My Cargo Bike Upgrades

Because its like this...I thought I would work on this...

I like how your bike is able to carry so much. Please may you explain how you did this to your bike? I especially like the setup over the bike's rear wheel!

Other cargo related items

even more

How does the three-wheeled cargo bike work? Are there pedals to it? Do you attach it to a two-wheeled bike?

Dave Burton wrote:How does the three-wheeled cargo bike work? Are there pedals to it? Do you attach it to a two-wheeled bike?

Nope. Its a cargo cart. To be pushed by me and pulled by the dogs. I was going to show the ski version but I don't think they will allow any more photos. The first bike has an Xtracycle rear end attached. Unfortunately Extracycle are no longer producing them according to their web page. Finding one now will be tricky but ebay may be worth a search. This type of bike is referred to as a long tail.

Dave Burton wrote:I like how your bike is able to carry so much. Please may you explain how you did this to your bike? I especially like the setup over the bike's rear wheel!

It was, Unfortunately tragic to read this from Xtracycle on the Free Radical system http://www.xtracycle.com/freeradical . Now, my bike is cycling history....But there are lots of people making longtails nowdays.

Others pics https://www.google.ca/search?q=long+tail+cargo+bike&biw=1366&bih=599&tbm=isch&tbo=u&source=univ&sa=X&ei=LJzSVOvgL4H7sASFmIDYBw&ved=0CCIQsAQ&dpr=1

And here is the touching story about the invention of the long tail. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uWMd6yyYs8E

Got it

Another small thing to point out is the detachable bar that slips into the handle bar of the bike with the baskets. I borrowed the idea from the Viet Cong peoples truck that helped them win that war against an industrial empire.
The bar slips in and out for when a bike needs to be pushed up hill. Much more ergonomical.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ho_Chi_Minh_trail#mediaviewer/File:Ho_chi_minh_trail.jpg
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Viet_Cong_and_Vietnam_People's_Army_logistics_and_equipment#mediaviewer/File:Trailporters.jpg

People really need to see those photos. With an interruption of gas supplies, through disaster, peak oil, crumbling infrastructure or inability to pay for the fuel, this is your only practical way to move stuff.

The basket bike was a concept bike I did as an experiment. I was going for a poor mans long tail without the long tail.. I wanted a wide rear end so a backpack or sack of food or box could be strapped on top.

Writing this post has made me realise I want to build a full push bike like the ones carrying rice, I think I have just the crappy bike for the job. It may be good for moving firewood.

My daily minor upgrade. The lower shelf now slides out to increase one side. This is to carry larger items like a kayak, ladders, large boxes, a deer, etc, but can be changed mid trip

Right on Ross! The photos give me a bunch of ideas. How do you find the cargo bikes (loaded) react to wind?

My father willl be out in May, he used to make me crazy tall and long bikes when I was young, I think he would be pumped at the idea of helping me out by welding up a cargo bike.

This "bike" seems to be very energy efficient based on the observation of how much effort these "riders" are giving compared to their speed. I've seen other of these treadmill bikes, but this guy seems to have worked out the right gearing ratio for his Lopifit bike.

Shortened urls do not work here. I have reposted the video below:

MrsC5 just said "Is that Dutch"...
I was just in Holland. Holland has an UnFrigginBelevable bike culture...

But Holland has no hills. I say this mildly. Not meaning to burst bubbles but I would give up on this idea.

This is a Dutch yuppy mini van and this is a Dutch Hippy van. They wouldn't understand why we are having this conversation...especially in an apocalyptic context, figuring us north americans had been eating paint chips. Why didn't they invest in bike infrastructure during the good times, Im sure they would think.

Most of their bikes come out of the factory ready to carry cargo

Some guys here just like to spend too much money. Here is a cheaper way. Longer wheelbase. Handles well. Customize your baskets on sides. Tie downs. Front basket and bags on the side. ........... Oh so you say you do not have a Tandem.. Well here is one guys welding and it just looks ugly. He took two matching Mountain bikes cut and welded in three. Yes that's right THREE places. on the Frame... Only three places.

Since we faced the snowpocalypse winter...I built another sled from scrap that was lying around. Now that I have done the first one, this one only took about two hours to build. I wanted a thinner one that could get through the trees. Unfortunately it was alittle too thin . Two more inches of width and dropping the legs down two inches would have made it more stable. I'll try again next winter. Here, I am hauling feed up the hill as we are snowed in and have been since January. Its nice to finally see the top of the tractor again. The snow is down a couple of feet. Its been the first year I have ever had to shovel out the windows to let light in

Ross Raven wrote:Because its like this...I thought I would work on this...

aha! the super cool trek bike floats on snow! awesome bike.

