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Keeping coyotes off my property  RSS feed

 
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Hello again everybody,
   Well again im reaching out to my permies family in need of ways to help keep coyotes off my property.
.    My aunt down the road at the end of my fields dog was attacked tonight by a coyote and I'm scared that they will come down this way and try fooling with my ducks and chickens.  Although I do have the in the barn but I haven't fixed every small hole in it..... I do have a German shepherd and a bird dog/brown Doberman (according to vet) who have free patrol all through the night via doggy door and both go out together. So I guess I'm asking if any of yall have prior experience with coyote problems what did ya try and outcomes. I'm open to anything except traps and snares I have these but we have too many pets to use this method.


Thanks to all,
Zack


Also I've attached a picture of my babies  😊
And a picture of a 4.25 ounce ginseng too I found this past year and replanted here on my property!!
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Posts: 245
Location: Northern New Mexico, Latitude:35 degrees N, Elevation:6000'
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I've lived in coyote country nearly all my life..."aside from a few years of city living", and the one thing that keeps the coyotes at bay....big dogs.  In particular big dogs with strong herding instinct.  The one breed we had that actually kept any coyote from daring step foot on the property was a Maremma.  The Maremma we had was female, and she would actually charge out into the fields at night when the coyotes got too close, and run em off.  I think it was only the young coyotes that would test her boundary, because the older ones had already learned to stay away.
 
gardener
Posts: 1834
Location: West Tennessee
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I've got coyotes around also, but I don't have any dogs, yet. I do use a portable electric net style fence which is easy to move so I can get my chickens on fresh grass regularly. I have not lost a chicken to any four legged predators since using the electric fence.
 
gardener
Posts: 1504
Location: Virginia (zone 7)
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We have plenty of coyotes around here. So many that our local co-op has "coyote contests" each year and awards prizes for the most killed and the biggest killed.

We make sure anything that will attract them is either put up securely at night or kept well away from the house.

Our dairy farmers keep a donkey in the field with their cows. The donkey will guard the herd from coyotes. I wonder if a donkey would protect ducks and chickens.
 
pollinator
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Location: Zone 4, SD
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Coyotes surround me and during the one year I had only one mid sized female dog, they came into the yard frequently and were always trying to lure her out to an ambush.  Her being part German Shepard helped her not fall prey to their tricks I think.  She only has 3 working legs but is fearless and very smart.  

When I had a partner living with me - he peed the perimeter of the property and that seemed to keep all of the potential  predators at bay - racoons and skunks as well as Coyotes.  So send all men out to pee on the trees.

When mu partner left, I started having problems with just the one dog.  A radio going in the goat/chicken barn area and bottle rockets were my only other weapons.  Laugh, if you want, but they worked.  Now I have an un-neutered male dog working with my female and I have no coyote problems.  Everyday until he was six months, I walked him around the perimeter getting him to pee on as many trees as possible every morning and night.  Once I was sick and saw the female take him on that walk.  2 years later and the two of them make that circle every morning and night all by themselves.  Once he got trained not to eat the chickens and not to chase the goats, I haven't had any problems.  He is half Chow, a quarter Malamute and a quarter Wolf.  Amazingly, I m pretty sure that my smaller female is actually braver than he is, but the two make a pretty good team.

So immediately - a radio may help buy you some time.
 
Posts: 211
Location: near Athens, GA
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Eastern coyotes are very aggressive and smart.  A few years ago, I took my little border collie for a walk that went a bit late.  We were coming home down a trail in the Appalachia mountains of NC around sunset.  Suddenly, we were absolutely surrounded by coyotes.  They circled us as we walked, coming in closer and closer.  They certainly intended to kill us.  They were smart and aggressive.  My dog could not scare them off.  They intended to exhaust us.  Thank God, I carry.  I had a little .38 on me.  When They got bold enough to come in close enough so I could see them clearly, I began shooting.  I only had a revolver full of bullets.  As we walked home, the coyotes circled and ... I guess "swarmed" would be the right word... multiple times.  I would shoot one or two and they would retreat... then come back.  Had we not reached home, they would have worn us out and I would not be typing this.  Eventually, we made it home.  The coyotes ran around the house and on t eh porch... sounded like horses....  Now, I trap coyotes!
 
pollinator
Posts: 128
Location: Saskatchewan
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In my experience coyotes are not overly aggressive, although I have lost a few cats to them.
When I was a kid we had a small 20lb ish dog that could keep the coyotes out of the yard by barking at night. I think the barking is the key to keeping coyotes away, they don't have to come close to know that that territory is claimed.

