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I've been cruising the forum/topic on selling raw milk.  I have found a source here in my neck of the woods for raw milk and am pleased about that.  It's expensive, but I feel it's well worth it.
Now, my questie is:  Does drinking  raw, uncooked milk do away with the side effects of pastuerized milk such as too much mucus production, etc. etc.

I'd really like some input on the benefits of raw milk.

Thanks.
 
Jami McBride
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For a start toward your goal Koka, I would recommend you do a search right here on raw milk.  There has been a lot of good info already covered, and not to long ago. 

I believe as we stop consuming things that are not health producing and start consuming those things that do enable our bodies to heal they will in fact begin to correct themselves.  However the speed and end result will depend on so many factors that what one person experiences may not be what the next person following the same path experiences.  No guarantees, no magic cures.... but you will be giving your body it's best chances at health when you stop process milk consumption - IMO.  And if you do consume milk make it raw, grass fed milk 
 
                    
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I think the mucus production blamed on milk is often a figment of people's imagination, or is caused by other factors and milk is a common and convenient scapegoat.  But that's me and my obnoxious opinion. 

This is a good site: http://www.westonaprice.org/ about raw milk and lots of other things.
 
                    
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Thx for all of the great discussion.  Marina, I'm going to try out the url you provided and FWIW, I think you're right about the mucus thingy.
 
Kristen Lee-Charlson
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marina phillips wrote:
I think the mucus production blamed on milk is often a figment of people's imagination, or is caused by other factors and milk is a common and convenient scapegoat.  But that's me and my obnoxious opinion. 


For me, dairy in any form - fresh, raw or otherwise does have mucus causing properties. I only consume fresh, grass-fed milk products and can tell immediately the extra mucus after consumption. I have even cut them out for months (it takes 10 days to remove dairy from your system) only to reintroduce fermented raw dairy with the same results. At this point I am passed caring about the slight increase in mucus because I LOVE raw cheeses and fresh cream in my weekend coffee - real fermented sour cream, kefir, 24-hour cultured, raw yogurt and on and on. I consume no grains or starches in general......hmmmm.....
 
tel jetson
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maybe we should consider the extra mucus a resource instead of a problem...
 
                    
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Oh man!  I was told about this article recently - perhaps the secret behind the mucus!?  It's not milk, it's the breed of COW who made the milk!  Different cows have different qualities of casein. 


"The Devil in the Milk"
 
Jami McBride
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Great info Marina, that is also a great book The Devil in the Milk!

It's funny, but this 'stuff' is all so connected - the eating of (grass fed) lard, butter and bacon, the drinking of (grass fed, type A2) raw milk, the soaking and fermenting of foods, etc.

I am amazed at how eventually these seemingly different conversations come back around and dovetail into one another. 

Goat's milk is all type A2, and many people believe it's is why it is so easy to digest and why some people can tolerate it better than cows milk.



“The Devil in the Milk” — Dr. Thomas Cowan on how the A1 – A2 factor explains why even raw milk sometimes does not seem to be enough of an improvement over “store-bought”

 
Casey Halone
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RAW MILK is a complete FOOD. you could live off nothing but raw milk. (nature has many other things to offers us for food but so i hear!) pasteurized milk is DEAD. Homogenized milk has downsides too.
 
Warren David
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Koka wrote:
I've been cruising the forum/topic on selling raw milk.  I have found a source here in my neck of the woods for raw milk and am pleased about that.  It's expensive, but I feel it's well worth it.
Now, my questie is:  Does drinking  raw, uncooked milk do away with the side effects of pastuerized milk such as too much mucus production, etc. etc.

I'd really like some input on the benefits of raw milk.

Thanks.
Nobody can tell you if it will benefit you or not. All you can do is try it and see how you feel.
 
Leila Rich
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I've been using raw milk for a while now and I finally worked out how to make proper yoghurt!
Since raw milk is alive,  it requires more careful handling than the inert white subtance from the supermarket.
I don't have any dairy allergies, so using raw milk is about my health generally, as well as that of the animals that supply it.
It's a rare farmer who's  into providing raw milk despite the bureaucratic nightmares and I'm confident  his animal husbandry and land management is up to scratch.
 