Yes, here in Holland there are a lot of bikes, estimates are about double of the population. But like all other consumer goods, bikes are now of poor quality, and not able to be used for cargo. But between 1900 and 1970 there where a lot of bicycle-factories who made really good quality cargo bikes. Bakeries and butchers used those bikes for delivery. Because of the economical importance, these cargo-bikes didn't get robbed by the Germans during WOII. So there are still a lot of them, and not expensive at all. Don't forget those kind of heavy duty bikes where expensive, for example in the 1930s such a bike would do 100 guilders or more, a few months of salary for the average worker. Now you can buy such an beautyful oldtimer for 200-500 euro on marktplaats.nl (the Dutch Ebay).

These kind of bikes are the best, believe me. Only when you don't have hills, because the bikes are really heavy. But the driving experience, its like a truck, really. Even if you carry 100kg or more its easy cycling. If you want to know a bit more, here is a (dutch) website: transportfiets.net


(Image from transportfiets.net)

Thanks Andreas.
I found this today. The bicycle that won the Vietnam war. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BagqlqhowZs
Could carry up to 400 pounds

Good news, everyone. Though I was heart broken that they discontinued the Freeradical system, between now and last winter when I wrote this, they re designed the Freeradical into The Leap. Its not the end.
http://www.xtracycle.com/freeradical/
I have no affiliation with Xtracycle or experience with this mod...Though I am not above bribery if they ever find this post and want a review. LOL

What a great thread Ross! I'm sorry I didn't discover this thread until now. I find that people would ride bikes more for errands if they found safe navigable routes in their neighborhood. I also think they would carry more and use them more widely if they had thought about some of these awesome innovations like you're doing here. Great work!
John S
PDX OR

I almost forgot about this post....but I have something new for it.

I have been doing my own thing, now writing as Category5 at the Dark Green Mountain Survival Research Centre.

You may like my article,
C5 Presents- The Ultimate Cargo Bike- Redux – The Shareable Version.   https://darkgreenmountainsurvivalresearchcentre.wordpress.com/2017/07/04/c5-presents-the-ultimate-cargo-bike-redux-the-shareable-version/
Please share this as the info has to get "Out There".
If you chose to brave the Ruder Cruder version, its, The Ultimate Cargo Bike or Real Men Push Bikes.

You also may enjoy this on motorised bikes.  https://darkgreenmountainsurvivalresearchcentre.wordpress.com/2017/05/07/c5-survival-advice-part-4-on-motorised-bicycles-from-south-america/  

A few weeks from now I will post an article called The Man Truck, on the insane ways they use a hand truck down here. The main reason to show up is I will show a potential way to create replacement tires, created from recycled truck tires...for that inevitable day when tubes and tires for your bikes are no more.

Nice article, Ross.
I especially like your view of being mechanically inclined and able to adapt to things. Resilience means using lots of different skills when we need them.
John S
PDX OR

The article on The Man Truck  with bonus material on how to make an emergency tubeless bike tire is now up. enjoy.

https://darkgreenmountainsurvivalresearchcentre.wordpress.com/2017/09/08/c5-on-the-man-truck-no-oil-eroei-no-problem-survival-advice-from-south-america-part-12/

Ross Raven wrote:Another small thing to point out is the detachable bar that slips into the handle bar of the bike with the baskets. I borrowed the idea from the Viet Cong peoples truck that helped them win that war against an industrial empire.
The bar slips in and out for when a bike needs to be pushed up hill. Much more ergonomical.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ho_Chi_Minh_trail#mediaviewer/File:Ho_chi_minh_trail.jpg
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Viet_Cong_and_Vietnam_People's_Army_logistics_and_equipment#mediaviewer/File:Trailporters.jpg

Could you elaborate on this? I live in hilly country and this would be helpful to me. In a few months I'm going to sell my products in a farmer's market 3 Km from my place. In no way I can afford to buy a motorized vehicle.
Your thread gave me good ideias, thank you!

Great work in all regards, Ross.  Very inspiring stuff.  I'm not sure which I like the most.  Probably the chinese wheelbarrow article in Low Tech Magazine that you refer to from your survival site post.  I wonder about making a large chinese wheelbarrow to bring my produce to the farmers market.  It is 2.5 km from my place with some hills, but nothing insurmountable. Maybe a cargo bike would be better.  At any rate, I tip my hat to you and your funny and informative styles.  

