Interesting little read:

http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2007/07/070722162434.htm

a couple of years old, I know.  What I wonder is if they did "organic no-till" would it be even better at building the soil than till-organic?  People say in some instances that tilling in OM is better/faster than letting the worms do it.

I wish they hadn't done no-till + pesticides + synth fertilizer...

I think tilling can have its place. it stands to reason that since the organic practice of adding lots of matter to the soil appears to be beneficial that finding a way to do that 'no till'.....also a practice often shown to be beneficial.....would be even better!

Wow, the author of the article has a hard time understanding the concept of organic + no-till.  In the author's mind, the two are mutually exclusive because the author cannot fathom polyculture.

And such is the current state of the world.

yeah its kind of annoying. but maybe testing some combos is the next step. when to discern answers (that the scfientific community will not trash) it is correct to start with the one variable. if they did both they wouldn't be able to discern whether the percentage of improvement was due to the organic or the no till. just like they start develping drug regimens to treat a difficult disease they don't go slamming the patient with all sorts of things. they wouldn't know what treatment was causing side affects or promoting improvement or if they were canceling each other out. I don't think it is a conspiracy or that they are dumb. its just a part of a lineage of studies in a good scientific theory developing. conclusions are not based on one all encompassing study. they are based on a series of studies that build on each other that all point to the same truth. studies that can be reviewed by peers and accepted and not dumped into the bucket of biased or poorly designed ones like so many are.

i agree that you migh have some areas that you may require tilling..that it is silly to separate the two..organic...and no till...into rivaling gangs !!

even if you do till you can still have organic..and if you end up having to use some form of herbicide you can attempt to do the least harmful product available..

but to put them up against each other is just plain stupid..why not try to do the best of both worlds..no till and organic..


when we put in our drainfield..i had to till..as we had to bring up the willow that was buried from the field and break up the stuff that was solid down under..but after going over it with the tiller to even and spread the fill, and raked out the willow (pulling out any sprouted missing pieces)..that was the last it ever got tilled !! it was immedaitely planted with anything we could get our hands on..and it all grew like topsy..

the areas of our property that had been tilled over and over before we bought the property and moved here..are really crappy soil..and are nearly impossible to rebuild and get growing good..right now i'm sheet composting those areas ..and sheet mulching the plants..and putting in things that are shallow rooted and strong likeberries and having good success..but the soil there was really hard packed crap !!

Brenda Groth wrote:
it is silly to separate the two..organic...and no till...into rivaling gangs !!

Silly like a FOX.

Divide and rule is a time-tested method for preserving an empire.

polyparadigm wrote:
Silly like a FOX.

Divide and rule is a time-tested method for preserving an empire.

thats for sure! its easy to then draw "conclusions" that back up what they want it to back up. without pointing out that they haven't really got the full story yet and they are only..say.....20% there. people will drink it up. happens in the drug company and nutrition world alot to. although it has its value it must be taken in context.