            
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We believe eating foods in as close to their natural state as possible affords the best benefits of whatever it is we eat.  So far as the raw milk debate goes, we believe it is the cleanliness of the facility that makes the difference.  We have done our own milking under some pretty primitive yet pretty clean conditions and have never had any problems.
So far as mucus goes, it is a good thing to have access to when in the vicinity of politicians and the like.
 
                                      
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I read a book a while back that said commercially raised cows are bred for certain traits, which can make their milk out of balance and unsuitable for human consumption. It also said cows are injected with growth hormones and genetically modified grains.

All in all it was telling me that milk that is not raw isn't good for human consumption and can cause side affects such as acne and much more.

I'm not sure how true this is but ever since I read it I started buying organic milk, since I cant buy raw milk from my state. Its illegal in some states to sell raw milk, so I never got the chance to try raw milk yet.
 
Casey Halone
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Do you have pets? if not you should get some. we buy 2 gallons of raw milk a week for our "pet."
 
James Stark
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Casey Halone wrote:
Do you have pets? if not you should get some. we buy 2 gallons of raw milk a week for our "pet."


Yep! There's plenty of products out there that are "not intended for human consumption" (and labeled that way.)

For example, here, our butcher buys rabbits from Quebec!! That's a long trip, and results in a VERY expensive, sub-par, frozen piece of meat. Alas, it is the only place the butcher is allowed to buy from because he has to buy government approved meat.

Fortunately for me, my dogs love fresh rabbit, and my chickens love raw milk.I buy both for them, and the milk is labeled "not for human consumption". I've seen where it comes from. My "chickens" sure are lucky to have such clean, healthy milk! Perhaps there's a farmer near you who produces milk that's not intended for human consumption?


....funny how government officials love to protect us from things that don't make them money.
 
Jami McBride
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Here's some info -


The Animal Breed Matters

Raw, whole milk is the overall best choice, because it offers abundant healthy fat, probiotics, vitamins, minerals
and enzymes. It is not processed at all on its way from farm to table, other than milking it out or chilling it. Yet,
not all raw, whole milk is created equal. Some of it comes from less desirable breeds. When choosing your raw,
whole milk, you actually have two choices:

1. raw, whole milk from an old-fashioned breed of pastured animal, such as Jersey, Guernsey, Red Devon,
or Brown Swiss cows, or goats, or sheep

2. raw, whole milk from a modern breed of pastured animal, such as the commercial Holstein

What’s wrong with the modern breed of cow? The milk protein suffers a genetic mutation, making it unstable in
our digestive tracts. This mutation is linked to serious health issues, such as auto-immune disease, heart
disease, type-1 diabetes, autism, and schizophrenia. Source: Keith Woodford’s Devil in the Milk.

Also, the modern Holstein’s milk contains more water and less nutrition ounce for ounce. According to Joann S.
Grohman of “Keeping a Family Cow,” you “have to drink one and two-thirds glasses of Holstein milk to receive
the nutrients you get from a glass of Jersey milk.” What are those nutrients? Milkfat, protein, calcium,
phosphorous, magnesium, vitamins A, D, E and K, and all the other vitamins and minerals typically found in milk.
  http://gnowfglins.com/

 
Leila Rich
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I poked around online trying to find any local disease stats to compare with Emerson's:  no joy.
It does  look like the  U.S. and NZ have similar legal requirements for  raw milk production, but just checking....must  the U.S. herd be free-range  and organic?
I'm as confident as I can reasonably be about 'my'  herd's health: they're regularly checked/ tested and the farmer manages them very well.
I suppose the compromise for me would be to buy the raw milk and pasteurise it, if I got worried about disease.
Buying milk like this enables me to bypass the near monopoly  NZ's biggest company, Fonterra, has over the mainstream milk supply.
The only way I can hope to avoid colluding in the massive degradation of my country's envronment is by opting out of the dominant corporate paradigm.
For me, raw milk's as much a political, ethical  and philosophical statement as a health choice.
To missquote Wendell Berry: drinking milk is an agricultural act...

 
Jeff Mathias
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Hi Emerson,

I happen to be one of those that don't really think we need or should use milk as milk much after we are done breast feeding as children so I don't really have much invested in the raw milk debate, although I do love cheese. So I find it exceptionally strange that we hyper-focus on such things without providing some balance. I assume much of it comes from giving up our rights as individuals to make choices for ourselves and asking maybe even forcing our government to make those decisions for us instead.

