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Some seeds for cold and wet place?

 
Srdjan Gavrilovic
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Hi everyone,
This is my first post although I'm registered for long and been lurking the forum even longer. I'm biologist with MSc in applied genetics and breeding and PhD in molecular biology. Mostly, I'm working in front of computer looking for scientific information but I enjoy nature and lab work the most.

Few year ago, I moved  to Estonia and we bought a house with a nice yard. Nothing big, but enough to enjoy.
Climate here is very harsh in comparison with what I got used to at south of Europe. Officially, my place (north-west, 2 km from sea) is borderline 6/7 USDA zone.
http://www.plantmaps.com/interactive-estonia-plant-hardiness-zone-map-celsius.php

Don't be tricked, it is completely different type of beast then what people have in mind for zones 6 and 7 (especially if USA zones/territories are used as reference). Much less heat, very dump, cold winds, ocessional very cold spels...
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Climate_of_Estonia

I got and I'm trying to grow more obscure fruits (at least for Estonia). E.g.
Sorbus domestica "Sossenheimer Riesen", Cydonia oblonga, Crataegus anomala, Sorbomespilus "Desertnaja", Sorbopyrus auricularis "Bulbiformis", Pyronia veitchii, Mespilus germanica, Prunus tomentosa...

However, on my property and around Rosaceae are predominating. Local apples, plums, pears...taste great. I'm very satisfied but I'm looking to plant biologically more diverse trees and shrubs.

So far, I got edible and cold hardy selections of Cornus mas, Cornus kausa, Viburnum opulus, Elaeagnus umbellatam, Sambucus nigra, Schisandra chinensis, Vitis sp., Rubus sp., Ribes sp., Actinia sp, Hippophae rhamnoides,...

There is very limited availability of edible non Rosaceae trees for local climate. Thus, I would like to try and grow them from seeds. Shotgun method. I don't have enough land to do real mass-selection but I can still do some. I do not aim for tasty fruits but even a fact that I can grow them and enjoy looking at live plants will be enough.

I'm looking for following seeds
Asimina triloba (pawpaw)
Castanea sp. hybrids (chestnut; preferably with american chestnut in pedigree)
Hovenia dulcis (Japanese raisin tree)
Torreya sp.
Cephalotaxus sp. (plum-yew)
Diospyros virginiana (American persimmon)
Cudrania tricuspidata
Poncirus trifoliata hybrids (bitter orange)

It is preferable if seeds are from edible fruits/trees but any will do.
I would very much appreciate if you could help me with it.

Best, Srdjan
 
Crt Jakhel
Posts: 129
Location: NE Slovenia, zone 6a
8
bee dog forest garden
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Have you tried Ebay? I've ordered seed from the past from somebody in Lithuania who has quite a number of tree seed available - http://stores.ebay.com/seedsworld/

Also there's somebody from Germany right now selling 10 cm tall seedlings of Diospyros virginiana.

How about some cold hardy figs? (Brown Turkey, Bornholm...)

And hazel (corylus).
 
Kyrt Ryder
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Posts: 691
Location: Graham, Washington [Zone 7b, 47.041 Latitude] 41inches average annual rainfall, cool summer drought
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I'd like to recommend some form of Mulberry [Morus Sp] for your list. Red Mulberry will definitely ripen for you, white's a crapshoot and black is a nogo.
 
Srdjan Gavrilovic
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Crt Jakhel wrote:Have you tried Ebay? I've ordered seed from the past from somebody in Lithuania who has quite a number of tree seed available - http://stores.ebay.com/seedsworld/

Also there's somebody from Germany right now selling 10 cm tall seedlings of Diospyros virginiana.

How about some cold hardy figs? (Brown Turkey, Bornholm...)

And hazel (corylus).


I'm getting seeds on regular basis through ebay and amazon.
regarding Lithuanian guy, probably you aim at Zilvinas from http://www.omcseeds.com/. I got many seeds from him last fall. I got many seedlings and they are entering the first winter. Time and spring will tell...
Another source of diverse plants is http://www.myseeds.co/. However they mixed some plants and I never managed to sort it out with them

Last season I got many seedlings and very few survived to spring. D. virginiana also died. When I got it, bark looked wrinkled in patches and I believe it was infected with something to start with I keep trying seedlings as well but I hope to get seeds that can be started here by me. I have ~10 of D. virginiana seedling growing in my yard from seeds I started.
The thing is that I would like to get more to increase chances of getting something suitable for the climate and maybe even tasty.

Figs are on list B and I'm not very optimistic. However, I will give them a go at some point.

I already have one tree I believe to be C. avellana (was on property when I bought it) but nuts are bitter and scars. More plants are for sure to be sourced.

Crt Jakhel,
How likely that you could help me to get pitless plum from Slovenia?
http://www.rast-bs.si/katalog/sadne-sadike/sliva/610
http://www.rast-bs.si/CRO/katalog/vocne-sadnice/sljiva/610
I wrote them but they don't seam to be happy to waste time sending a single plant.
I would cover all of expenses you might have.