This summer I had chickens in coyote tight tractors. I know they were coyote proof because one morning I found a coyote poop right beside the tractors.

So that is what works for me, barking dogs and well secured poultry.
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gardener
Posts: 443
Location: Sierra Nevadas, CA 6400'
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Where in the world are you located? As Wj mentioned, Eastern Coyotes (Coywolves) are an entirely different breed. They have the strength and power of wolves, with the scavenger instinct and lack of fear of people of coyotes. They are much, much larger and more aggressive than their western counterparts.

I only have experience with Western coyotes, and they are pretty easy to keep away. Put all trash away. Keep a dog. They'll usually leave you alone. I have no experience with Coywolves, but I have heard that guns are the only thing to keep them away. I suspect some electric fencing with some bait might do similar.
 
Wj Carroll
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That experience was in the mountains of NC, near the Blue Ridge Parkway. They are big, aggressive and very smart in the southeast.  They devastate native wildlife and put a lot of pressure on livestock and pets.  It is incredible how much they eat - I believe the average is around 70lbs of meat daily, per each.  They hunt constantly and their numbers are very high.  What they do to deer is awful.  Not only do they kill most fawns, but the pack will exhaust and kill even a big buck.  They also kill dogs.  I'm surprised they haven't killed any kids yet - probably will when the deer populations dwindle.
 
pollinator
Posts: 520
Location: Missouri Ozarks
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To the OP:

You don't have to worry about the coyotes coming down your way.  They're already there.  They're everywhere.

A few small holes in your barn, if they are indeed small holes, will probably not pose a problem.  A coyote is rather big.  (Raccoons and such, though...)   Your concern should be for when the birds are outside.  Be especially cautious at dusk and dawn, and all the hours in between.  Coyotes are smart, and they'll find a weakness and exploit it.

Fencing, to physically keep them away, is a good idea.  A dedicated guardian dog is good too.  Dogs that can go in and out at will won't cut it.  Heck, this past summer we had a coyote coming into our front yard to try to nab chickens, with our dog asleep on the porch 20 feet away.

I understand your aversion to trapping--you don't want to accidentally catch a dog--but you might consider doing a little coyote hunting.  (Permie cred: reduces predator pressure, gives you a salable product [hide], and provides meat for your birds.  There is especial satisfaction in that last bit.  Stacking functions!)
 
Posts: 78
Location: Appalachian Mountains
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I live in southwestern North Carolina and the coyotes (coywolves) are a big problem here.  They can easily jump a six foot fence.  They now inhabit the entire east coast from Maine down to Florida.  They also hunt in packs and take down big game, cows, horses, etc.  I worry so much for my goats, and always have my dog out with them during days and try to keep a lookout myself.  At night they are locked into a secure barn that nothing can get in.  My chickens were being decimated by other critters but the four roosters I have left are smart enough they started coming in with the goats at night and roosting in their barn, which has kept them alive.  

One dog alone is prey, two sometimes keep them run off.  Some farmers have entire herds of livestock wiped out in a single night, it is a big problem.  They especially go after goats and sheep.  I think keeping several guardian dogs (big ones) is the answer.  A donkey is a good guardian, but one alone could not fend off a pack of predators.  I've not seen a single deer this year and they are usually everywhere, and I think the coyotes have decimated them.  
 
gardener
Posts: 5735
Location: Vilonia, Arkansas - Zone 7B/8A stoney, sandy loam soil pH 6.5
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hau Zack, I would not let those dogs do the patrolling for coyotes, they might be able to handle a solo yote but if the pack comes around, the dogs will die.
I have three dogs, one pit bull, one boxer mix and one Catahoula Leopard dog which is bred to hunt wild boars. I call them into the fenced yard or into the house when the coyote pack starts their nightly patrol.
One neighbor had a pack of six LGD dogs and the yote pack got them all one night.

Triple runs of electric fence with a high joule energizer will stop them as will heavy gauge wire tall fences but if they want in they will get in.
Our hogs and the donkey, along with the dogs barking back at the coyotes seems to keep them from wanting to come on our land.
If they ever do show up, I have my .308 sniper rifle ready for them.

