Fermentation+potassium chloride+high blood pressure

Lactofermentation of vegetables has many established health benefits. But a key ingredient is salt, lots of it.

sodium chloride's effects on high blood pressure are similarly well documented. So right off the bat, a large segment of the world's population would be eating a poison if they wanted to benefit from lactofermentation.

A common salt replacement is potassium chloride. In wanting to share my ferments with people who have high blood pressure, it occurred to me to replace the brine with a potassium chloride solution, Proportionate in concentration.

Interestingly potassium chloride should not be used by people who have kidney problems, a common side effect of high blood pressure. So I still don't see a solution to that. But given the benefits of potassium chloride, which is sold as a supplement, Wouldn't it be a healthier brine with a similar taste?

It certainly looks like lactobacilli, L. plantarum anyway, would be encouraged by a potassium chloride brine. Too bad i can't see the whole article, Perhaps there's something I could yet learn about fermenting cucumbers.

https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/abs/10.1111/j.1365-2621.1986.tb13099.x

Thoughts? I'm ready to try this and die!!

Potassium in large quantities affects heart function much more directly than sodium does. You could also try magnesium chloride (Epsom salt), but it can result in emergency sprinting to the bathroom. Best to stick with sodium, IMO.

Interesting to note that "Potassium" is used to "lower" blood pressure...

But yes you are right people with reduced kidney function have to watch out for increased Potassium.  I have reduced kidney function and high blood pressure, my kidney function 15 years ago was at 58%.  Five years ago when I started being treated for high blood pressure I was at 180/106 resting bp my kidney function was at 54%.  After five years of controlling my bp with atenolol my kidney function is now at 71%.

I would say that anything that in my case anything that helps lower bp will likely in the end benefit my kidney function.  My blood test from week before last put me on the lowest end of the sodium chart without actually being a "low" reading.  My Potassium was in the lower 25th percentile range of normal.

I do a lot of fermented vegetables though I don't add any salt or anything to them, I just boil them in vinegar and then allow them to ferment for a month a two in old pickle jars.  I just pour it in hot and then put the lid on, the cooling of the water seals them quite nicely.  I don't honestly know how you are supposed to do it, that is just the way that I have been doing for the last couple decades.

I might try some potassium chloride just to see if it helps with the bp...

Thanks for the post, may be some useful info for me...

Dom's Kefir Site is dense with fermentation information, including saltless kraut with almost any vegetable or combination.  Maybe adding a touch of salt to taste after fermentation is a solution?  That's what I've done.  I've only ever tried saltless fermentation.  A couple little kefir grains do the job well enough that not a single batch has been lost.  Not even the first, which I attribute to excellent, thorough instructions and beginner's luck :.)  Those little kefir grains are mighty.

Kefirkraut is a naturally pickled cabbage developed without the use of salt, vinegar or any other added preservative. The process relies on the native microflora of both cabbage and kefir grains to ferment and then preserve the culture food-product. The conversion of starches and sugars [found in vegetables] into natural vinegar [acetic acid], lactic acid and other organic acids are the compounds produced through fermentation, and which are responsible for naturally preserving kefirkraut.

If a starters like say milk kefir or water kefir is used then no salt is needed for fermentation.
Eaters will then have the option to salt to taste/salt for health when they have a plate in front of them and they are ready to eat.

I never heard of kefir fermentation! Thanks! How exciting. I will try it very soon. Though explaining to folks how THAT works, and is good for them, will probably be even more challenging than traditional brines ;)

( though I continue to have an interest in a potassium chloride brine and I'm sure I will try it someday )

I think that starter fermentation is easier to explain.
Just like making yogurt/wine/beer/sourdough you add a starter aka a packet of yeast/kefir grain/whey/etc. They multiply and out compete the bad microbes and release compounds like alcohol/acids and aromatic compounds that discourage the bad microbes. And then once you are ready to eat you can season to taste. So a family of 4 can have 1 person add no salt but the other 3 add mounds of salt, or if someone like super spicy food, they can add a ton of pepper.

I do like the idea of switching some if not all of the salt away from NaCl to KCl. When we are alll healthy and 18yrs anything goes but as we age 35/65/75 we have to be more mindful. I am still a firm believer in drinking more water, getting more sleep, yoga/de-stress, and eating more greens and real fermented food. Those we are 100% in control of but then we say we don't care enough to make a change and then fumble around looking for cure-all/magical mudbath/herb/pill/holistic doctor/government/supermarket to fix things. If we don't care enough why should others, alright my ranting is done.

Cabbage seems to be rife with lacto bacillus.
I find that even triple washed,  bagged,  conventionally grown shredded cabbage will start to ferment.

One idea I had for advantaging lacto bacillus without adding salt was carbonated water.
Carbonated water has little or no disolved oxygen,  so it might be considered extra anaerobic...

I have been making overnight oats with a dollop of homemade yogurt, and it seems to be fermenting.
That said,  I have heard that the lacto bacillus strains used to ferment dairy might not be adapted to grains and vegetables.
I wonder if they work the way fungus does, adapting to what is available.

I use two small milk kefir grains to ferment mixed vegetables in a gallon jar with usually about half cabbage, half other veggies.  A single milk kefir grain will make a no-yeast bread that has a nice, mildly sourdough flavor.  Sooo yummy.

The key is keeping grains with different purposes separated.  Including utensils.  

Yemoos has useful information about adapting grains for different uses.  Once a group of grains is used for one purpose, they get wonky when returned to a previous use, say milk or water.  Imagine a set of bacteria has developed for one purpose.  Then get shoved into an entirely different environment without opportunity to adapt.  They can get funky in all kinds of ways when shocked :.)  However, when gradually and properly introduced to a new environment, they can adapt within certain perimeters.

I haven't had time or storage space to allow much experimentation outside kefir milk products, however I've learned most all I know so far from Dom's Kefir Site (linked above) and Yemoos.

Fredy Perlman wrote:
sodium chloride's effects on high blood pressure are similarly well documented. So right off the bat, a large segment of the world's population would be eating a poison if they wanted to benefit from lactofermentation.

One of the first things my sister told me she learned in studying nutrition is that it is not the amount of sodium that is the problem. It is when sodium is out of balance with potassium that it becomes a problem.

Think of most people with high blood pressure or heart disease. They often eat a S.A.D. (Standard American Diet) that is high in processed foods, high in sugar, high in inflammatory fats, LOW in vegetables, and, yes, high in sodium.

Guess what has loads of potassium to help balance all that sodium? Vegetables.

When eating good, healthy fats that are anti-inflammatory, I've heard that your liver needs salt to process the fats well. Eating a lot of veggies provides potassium to keep that salt in balance.

I don't know the studies involved, but my guess is that the high sodium related to high blood pressure and heart disease is probably more related to the S.A.D. diet than the sodium.

I am probably a heretic, but I imagine those folks who can reduce their sugar (alcohol is a huge culprit for some), reduce their refined processed foods, add in more veg and whole real foods, plus change to healthier fats, will find that their blood pressure drops even if eating a lot of salt.