Sergio Cunha wrote:

Ross Raven wrote:Another small thing to point out is the detachable bar that slips into the handle bar of the bike with the baskets. I borrowed the idea from the Viet Cong peoples truck that helped them win that war against an industrial empire.
The bar slips in and out for when a bike needs to be pushed up hill. Much more ergonomical.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ho_Chi_Minh_trail#mediaviewer/File:Ho_chi_minh_trail.jpg
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Viet_Cong_and_Vietnam_People's_Army_logistics_and_equipment#mediaviewer/File:Trailporters.jpg

Could you elaborate on this? I live in hilly country and this would be helpful to me. In a few months I'm going to sell my products in a farmer's market 3 Km from my place. In no way I can afford to buy a motorized vehicle.
Your thread gave me good ideias, thank you!

Its simply a recycled ski pole stuffed into end of a handle bar. Old sky poles are regular garbage here for discusting reasons not worth going into here. A thin piece of lead water pipe will do and probably be stonger. As a bonus, It will go through someones windshiend if they give you a problem. The point is that, as you walk beside the loaded bike to push it, it is more ergonomical. You dont have to lean into the bike. one hand pushes the center of the bike and the detachable pole stears it without effort. In the viet nam version, they just tied a stick to the handle bars so they didnt have to stand too close to the loaded bike. I'll build a push bike soon...but it wont be rideable.

Roberto pokachinni wrote:Great work in all regards, Ross.  Very inspiring stuff.  I'm not sure which I like the most.  Probably the chinese wheelbarrow article in Low Tech Magazine that you refer to from your survival site post.  I wonder about making a large chinese wheelbarrow to bring my produce to the farmers market.  It is 2.5 km from my place with some hills, but nothing insurmountable. Maybe a cargo bike would be better.  At any rate, I tip my hat to you and your funny and informative styles.  

Ya. Isnt the ancient chinese wheel barrow awsome. Good job, Low Tec Magazine. http://www.lowtechmagazine.com/2011/12/the-chinese-wheelbarrow.html
Its on my top of the list experiments. this will help me move logs out of the forest and roll them down to the house. I will be scowering the antique stored for a working wagon wheel or if I can find one, the steel version from old farm equipment. Ill build a bearing unit into it though.

Permies should be all over this. Aw hell. I will just start a new post for it.

I agree Ross. We have to look at different solutions. We have overweight, underexercised people with not enough jobs, living in a toxic, polluted world from too much engine pollution. More of these will help move the world in the right direction.
John S
PDX OR

I will be scowering the antique stored for a working wagon wheel or if I can find one, the steel version from old farm equipment. Ill build a bearing unit into it though.

 Sounds like a great plan.  Once you get rolling on that (pun intended... but meaning the project), start taking pics and start that new thread.  You are a veritable demigod of post meltdown ideas.      Much appreciated. Keep up the good work.

Roberto pokachinni wrote:

I will be scowering the antique stored for a working wagon wheel or if I can find one, the steel version from old farm equipment. Ill build a bearing unit into it though.

 Sounds like a great plan.  Once you get rolling on that (pun intended... but meaning the project), start taking pics and start that new thread.  You are a veritable demigod of post meltdown ideas.      Much appreciated. Keep up the good work.

For Fans of the "Long Tail" cargo bikes, It works on the same principal as the old school chinese wheel barrow. It destributes the weight the same way. Similar vehicles. Reverse engineering might be usefull. A crafty engineer might be able to drop the weight lower and improve on the ancient design.

It might take a while fore me though. After this volenteering post in Peru, we will be back at the farm for a couple months then off to another posting in the Bahamas. There will soon be another series starting. Survival advice from the Caribeans. What is a few Catigory 5 hurricanes between me and giving good survival advice. The gods seem to be asking me to play.

Reverse engineering might be usefull. A crafty engineer might be able to drop the weight lower and improve on the ancient design.  

 Yes.  I thought that myself.  I'm guessing the chinese design was constructed of wood or bamboo, and I think about what a metal one might be like, or one with some metal parts.  my thoughts are one with a supported axle in a braced bracket that is above the deck.  The deck could possibly be considerably lower to the ground, and thus a lot easier to load, unload, and to pick up and get moving in the first place.  Of course the 'arms' that you grab would have to be modified to be at the right height for good walking ergonomics, but still able to control the lower decks mass without breaking.  It would be interesting at any rate to see some modern redux of this concept.

How about this kind of bicycle?

I thought I would post this here because, in it, there is a photo of my latest bike build. Its a motorized bike cargo bike... but I give my reasoning.
(and there is a link to motorized bikes in south america)

https://darkgreenmountainsurvivalresearchcentre.wordpress.com/2018/08/26/the-doom-loop-with-c5/

As a bonus, I chat briefly about our recent forays into growing hemp