Our Coyote hunting club got one not long ago that was the size of a wolf (Hung over the 4 wheeler rack at front shoulders on one side and the back legs were off the rack on the other side).
 
zachary welch
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Thanks all for the advice..... I can hear them howling in the distance on quiet nights not sure what would have brought them in that close that night
 
pollinator
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A 30.06 works pretty well.  

Growing up in rural Kansas, the entire community came out on New Years Day morning, jumped in their trucks, got on their CB's, and went out coyote hunting.  I'd sit in the back of Dad's truck all bundled up and if we got a pack of coyotes flushed out into the field, we'd drop them with hunting rifles.

I know a farmer in Oregon who uses llamas to guard his sheep herd.
 
gardener
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Location: western pennsylvania zone 5/a
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and now to stir the pot

https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/why-killing-coyotes-doesn-rsquo-t-make-livestock-safer/

Why Killing Coyotes Doesn’t Make Livestock Safer

There is no clear evidence that lethal control works to reduce human-predator conflict. It can even make the problem worse
 
pollinator
Posts: 197
Location: Illinois USA - USDA Zone 5b
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We have a good sized pack of German Shepherds here. Thus far the coyotes have not dared set paw on our property. Between the fencing backed by a pack of intense big dogs, I think they would rather go elsewhere.

Now that cougars have reportedly returned to Illinois, however, I suspect we will have to re-evaluate our predator defense at some point. Our males are 100 plus pounds. Our females are 70+ pounds. As a pack they are pretty intimidating to coyotes. Cougars ... I don’t want to risk losing my fur kids to a big cat. But that risk is likely still some years away.
 
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I have a friend that raises sheep.  The best thing she's found are these expensive solar blinkers.  You hook em on the fence and they flash red at night.  When you see them scattered across her property it does seriously look like a bunch of flashing eyes and moving animals!  She keeps one or two along every stretch of fence round her 2-3 acre pastures and has hardly had a problem since she started using them.  She does have to move them every 2 weeks though . She says the coyotes figure out that they're always in the same spot and stop fearing them, so she moves the blinkers periodically.  

But I agree.  A free-ranging dog that's smarter than the coyote is the best.  Two or more dogs is even better.
 
Jen Fan
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Wes Hunter wrote:To the OP:
(Permie cred: reduces predator pressure, gives you a salable product [hide], and provides meat for your birds.  There is especial satisfaction in that last bit.  Stacking functions!)



Feeding chicken predators to chickens has to be one of the best permaculture poultry concepts I've ever heard.  I busted up!  Thanks for that!  
 
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Location: USDA Zone 6b, Coastal New England
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Faye Corbett wrote:I live in southwestern North Carolina and the coyotes (coywolves) are a big problem here.  They can easily jump a six foot fence.    



Yep, I live in an urban area just north of Boston next to a park and light woods and one coyote jumped in and out over my neighbors 5’ chain-link fence like it was nothing. Many neighbors have had their dogs attacked. On the other hand they help manage population of other garden pests around the neighborhood (rabbits, woodchucks, et al).
 
Marco Banks
pollinator
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Wj CarrollIt is incredible how much they eat - I believe the average is around 70lbs of meat daily, per each.[/quote wrote:

That number is difficult to believe.  First, a coyote is 40 to 50 lbs. on average.  There is no way they'd eat 140% their body weight in meat daily.  An average deer dresses out between 75 and 125 lbs.  So if a coyote were to eat that much (70 lbs), a single coyote would take out 200+ deer a year.  In the wild, a coyote can live between 10 - 14 years (much like the lifespan of a dog).  That would be 2000 or more deer taken in the lifespan of a single coyote.  Multiply that by the millions of coyotes in this country, and you quickly realize that if that were their appetite, it would be completely unsustainable.  Even wolves don't eat anything close to that much, and wolves can get as big as 160 or even 180 lbs.

We've got a healthy family of coyotes that move through our neighborhood at night here in Los Angeles county (the southern suburbs), and exactly zero deer or other large game animals.  If they were each eating 70 lbs of meat (or if the entire pack were eating 70 lbs), there is no way they would be sustained.  There are only so many stray cats and homeless people for them to eat.