Some additional food for thought.
Emerson White wrote:
Of that 3% 70% is from raw dairy products, but raw milk (the most dangerous form of dairy) makes up 1% of all the milk consumed. This makes raw about 230 times more risky than pasteurized.

I believe I know the report you are speaking about. It also states the majority (something around 70%) of all cases of food poisoning occur in chain type restaurants. So it is also around 230 times more risky to eat in chain restaurants than to consume any dairy products at all.

Do you know are the Amish factored in here? They don't pasteurize at all do they?

Emerson White wrote:
Additionally you have to consider Brucellosis, which can kill people but easily maintains itself in a herd in free range conditions, which is why do many of our bison herds have it, in spite of being wild animals living in wildlands.


Me I don't really consider death by Brucellosis much of a problem actually. What are we talking 100 - 200 cases a year here in America and of those less than 2% fatality and many of those 100 - 200 are hunters not raw milk drinkers at all. Compare that to roughly 93 people killed per day in the US in 2009 from vehicle accidents alone and it seems like such an insignificant number to be wasting any time or resources on and certainly not worth making laws about. Especially because people in my mind should be able to make their own decisions. Nobody as far as I can tell is forcing anyone to sell or consume raw milk or abandon pasteurized milk, nobody is asking and certainly not forcing the dairy industry to switch to raw so it seems like much ado about nothing to me. Further I am not aware of any lawsuits related to anyone having gotten sick from their raw milk consumption. It seems to me instead like some farmers have reacted to a demand created by the market, basic capitalism at its finest if you ask me.

What really bothers me though is I buy my meat, fish and poultry raw. What is next forced pasteurization of those as well? I don't like where this appears to be headed.

Jeff
 
Jeff Hodgins
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I buy raw milk and drink it raw all the time and I like raw more than boiled, bit my wife insists on boiling it for the kids.
 
Jami McBride
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My children and I have consumed raw milk for over 10 years - I just got food poisoning from purchased potato salad, over the last 10 years all our food related illnesses have been from grocery store foods!


Here is some info - we all have to decide for ourselves.

http://www.realmilk.com/

http://www.realmilk.com/documents/ResponsetoMarlerListofStudies.pdf



Throughout the world, people have different opinions regarding milk consumption.

Africans and Orientals have traditionally avoided milk, while Europeans and Americans encourage milk consumption. Besides proteins, milk also contains fats, meaning that it does not combine well with other foods except itself.

Still, nowadays cold milk is often consumed with other products, affecting negatively the digestion process. Milk curds immediately upon entering the stomach, so if other foods are present, the curds coagulate around food particles, insulating them from gastric juices and delaying the digestion process (sometimes long enough to permit the onset of putrefaction).

The pasteurisation process destroys milk's natural enzymes and its delicate proteins. The active enzymes of milk, lactose and lipose, permit milk to digest itself. When enzymes are destroyed, milk becomes hard to digest by adults. Also, the lack of enzymes and proteins reduces the absorption of calcium and other mineral elements from milk.

In 1930, Dr. Fracis M. Pottenger conducted a 10 years study on the effects of pasteurised and raw milk diets on 900 cats. The cats were divided in 2 separate groups. One group received only raw milk, while the other one received pasteurised milk from the same source.

The first group of cats (consuming raw milk) remained healthy and active throughout their lives, while the second group (consuming pasteurized milk) became confused and ill (heat diseases, loss of teeth, liver inflammation, etc.).


The second and third generation of cats from the second group encountered even more health problems. The cats were born with weak bones and poor teeth (a clear sign of calcium deficiency) and were all sterile. The cats from the first group remained healthy from generation to generation, without been affected by any illnesses.

The experiment ended because there was no fourth generation of cats belonging to the second group of cats feed with pasteurised milk.

Besides pasteurisation, milk is now "homogenised" to stop cream separating from milk. As a result of this process, fat molecules are pulverized and fragmented in order to stay with the rest of milk components.

But, in this way, fragments of fat molecules can easily pass through the small intestine, increasing the amount of fat and cholesterol absorbed by the body. Sometimes you can absorb more fat in this way than from eating pure cream from milk.

