John Wright

let me make it clear that I am not giving away copies of anyones book or anything like that
the information that I present in my workshops are from a number of sources and personal experience.
we do the workshops at the farm. . people come outside and see things in real life after we talk about them
it's a personal choice for me to do it this way. . i just really enjoy it and i don't understand why courses and talks can be so expensive when now is the time for us to get together, put the bs aside and work to make this world better. . .i'm not saying that your not really trying to do that. . i'm just saying that you would reach more of the people who really could benefit from permaculture by including people who didn't get all the breaks that we did.
i think there is so much in economic savings that you and others have developed to save you money in your daily life that a lot of poor people would benefit.. . but they can't afford your talks or a pdc course. .i just think that shouldn't be the case.
2nd ethic
care of people: provision for people to access those resources necessary to their existence
i think permaculture could be that resource.

cities have lots of dumpsters with lots of food in them at all times. . . . while you would be 'leaching' it is possible to live off of other peoples garbage in the city to a greater degree than in the country
there is also an abundance of heat. . not only from the huge amount of thermal mass but also exhaust from variable heat sources (subways, clothes dryers, manufacturing, etc. )

Benefits of the city:
thermal mass
lots of building supplies (urbanite, etc)
access to information (people, computers, paper)
increased vertical space (stacking effects)
lots of hardscape for water catchment
lots of garbage to be turned into gardens and fuels
usually located on or near a body of water that used to be full of life. . we can bring that back
different races of people together in one place often each will have their own foods, taboos, and customs regarding self sufficiency. . great resource.

anyone have any other ones?

I do workshops for the ecology center i work for on sustainable ag, no till, polyculture, hugelkulture. . etc
I don't charge for my time in doing this and I don't feel cheated.
Meeting people who are into this kind of stuff is awesome for me, I love to talk with them and learn about what they are doing to become better at what I do
And build community.

Is your time really worth that much that you can't go out of your way to help someone else learn about permaculture? Especially when they want to learn, it will help them decrease the amount of money they will have to spend over time and make them healthier. I think building community is worth my time.
I believe these things are inherant in permaculture. In listening to Bill Mollison speak i think he has made it clear that there are class issues that need to be addressed in all of this.
I see information about permaculture as getting out to mostly white, middle to upper class people who constantly making the type one error of buying a beautiful piece of paradise, chopping it all down and growing a poorly designed food forest in it's place with tons of material brought from off site.
It boggles my mind.
I think if we put this information in the hands of people who are actually resource strapped, don't shop at whole foods, and who are actually feeling the brunt of this slave wage system that they will show us how it's done. Remember theses are the people who make something out of nothing every day.

a few warm weather greens we tried at the farm this year, , ,
molokheiya (corchoris)- super easy to start from tiny turquoise seeds in greenhouse. translplant well and produce all summer
new zealand spinach (tetragonia)- sporadic but dependable germinator in spring greenhouse. grows well in cool and hot weather
new fall crops. .
salsify (trogopogon)- germ easy . . i transplanted these in sept. . i should have direct seeded some but I went with old reliable seed tray. . they have transplanted well and should go through our zone 6 winter
italian chicory (chicorum) easy germ plants can transplant up to frosts. . bitter, most people don't like them but the plants are really hardy and in the aster family. good for beneficials
mache- can be direct seeded late. . grows well with garlic . seeds ready when garlic is harvested

on our farm we have found mache and italian chicories make a great companion to garlic planted in the fall and they can be planted late as well. . the chicory by transplants and the mache by seed. . if your saving seed from these plants it works out well as they are ready for harvest about july of next year, very close to garlic harvest and just in time to get a catch crop before the fall. . . I'm also trying salsify transplanted and shinguki chrysanthemum (which turned out to be the least hardy of the bunch). . I think bulbing fennel will make it through the winter as well and the blooms are magnificent
phacelia, mustard, arugula, feverfew continue to flower through frosts so far. . . z5

I'm sold on the polyculture . . my customers love the taste and the soil is weed free and improving
note: I just sowed my cover crop right into the mulch and now they are coming up as the summer crops are nearing their end. peas, crimson clover, purple top turnip, groundhog radish
I posted something earlier this summer that might be helpful: )

https://permies.com/t/16080/permaculture/Vegetable-polycultures#141440

I should say that all of the plants in the pictures are transplants... I think it's easier to space them out and generally get the structural parts right
I did experiment with direct seeding carrots, beets, and turnips into prepared beds that were covered in burlap and watered until germ... this worked fairly well with the turnips raging out much faster than I expected... I had some spacing issues.... I was trying to harvest the smaller ones... and that has worked to a certain degree but I think I would like to develop the seed mixes on percentages... like 40 % carrot 30% beet... etc. . .and then get better at broadcasting... eventually...

i second that... looks like dogbane.. the latex is the ringer