Some quick internet research brought back a number of 2 to 3 lbs of meat a day eaten by coyotes, the majority of it being rodents, birds and small animals.  The most that a fully grown grey wolf can eat is about 22 lbs, although on average, they need only 7 lbs. a day to be reproductive, and can survive on as little as 2.5 lbs.  

Anyhow . . . sorry . . . it's my annoying habit of correcting things on the internet.

 
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Coyotes got so bad in our area they were in front of our house in broad daylight. If I was capable of hitting what I shot at I would have shot it. Instead I let the LGD's out. Turns out coyotes are way faster than my great pyr. I haven't seen them in front of the house again though.
 
pollinator
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Wj Carroll wrote:Eastern coyotes are very aggressive and smart.


This is interesting to me. I'm not a field biologist, but I've lived amongst wildlife for most of my life (deer, bears, raccoons, packrats, coyotes, and so on).

Our coyotes here are not so big, and their packs are usually not large, and they're shy coyotes.  Oh, definitely, they're a hazard if you're keeping chickens, ducks, or rabbits... or a family cat. But that's about it.

Here's my personal mystery:  We also have cougars here on the British Columbia mainland, and I've seen four without ever going looking for one.  Although the human population of the mainland is probably about 40 times as many people (of all ages & sizes) as on Vancouver Island (off the mainland coast), the statistics for cougar attacks on humans are w a y  disproportionate — whenever the news media carried a story, it was virtually always an inciident that had occurred on Vancouver Island. The human population on Vancouver Island is not generally very dense. So I've wondered if the genetics of the Vancouver Island mountain-lion population is generally different (more aggressive & fearless toward humans) than that of the population here on the Mainland.

Point being that while generalities about a specific species can be interesting, I tend to think there really are no grounds for believing all local populations (say, of coyotes) will behave in terms of the general pattern.
 
gardener
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elle sagenev wrote:Turns out coyotes are way faster than my great pyr. I haven't seen them in front of the house again though.



This made me laugh because my Great Pyr (mostly a pet) is out of shape and really he only runs when he's chasing cars (which he does, badly but safely, ten feet from the road) and his gallop is the slowest canine running speed I have ever witnessed.  I swear it's entirely symbolic and done for fun.  When he actually wants to cover ground for some important purpose, he has a sort of trot I call his "all business power walk" that is at least twice as fast as his running speed.

Every now and then when he decides the local coyote pack is singing a little too close to the house, he'll take off into the night, woofing his mighty woof.  I can't believe he ever gets within a quarter mile, but they usually relocate to an inaudible distance for a week, so it works for me.
 
pollinator
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I do not think it is possible to keep coyotes off a property, you simply have to understand them and work with them.

By that I mean good fences.

Sure a coyote can scale a fence, but they work because it typically means it is easier for a coyote to go after a deer, or a rabbit than a lamb behind a fence. For 10 years fences alone worked, and I live in the heart of coyote country, and in Maine where we have the biggest coyotes in the world. But they are predators of opportunity, make it really inconvenient for them, and they will dine on venison and not lamb.

I got a good deal on a LGD and my Great Pyranees has killed two coyotes, and 2 foxes, and chased off an eagle about to pluck a lamb from the sky. She is old at 7 years, and even has Lyme Disease, but she does her job well still.

But hunting just makes the farmer feel better. Unless you are baiting them, the chances of getting the drop of coyote are very slim. And even if you do, coyotes have done well because they breed litters based on feed availability. If you hunt a bunch out, the next litter is prolific and fills the gap.

High tensile 48 inch sheep fence is expensive, but it serves double-duty; it keeps sheep in, and coyotes out so it is well worth it. For 10 years I relied on it, but now the dog is just added insurance.
 
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I hear the coyotes and it sounds like they are right next door. We had chickens for years with zero problem, then they slowly started disappearing. We blamed the coyotes. Till one morning I saw the fox. So 40 years in the country, zero coyote problems. I’m happy to let them help keep the voles in check. If you don’t see a coyote killing, you just don’t know. Wild dogs, skunks, foxes, bob cats, and the occasional disturbed human are just as likely.
 