IMPORTANT: Women consuming large quantities of pasteurised milk suffer the world's highest incidence of osteoporosis.

“ Generally, VITAMINS & MINERALS are best absorbed and used by the body when they come from natural sources (plants, animals) and are present in natural complex combinations”


Source:http://www.facebook.com/topic.php?uid=102342736468164&topic=198

 
                                
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I grew up in a time and place where many people drank raw milk, and people did get sick from it sometimes. One was a girl in my grade who died from scarlet fever she got from raw milk from her own family's dairy farm. Maybe a number of unlucky things came together to result in her death; I don't know. I just remember it every time I hear about how raw milk is the latest miracle food.

I have to admit that the hype around raw milk makes me suspicious. It sounds too much like marketing to me, like how grass-fed beef will save the world. It should only be so easy. Yes, I know my ideas are unpopular.
 
Jeanine Gurley Jacildone
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Replying to original question concerning mucous production:

I personally noticed a decrease in mucous production when I quit eating factory farmed dairy.  I have chronic sinus problems but they are very much improved since I started drinking raw milk and 'chemical free' dairy. 

I don't know if I would be cured of it all if I gave up dairy - that will never happen; I love it too much.

Interesting note:  Back when I used to diet all of the time I avoided milk like the plague.  When I did fall off the wagon and have dairy the scales immediatly went up.

Now, eating only chemical free foods, lots of cheese, and drinking raw whole milk (shake it up to mix the cream) I am 25 lbs lighter and it has stayed off for a couple of years now.  And I eat MORE food!!  No pills, no portion control, big plates of food.  lovin it!
 
Jeanine Gurley Jacildone
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Got my 'fix' today!  We now have to travel 50 miles, one way, to buy raw milk - but it is so worth it.

Nevermind the health benefits, the taste is so complex.  I get a couple gallons from each of the two South Carolina dairies just to support them both and they always taste a little different.  And then the taste will change again as the season change.

We separate it into smaller jars and keep the milk in the freezer so we don't have to make frequent trips and I don't have to worry about it spoiling.

Tomorrow morning I'll have my esspresso with steamed whole raw milk - can't wait.  I use organic soybean milk when I am out of the cow juice so this will be a treat.
 
Jared Gardener
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tel jetson wrote:
maybe we should consider the extra mucus a resource instead of a problem...


I'm so used to facebook that I wanted to "like" this comment.
 
John Polk
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I was so happy to discover that the produce stand a mile from my house in West Seattle sells raw milk...from a Jersey cow herd (A2 genes).  It is from a local (about 100 miles) producer, and labeled for human consumption (but of course, with the government's warning label).
 
Jeff Mathias
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Government Data Proves Raw Milk Safe
http://www.westonaprice.org/press/government-data-proves-raw-milk-safe


The research for the article presented by Dr. Ted Beals MD
http://www.realmilk.com/real-milk-pathogens.html

From the realmilk.com link: "Using this average of 42 illnesses per year, we can show, using government figures, that you are about 35,000 times more likely to become ill from other foods than you are from raw milk."



Jeff Mathias wrote:
What really bothers me though is I buy my meat, fish and poultry raw. What is next forced pasteurization of those as well? I don't like where this appears to be headed.


Well not forced pasteurization of meats yet but it looks like we are heading down that path:

Processors Ask for Meat, Poultry 'Pasteurization'
http://www.foodsafetynews.com/2011/05/meat-processors-file-petition-for-meat-poultry-pasteurization/

Food Irradiation: A Public Health Opportunity
http://www.nfid.org/library/steele.shtml

Jeff
 
                            
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Anonymous wrote:I think the mucus production blamed on milk is often a figment of people's imagination, or is caused by other factors and milk is a common and convenient scapegoat.  But that's me and my obnoxious opinion. 

This is a good site: http://www.westonaprice.org/ about raw milk and lots of other things.


Um no... Child flatulence disappears with removal of milk in many cases as well. (I have a friend who is a councilor for school kids, that parents come too)

Raw milk is better for you than pasteurized milk when it comes from healthy cows, but should be used to make products that are beneficial to consume.