Btw, I'm almost certain that their chestnuts are hybrids that I'm looking for. I would be interested in Castanea sp they have as well.

 
Srdjan Gavrilovic
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Kyrt Ryder wrote:I'd like to recommend some form of Mulberry [Morus Sp] for your list. Red Mulberry will definitely ripen for you, white's a crapshoot and black is a nogo.


Morus alba survived last winter. to small tree to bare fruits. I got Illinois Everbearing so we will see how this hybrid shows. M. rubra is on list but I did not get it yet. Reliable seedling of rubra is easier to source in in comparison with species I listed above.
 
Crt Jakhel
Posts: 129
Location: NE Slovenia, zone 6a
8
bee dog forest garden
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Srdjan Gavrilovic wrote:l
How likely that you could help me to get pitless plum from Slovenia?
http://www.rast-bs.si/katalog/sadne-sadike/sliva/610
http://www.rast-bs.si/CRO/katalog/vocne-sadnice/sljiva/610
I wrote them but they don't seam to be happy to waste time sending a single plant.
I would cover all of expenses you might have.
Btw, I'm almost certain that their chestnuts are hybrids that I'm looking for. I would be interested in Castanea sp they have as well.


We can do that... I'll first look up the Slovenian Post's freight rates so as to not cause any heart attacks But apart from that, I'm fine with ordering from Rast and then re-sending the plants to you. I'll contact Rast to find out the exact cultivar as their description is not very informative.

As to chestnuts, yes, those are all grafted European-Japanese hybrids, they are supposed to have an improved chance of surviving chestnut blight but it really comes down to how strong the disease pressure is in your locale. In Slovenia it's pretty bad. Also, I think not all of the cultivars listed are pollinators, in case that's important for you.

If I remember correctly it's the Chinese chestnut (c. mollisima) that is really resistant to the disease.

Consider also Agroforestry.co.uk's wide list of chestnut cultivars - sadly they seem to be out of stock for this winter https://www.agroforestry.co.uk/product-category/plants/nuts/chestnuts/

Sent you PM with freight rates.

... And the data about plants they offer.
 
Srdjan Gavrilovic
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Crt,
thank you very much for the help.

For chestnuts the biggest problem around here is climate. I talked to a guy who tried to grow C. sativa many times (ordered plants and from seeds) and for last 10 years he had almost no luck. C. sativa is simply not hardy enough for this country. Thus, I would say that chestnut blight pressure here is not the main problem.
I would prefer to get seeds with american chestnut (C. dentata) in pedigree as that would increase chance of getting cold hardy specimens. With chestnuts, I would be the happiest to get one of those impressive trees and nuts are plus but not must have.
 
Crt Jakhel
Posts: 129
Location: NE Slovenia, zone 6a
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bee dog forest garden
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Check your messages https://permies.com/forums/pm/inbox

I would think c. dentata seeds should not be a problem to get on ebay (searched quickly and found several sources).
 
Srdjan Gavrilovic
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Crt Jakhel wrote:
I would think c. dentata seeds should not be a problem to get on ebay (searched quickly and found several sources).


Ebay.com does not give me many hits. Very few every now and then and I'm not sure why you see them and I don't.
Pure C. dentata are very hard to source. Despite what people think they are not extinct but very endangered and hard to identify.

I found few commercial sources of interesting chestnuts seeds in USA (e.g. Dunstan chestnut and many promising hybrids). The problem is that those businesses don't want to bother with orders from EU for 500g-1kg. Thus I turn to individual that either might have some trees in yard or might help to forward an order or two.


P.S. there are topics on this forum that bring the same issues I have with limited solutions.
 
Srdjan Gavrilovic
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Is there anyone, with tasty specimens of these plants, willing to help? When you eat fruits (e.g. pawpaw and persimmons) please save some seeds.
I'll be happy to pay for your "waste".

Specimens growing and yielding tasty fruits/nuts in cold climate (zone 7 and lower) are preferred.
 
Crt Jakhel
Posts: 129
Location: NE Slovenia, zone 6a
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bee dog forest garden
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Srdjan, for pawpaw, check whether this giveaway program is still active: http://www.biodiverseed.com/post/81681239271/grow-the-paw-paw-or-indiana-banana-for-free-with

There is also a guy in Slovenia who has recently started a pawpaw plantation and has already been selling fruit this year... I know him from a local plant enthusiasts forum (gartlc.mojforum.si). I wrote just now to ask whether he can send some leftover seed, or if you prefer, you can contact him directly: http://info9026.wixsite.com/asiminafruit

For castanea, the Chinese one (mollissima) should be both resitant to the disease that is killing sativa throughout Europe and able to handle up to Zone 4; also, this should be a good source https://www.treeshrubseeds.com/specieslist?id=909&ID2=0&g=c - as mentioned elsewhere on the forums: http://permies.com/t/53072/hybrid-chestnuts-seeds-europe

I'm sorry that I can't help you personally with the seed. Our pawpaws are by now 8 years old and there's always been some kind of problem - this year it was the late frost.

They do look pretty though

 
I agree. Here's the link: https://richsoil.com/wood-heat.jsp
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