Posts: 113
Location: Gaines County, Texas South of Seminole, Tx zone 7b
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On the outer edges of my land I have made small basins for water to fill up and I have seeded prairie grasses and alfalfa, diakon radishes and other vegetation over the years and basically have several hundred rabbits, squirrels, quail and other wild life now.  this in turn helps keep the coyotes away from my main area I am working on.  Though I have anywhere from 8-25 dogs around the place all the time.  Mostly Catahoula and Lab mixes now.  Plus what ever people dropped off on my land if I don't take them to the rescue since I keep most of the bigger dogs out here for the most part as the smaller dogs hawks and owls tend to feast on.  About the only time the coyotes try coming up close to my place now is if a female is in heat or had pups that they try luring out to attack or vise versa.  I tend to use my outer acres as a place to help keep a balance on food and to keep most away from my place.  Still not a 100% way to keep them off but keeps them away for the most part.
 
pollinator
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Travis Johnson wrote:I do not think it is possible to keep coyotes off a property, you simply have to understand them and work with them.



I haven't seen any coydogs or coyote/wolf crosses, but I have plenty of experience with Texas coyote packs. There, they are very smart and not very shy. They will stand in the open near the tree line and stare at you - unless you reach for a rifle and they're gone.

They are pretty hard to shoot unless you do it from the road (illegal) or from the tractor. My neighbor who plowed and planted 50 acres a year for me would get them when he was plowing. He would see them when he was driving one direction, get his rifle ready, and then hit them on the way back.

But it was a coyote that caused a friend's dog to shoot him (not kidding). He was on my place setting a post for me. I left to go get a round bale from another neighbor. When I came back 10-15 minutes later, he was gone and there was a pool of blood on the ground.

Took days for me to find out what happened. The coyote was standing at the tree line staring at him - as they often did. He took his rifle out of the rack in the back window of his pickup, but by then the coyote was gone. Instead of putting the rifle back into the rack, he laid it on the seat (mistake).

When he want to get something out of the truck, his dog jumped onto the seat, discharging the rifle into his thigh. He thought he could drive to the hospital (not sure which one - 15 or 30 miles away). By the time he got to the end of the road he was losing so much blood he knew he'd not make it. So he drove into the little town.

He asked someone to call an ambulance. Ambulance comes and refuses to take him. They call the helicopter. It wasn't until I managed to reach his family several days later that I found out what happened. He said the dog felt so guilty, it ran out in front of a car and killed itself right after he got out of the hospital. (That's what he said.)

Anyway, back to coyotes. The cattle rancher run 2 large burros in every pasture to protect feeder cattle (turned out from weaning through yearling size). Because coyotes are hard to shoot, they have another way of getting rid of them.

They hang exploding meat high enough up in trees that a domestic dog won't jump and coyotes have to keep jumping over and over to get to it. When they finally get a piece *boom* instant death. Note that this is probably not legal.

That said, if you had a smaller place (say 40 acres or so), a couple of aggressive dogs with the run of the place definitely kept coyotes off the property. One friend in California had a male German Shepherd and a female half-wolf. No coyote ever crossed their place and lived to the other side.

On 40 acres and later 80 acres in Texas, we inherited two Weimaraner dogs, a sister and brother. They lit out after the coyote and knocked it flying end over end. Never saw another coyote on either place even though we had chickens and guineas.

There are coyotes EVERYWHERE. In California, they'd stand next to a busy road and watch the traffic go by. But what many don't realize is that there are often bobcats and cougars everywhere, too. You just don't see them that often.

I found out we had one in Texas when it tried to take down a full-size horse and spooked all my horses in that pasture through 3 fences. That mare grazed off by herself - older mare - and she limped. But she could run when she had to and she managed to get away with just a missing chunk out of the point of her shoulder.

Neighbors said "pack of dogs" and "pack of coyotes" and I said no way. Horses will stomp both and post a guard horse (all of them never lay down to sleep at the same time when you run them in a large herd). Then I found the tracks. And talking to my hay guy a few days later, he had seen the cougar cross his place 2 days before.

Experts say you should not take out the established cougar because it only kills enough to live and hunts alone. If you eliminate it, then younger ones move in that don't know how to hunt well and they cause havoc and kill more livestock until they figure it out.

While that might be true if you only have 1 older coyote, too, coyotes reproduce and packs, especially when they're learning to hunt, are a big problem. If you don't reduce their numbers, you're probably going to have worse and worse problems.
 
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