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Persimmon problems

 
warren. cascadee
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Greetings,
I was wondering if anyone has had problems with Asian Persimmons in Clark County?

I have 6 planted around my place and none of them are producing. 2 of the trees were planted 6 years ago(now 9yr old tree), 2 4years ago(now 7yr old tree), 2 3years ago(now6yr old tree). The 2 that were first planted put off a large crop the first 2 years and now they aren't producing. They all also tend to get a lighter colored leaf. So I wonder if the soil isn't supporting the tree, we don't have the right pollinator? Any ideas? My family loves asian persimmons(harder) and I've seen trees in the area get loads of fruit.

My location:

full sun
Vancouver, Heights area
Some are on drip irrigation some aren't but all looking the same
2yrs ago i placed myco tabs around them all to jack up soil health

THanks,
Warren Neth
www.resilientworks.com
 
                    
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Well, I'm across the continent (N. Florida), but it took a long time for my one Fuyu persimmon to bear first fruit (2 small ones last year). I don't know when I put it in, but it could have been 5 to 10 years.  I was thinking about replacing it with something else. After I knew it was good, I removed all the low branches (under 10' and planted chayote (perennial squash) at the base.
 
tel jetson
steward
Posts: 3356
Location: woodland, washington
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what sort of shape is the dirt in?  myco tabs can't invent nutrients out of nothing.  what else is growing around them and what shape is it in?  how did you plant them?  what sort of hole?  bare root or potted?  did you amend the dirt at all?
 
Paul Cereghino
gardener
Posts: 855
Location: South Puget Sound, Salish Sea, Cascadia, North America
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Interesting.. I planted a Jiro type.. grafted.  Soil is silt loam deep, well drained, layer of rock powder, horse manure, then wood chip mulch.  It has a comfrey for companionship, cut 3 times a year.  It has very short growth increments (2 inches) and the first year there was intervein yellow, worst on eldest leaves, like I might expect from magnesium deficit. This seemed to resolve by year 2 to a fairly even yellow green.  With a slight increase in growth.  Nurseryman who is relatively reliable, says yellowish leaves are part of the genotype.  Apples planted the same year in same soil with same treatment are hale and healthy in all ways.

I have found quotes like this on the web...

"Common persimmon sends down a deep taproot, which makes it a good species for erosion control but makes it difficult to transplant."

"American persimmon seedlings are generally used as rootstock for Asian cultivars."

But healthy growth rate is described as 12" a year.

I am also waiting patiently for something to change...
 
John Saltveit
gardener
Posts: 1925
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Persimmons are slow growers here in PNW. I live across the river and I've actualy met both Paul and Warren. Most are on American rootstock. I have some fruiting. Their roots are not really tap roots but are described as "Fleshy". You can kill them by transplanting them. I did it to my Izu I had at the other house. For Americans, you usually need a male tree also. My Early Golden didn't fruit this year. Garretson had some weird thing on top a few years back so I cut it out. Disease? Not known for getting diseases, but it has fruited 2 years in a row now. Szukis fruited this year for first time. Tiny, unseeded fruit. I have chestnuts, which seem to pollinate without setting seeds in the fruit. I find the flavor of an American persimmon of a selected cultivar to be more complex and interesting than the Asian ones. They are less bred, and more like the original fruit. Are you guys getting enough heat units to get it to flower?
John S
PDX OR
 
Alder Burns
pollinator
Posts: 1331
Location: northern California
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The happiest Asian persimmons I ever grew were grafted onto in-place seedlings or sprouts of wild American persimmon. By planting the seed direct, the taproot remains undisturbed. When I used seeds, I would plant four or five in each spot, let them all grow for a year or two, and then graft them all. I was (and am) a novice grafter so I wasn't confident of a high percentage of success, so I relied on redundancy and then clipped out any weak or unsuccessful grafts. The succesful ones grew vigorously (3 feet or more per year, in GA) and began producing after 2-3 years. When I relocated to a second site, I tried grafting onto young wild persimmons already growing around, and only had good luck with one out of ten or twelve. Later research told me that there is a lot of genetic diversity within the American persimmon and some are more compatible with Asian scions than others.....apparently the seed tree I had collected from at the first site was a good pick. I also lost some grafts mysteriously after several years of good growth and production, and discovered from more research that there is also a virus, invisible and asymptomatic in the Asian, which is fatal to the American rootstock, and it can translocate down through the graft union. Seems to me the long-term answer is to grow Asians on Asian rootstocks on compatible soils....
 
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