Raw milk butter is intensely powerful for healing intestines and consequently skin (acne etc). The other products are far easier to digest, and contain higher amounts of beneficial components. Hard non-blue cheeses being good for starving bad bacteria in gut (not everyone is prone to this) and whey based cheeses have been shown to increase insulin reception.
 
Julie Helms
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I just found out the dairy I get raw milk from may stop selling it soon. I asked if it was some new law on the horizon? Nope, their insurance company will drop them if they continue the raw milk sales and apparently at insurance conventions talk of this is spreading.
 
Olanga Jay
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I think there is a big difference not only between breeds of cows, but their size too. Previously, we had a regular-sized jersey cow. We now have a miniature Jersey. Milk is very different.
 
richard valley
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What is the volume of milk you get from your miniature cows?

We milk our goats, I don't trust milk that is to be had at stores today.
 
Olanga Jay
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2 gallons twice a day. And she is only 30 inches tall, the size of our sheep, only heavier. I also do not like store bought milk. Even organic milk in stores is not as fresh as from your animal ...
 
richard valley
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That sounds great. Haven't had a cow for so many years, and never had amini. Do you use a milker? Wifey would love to have a cow.

You mentioned 2 gal twice a day. Is that a gallon each milking or two?
 
Olanga Jay
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2 gallons in the morning and 2 gallons in the evening. But we are taking only 2 and 2 gallon leaving to the calf. I'm milking by hands and I like it. The cow is my spirit animal, and I love everything about the cows. So when our old family cow had died, we considered to buy a goat, but I really wanted a cow ... The main problem was that we have a problem with hay for two last summers ... But a miniature cow eats hay as much as a goat, in other words, much less than the normal-sized cow. She is a wonderful pet, and she is very easy to manage. She fits in the back seat of a car, and I dream about ride on the lake with her... :0)
 
richard valley
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We had a Jersey/Gernsey cross when I was a young boy, she was so good!
 
Olanga Jay
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I had jersey. She was a saint ... But miniature cows are easy going. They are more pets. Although I bought it from a dairy farm. They have only a mini cows and sell raw milk.
 
Jami McBride
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How's your mini's cream production?

I've been interested in Dexters and other smaller breeds.

Thanks
 
Olanga Jay
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I'm not a real farmer, but simply have a homestead from the year 2000. I myself still learning... So I will say what I know:
I learned that the Jersey breed have the richest milk and most cream. Because it is the only dairy cows, they are skinny. No matter how well you feed jersey, it remains skinny and gives all nutrients to milk. They are selfless. While the meat breeds all nutrients are used for muscle growth and fat depots in their body. Meat cows also produce milk, but it is poorer and much less cream.
Dexters are a dual breed. I know about them, because at first I wanted to have them. I liked how they look ... I love fat cows : o) But I do not eat meat. If you eat meat, it is a good choice, but their milk is not the best.
Many meat-eating farmers have a jersey for the best milk and breed it with a meat breed. Then we obtain the dual calf which would be for the meat.

From my experience with Jersey:

My first jersey cow, I adopted, rescued from the butcher. She was 15 years old (usually at the dairy farms they slaughtered at 4 years of age, after the higher productivity) But in her old age, she gave two gallons of milk a day and it was good enough for me. She died of old age the age of 26 and until the last day she gave one gallon per day. They produce cream from the grain in the diet. I fed my old cow well that means one scoop a day. In a glass 1 gallon jar, was always visible about 4 inches of cream.

Now I have a mini jersey, which is 2 years old. In other words, it is the height of their productivity.
I feed her well, but she does not want more than a quarter scoop of grain, but produces 3 inches of cream (i measure in the same glass jar).
Her milk is light, it is more like goat milk and it seems that it is better absorbed by the human body. This is because it is a small animal that is close to us in size.
 
Olanga Jay
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I also learned that, yes, cow's milk contributes to the mucus production in humans. And that is why, in many countries, people who work in hazardous industries, ordered to drink milk. Because with mucus, they eliminate toxins from the body. This is considered a good therapeutic effect from milk. I also noticed that people living in clean environments do not have problems with mucus discharge after milk.
 
richard valley
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There was in Hollywood, a powder plant of a cosmetic company. Workers there were permitted one quart of milk each day as part of: Hours, Wages and Conditions.

MAX FACTOR
 
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