshop first.  Should be ready with the first video middle of next year if all goes to plan.

Wow! That's an awesome amount of detail about spinning wheel history in recent centuries. My experience with such wheels is limited to the one my wife got from a used furniture guy in our homesteading days. Her interest had waned by the time we moved to the city, but it was only last year that we finally sold it on Kijiji. In preparing the ad, I researched enough to learn it was a Canadian Production Wheel,  a fast spinner, made in St. Hyacinthe, Quebec before the rise of mill machinery. That led me to find the faint, barely visible maker markings.

My reply on screw thread direction was prompted by your reference to the "modern" direction.

David Wieland wrote:
The reason for reverse screw threading is functional (not age-related). It's required when a part is subject to some counter-clockwise twisting in normal use and standard threading would tend to loosen the part.

The more I think about this, the more I wonder if culture and tradition have a lot more to do with the choice of twist direction.

I'm thinking of all the hand-powered tools I've used over the years and how many of them have handles that unscrew as we use them.  They would have benefitted from having a 'reverse' twist on the bolts but for a batch of 10 thousand units, it doesn't make sense to get the bolts custom-made and have to recalibrate the machines just for that one part.  So they stick with the 'standard' threading.  

I imagine wheelwrights had the same issue.  They weren't just making spinning wheels, they were usually the wheelwrights for the village or the carpenters with the blacksmith's help.  I wonder if the equivalent of a tap and die set would decide which way the twist went on the flyer rather than any conscious decision of use.  

Reverse threaded, also known as left-hand thread, fasteners are manufactured these days in the normal way but only used as needed -- and if the designers thought about it. A lesser alternative is to use a lock washer, but that's useless for a crank handle.

Another good example of culture and tradition over choosing the best for the use.

towards the second half of this video, you can see how the yarn blocker would be used.  

r ranson wrote:towards the second half of this video, you can see how the yarn blocker would be used.  

Ohhhhhhhhhhhh.... now I need a distaff. That looks so much easier than all the fussing with the batt when it comes off my drum carder.

Shawn Foster wrote:

Ohhhhhhhhhhhh.... now I need a distaff. That looks so much easier than all the fussing with the batt when it comes off my drum carder.

You and me, both! I do believe I'll be making one, asap!

Shawn Foster wrote:

r ranson wrote:towards the second half of this video, you can see how the yarn blocker would be used.  

Ohhhhhhhhhhhh.... now I need a distaff. That looks so much easier than all the fussing with the batt when it comes off my drum carder.

Thank you for directing me to the yarn blocker part of the video. This does demonstrate its use nicely.