Andrew Roesner

Anne Miller wrote:To me, it seems that the Hairy Vetch can be managed by mowing before it sets seed.

Why not plant edible crops instead?  Turnips instead of daikon radishes?

Crimson clover instead of Hairy Vetch?

Why not? Because that's what I chose to plant. daikon is edible, but I have no interest in eating it. Or turnips for that matter. Do you always reply to questions by telling someone what you think they should have done instead of simply answering the question?

I've finally had enough of maintaining a lawn in my front yard, and I'll finally have the time in the coming years to commit to a very serious veg garden, so to get started I planted a fall cover crop of daikon radish and hairy vetch on my front yard. I've kept it well watered and we've had unseasonably warm days this fall so it doing great! I'm fully read up on all the details regarding these two cover crops: The daikon radish will winter kill and leave behind some very well aerated soil and lots of organic material, while the hairy vetch will go dormant over the winter and burst forth with new growth in spring, and once it flowers I'll kill it so it doesn't drop seed.

What I'm wondering is what will happen to the vetch if I mow the yard in a few weeks after we have a hard frost? My goal here is to collect all that green leaf material from the radish to use for a very large compost pile that will be ready in the spring. I'd prefer to gather that nitrogen rich organic matter and store it as compost as opposed to letting it rot in place and the radish is dead anyway, but what will happen to the vetch? I'm presuming the vigorous  spring growth I'm expecting will come from the vetch root system and the existing vetch vines will more or less winter kill as well. Am I correct in this? I've also read plenty about how hard it is to get rid of vetch once it's established but I'm guessing this is a result of seeding and not being able to mow or kill the area because there are other plants that are desirable.

I'd love to hear anyone's experiences with vetch and whether or not mowing it down after a hard frost will kill it, or will it come back in the spring as hoped?

here's some good info about the affects gypsum has on soils, if indeed you are using gypsum:

http://www.cmtmi.com/gypsum.asp

Thanks for the reply R Jay. I've done all the math and I understand how to calculate the circumference or a circle. I'm hoping someone might be able to give me an idea on what radius to use for the bender without having to resort to trial and error. The 41' i mentioned is the distance between the ends of the hoop after bending. That distance *should* be about 31' -32' for a 30' diameter greenhouse. In other words, hoops bent on bender built on a 15' radius produced a "diameter" of 41'.  

Hi All!

I am in the midst of building my own hoop house. it's 30' wide and 95' long. The many "build your own greenhouse" websites that sell hoop benders don't make a 30' bender so I'm making my own. The first version is a 4'x 8' sheet of plywood cut in half length wise and screwed together. I stretched some masonline out to a 15' radius and traced the arc on the plywood. I used the cut out from that to add a 3rd ply in the middle of the two sheets and set it back about a half inch so the there is a groove where the hoop can rest while bending.

I gave it a try on saturday and everything works fine, except the hoops do not form a 30' diameter. not even close. I'm using 2 24' lengths of 1 5/8" top rail to create the hoop. the obvious answer is that the hoops snap back a bit after bending and so I'm guessing the radius of the bender needs to be less than 15'. the question is, HOW MUCH LESS!?! the approximate diameter when the hoops are assembled on the ground was 41'. I know that the diameter when assembled should be a foot or two wider so that the hoops will have some tension when setting them, but this is too much.

does anyone have a suggestion of what radius to try to achieve my desired 30' diameter. is there maybe an equation? i've looked quite a bit but i've not found anything on the interwebs. does anyone have a link to point me in the right direction??

I found a website that mentions a 10% spring back which means i might want a 13.5' radius. I'd hate to cut a new radius and end up with it too narrow!

Thanks for the help!

Travis Johnson wrote:In life there are things we want to do, and then there are a few surprises. As farmers we just have to roll with it. In this case, I would just sow down winter rye exclusively and you will be well ahead in the Spring time. Is it the ideal mixture you wanted? No, but it was not your fault, delays happen, so use what you can this year, and next year try your ideal cover crop mixture when you can get an earlierjump on it. Winter rye by itselfis an excellent cover crop and why so many farmers rely on it.

Hi Travis. Thanks for framing the problem in this way. We so often want to make everything just exactly perfect! The Winter Rye will certainly thrive if planted soon. I think I'll go ahead and plant some vetch with it as well. Our warm sunny days in autumn keep the soil reasonably warm well into November.

Todd Parr wrote:I use tillage radish a lot, but if it doesn't have at least 8 weeks or so before it frost-kills, it will have pretty limited growth.  If you have 8 weeks, I would try it.  Otherwise I would save the seed for later.  Nothing says you can't plant tillage radish in the spring as long as you don't need that area for planting then.

Hi Todd. Thanks for giving me that time frame. I don't think we have 8 weeks unfortunately. And that radish seed is a bit pricey! I like the idea of planting some in the spring. I use no more that 4 acres next spring so the rest will be in cover again for the summer.

Thanks Ryan, sounds like Daikon might still be on the list! I'm planting it for its ability to grow huge tap roots and break up the soil and then leave lots of organic matter behind so it wont be harvested (well, maybe a couple!), but if you think it will germinate and grow well until the soils freeze then I might try it!

Drew, looks like tick beans might be what we call fava beans up this way? Thanks for the recommendation! They might work great in this system!

Hey All,

FINALLY! I have ~16 acres of Northern Colorado farmland in my possession. The corn has been off the land for almost a month now but I didn't hear about it until last week. But that's a whole other story! I very much want to cover crop this fall, IF it's still possible. My plan is to plant Hairy Vetch at 30# per acre, Daikon Radish at 20# per acre, and Winter Rye at 80# per acre. The previous farmer is willing to prepare the soil and we've also found someone with a seed drill setup who will plant for us. We access to all the irrigation water we could ever need. The farm is zone 5B. My goals for cover cropping this fall are building soil organic matter, building soil nutrients, and suppressing weed growth. Any cover crop planted this fall will chopped and dropped on the spring and a spring cover crop planted. My questions for you:

Is it too late to plant that mix of crops? Is it too late to plant any mix of crops? Do you have any ideas for cover crops that I could plant now (in the next week) that would be more successful than those proposed above?

of the three the one i'm most iffy on is the daikon radish. I don't think the roots will get all that big in the remaining time we have and the seed is expensive.

Thanks for the help!

Daron Williams wrote:A note on wood chips and nitrogen. If you don't till in the wood chips and just leave them on the surface you should not see a decrease in N levels. My understanding is that the locking of soil N only happens when you bury the wood chips or till them in.

Thanks Daron. Any idea how wood chips on the surface can reduce soil pH? Perhaps over a very long time frame as they break down?