Rene Poulin

Interesting classification of asset types.  It makes a lot of sense.  My particular perspective is Anarcho-Capitalist Libertarian and I have developed an edible landscape of apple and other fruiting trees and shrubs.  I manage it not only for fruit production trialing cultivars, but as a nursery reproducing and marketing rootstocks, Scion wood, and seedlings.  

When it comes to mortgages and debt,  I practice debt avoidance at all times.  I have used debt over short time frames of less than 5 years for land and education and less than a year for autos.  In good economic times debt is a gamble with lower risks.  Times like now, are a very bad time for debt, even if you think it’s spent on a so called “Good” asset that conforms to permacultural values.  At all times debt borrows your prosperity in the future and gives it to you now, while ensuring you will be poorer tomorrow.  From my perspective the proliferation of debt has done nothing but create asset bubbles in every sector and driven prices far beyond any rational economic level.  
The productive business that is vital to to the real economy of essential goods and services is handicapped,  while non productive sectors propped up by debt now dominate .  I don’t think we go from here to a better future simply by developing a new ideological framework.  There must and will be an utter collapse of all that is built on debt before we can ever pick up the pieces and rebuild.

My Permaculture plans are a bit light on formal planning and documentation, although it certainly has value as an organization and evaluation tool.  I absolutely agree that financial planning is perhaps even more important.

For me this started when I learned accounting in college.  I developed a budget, recorded expenses and began to save 10% or more of my income.  I ran across the book The Wealthy Barber, from which I learned the principle of “Pay Yourself First”.  This really changed my life.  I discovered others who explained the destructiveness of debt. These were the keys to real personal prosperity where paying yourself first enables you to avoid debt slavery.

In 2007, with a bit of help I saw the GFC of 2008 coming from a mile away.  I developed a much deeper understanding of our credit based monetary system.  I saw that the only value that money had was in a bond that must be repaid.  There are so many of these bonds that no one is actually willing to endure the sacrifice of time and energy required to pay them!  This means that a dollar is worthless, but most people don’t know that YET.  In this light, holding dollars as savings or investments denominated in dollars  does not free you from debt slavery.   So I switched to saving silver and gold.

As for Permaculture my most financially successful project has been my chickens.  I had 3 old hens and I needed to replace them.  I had to order 25 pullet chicks as a minimum.  I didn’t want 25 so I needed to sell most of them.  So I had the cost of the chicks, shipping cost, electricity cost of the brooder lamp for 8 weeks, and feed costs.   Most of the other cost is in the coop construction costs which were low and most importantly my time.  It’s a good thing I enjoy looking after my birds, and they do an awful lot of work cultivating and fertilizing my garden, and how do you put a price on that?  From my perspective they work for chicken feed and when I sold 16 of the ready to lay pullets for $25 each it paid for the entire cost of the feed, electricity, chicks,  and the eight ready to lay pullets that I kept were also fully paid for.  I even had some money left over and added it to some egg money to buy them a nice new electric poultry net!   My chickens continue to pay their own way in this world and I am amazed as a result.

Absolutely, Yes!  I use my chicken tractor in my annual garden for exactly this reason.  I divided my garden area in half and the chickens prevent the growth of grass and weeds on the fallow half every year.  I have a rototiller that I still use to stir up more compact parts but I also often just use a digging fork to do the same thing.  I use straw for mulch and litter and I really would not go back to doing the job by myself.   The gardens productivity has increased by leaps and bounds and I can plant more intensively and use less area than before.

Congratulations, you have what looks like a beautiful home stead.  You said it was affordable, WoW, that’s awesome. You want food security?  Thats  just a matter of time!  The only challenge I see is maybe the cow!  

20 years ago I purchased 5 acres on a north slope, with a basic home, small meadow and wooded hillside.  Today I have a food forest garden, chickens and enough food security to be comfortable.  I am also completely debt free and in semi retirement.  My homestead is not perfect, I wish my house was a bit bigger, and newer.  We considered upgrading but not doing so has given us the opportunity to be debt free and to have more control over our time.

Without time not spent at an outside job or business attaining food security is much more difficult.  It’s just one more thing to be done and most people don’t bother as a result. I am surrounded by people who live on rural acreages but do not have the time to do much about food security or business building because they have big mortgages and auto loans.  So be careful what you wish for!  

Yes, I understand, I have a solar system in my RV and it is useless in the winter.  Kaarina, can you tell me how it is that you are using your sauna for a chicken coop?  Do you have a new sauna?  I have studied sauna construction and if I were one of your chickens I would want you to fire up the sauna stove!  LOL!

Very nice photo, you have access to the water!  

I understand Kaarina , it is a big job to fill a space like yours by hand from the forest!  The water freezing is the biggest problem we face in winter.   Do you have electricity or are you off- grid?

Kaarina Kreus wrote:My chicken house used to be the sauna bathouse. It has the hotroom and a dressing room. The hotroom can be heated, but the dressing room cannot. Thus there is a thick substrate in the dressing room, which I am at pains to get composting.

The substrate has all the poop produced by the flock of 25 and I have mixed it occasionally with a fork. It has smelled wonderful all the time, which in itself is a great thing. But it just does not heat up.

I may have overdone the amount of hay: I bring in new hay from the adjoining field every day. If that is the case, what would correct it? Humanure?

I covered the substrate with spruce cuttings in an attempt to "put a lid" on it. No idea if that was wise.

The waether forecast for the upcoming 10 dayd promises below zero Fahrenheit. I would really need the extra heat.

Hi Karina!  I keep my chickens in the cold northern latitudes of Canada and I use straw on the floor of my coop which is the frozen ground.  Temperatures down to -50 degrees C.  I originally thought my chickens might get cold feet but as long as the straw is dry it insulates very well from the cold ground.  In order for the litter to compost it would need to to be moist.  It would also need to be deep like 45-60 CM.  It could freeze solid during the coldest times and would loose its ability to insulate the birds feet from the cold.  Compost also gives off ammonia which is harmful to your birds.  If the litter is dry and smells nice that’s perfect.   When winter is over pile up the dry litter and add some water. It will likely heat up then and break down quickly into soil.  Your chickens will do best in the cold with DRY litter.

Looks like a pullet to me too Tim.  I think Black Australorps are an amazing breed.  Such great layers for a dual purpose bird that is not a hybrid.   Such lush Brussels sprouts leaves too, most of the cabbage family seems to be food chickens really appreciate.

Jay Angler wrote:Has anyone had experience with French Sorrel and/or Swiss Chard and chickens? Both have Oxalic acid in them and both grow *really* well in my climate.

I've been giving some of the girls the French Sorrel once a week or so, and on a per/bird basis, not very much. I'm not sure that it's growing faster than the kale, or only appears to be because I've been hesitant to give them very much of it. They don't object, but I don't want to overwork their little kidneys!

However, it's in a different family, and Cole family crops can get Root-Knot Nematode if you grow too much of it or for too long in one area. That's really easy to do with kale/cabbage as it self seeds, loves my climate, I've got a couple of plants that are about 5 years old,  and the birds adore it.

My climate isn't good for drying summer greens as winter feed as we're so damp year round. I'm really looking for more winter greens that aren't in the Cole family.

I feed both French sorrel and Chard/Beets. I have fed Rhubarb and Comfrey as well.   I try not to overdo the quantity but I have found that if my chickens eat too much of something the first time they will definitely be more choosey about how much of it they eat the next.  You can put it in their run but like children you can’t force them to eat unless you really starve them!