Sustainable Living

Hello to all permies.  I would first like to introduce myself as I am new to this forum.  I am a 60+ female looking to leave the grid and live green in sustainable shelter.  I'm hoping my oldest son will join me as his heart has been drawn to living off the grid for many years.  It will be 3 years max until I am commitment free (presently providing care for newborn granddaughter) and able to leap off the grid which gives me ample time to research what, where and how.  

Where seems a logical place to start.  After many hours of looking for a small parcel of land online for the purpose of budgeting the results have been somewhat frustrating.  The cheap land in Oregon, Arizona and New Mexico show up on the net as high crime areas.   Anyone out there support this data?  Or strongly disagree?  I am a currently a displaced Pacific NW person with preference of returning but not set in stone.  (Can't wait to set things in stone!)  Have also read Oregon and Washington are somewhat off-the-grid friendly and that's a plus.

Being a private, mostly keep-to-myself person, communes do not appeal to me although I enjoy socializing with like-minded people.  It has occurred to me that there are others, such as myself looking for sustainability and finding roadblocks.  It would be uplifting to live near and socialize with other like-minded folks.  

A few other things to note for anyone interested in responding and looking for like-mindedness, I am drawn to the earthship design minus the use of tires.  Using adobe (or cob) over concrete appeals to me.  Some of the sustainable building internships offered are appealing as well, and hope to become involved in the future.

The few people I have mentioned my aspirations to shrug their shoulders and think I'm nuts.  Any support would be very much appreciated.

Thanks to all for their helpful posts on the most important topics on our planet.

I like cob and strawbale and earthbag and the combination using all 3.
earthbag for stemwall/foundation. strawbale for insulation, covered with a cob plaster.
Some wood framing will have to be involved for the roof, possible a metal roof.

So far it looks like Southwest florida is where I will make it happen.

When it comes to high crime areas, I think that most criminal only harrass people they know.
So as long as I don't owe someone money for the drugs I bought on credit and I am not walking around with $100 bills falling out my pocket, most people don't care enough.

And if you have to be a person in the community that everyone knows, be the crazy worm/legume/etc lady. Hand out flyers about how wonderful soil life and worms are.

I personally think that out of every 100 person that gets raped/robbed/assaulted/stolen credit card/killed, 80 of them knew the person to the point where they have slept over at there house (family member/partner/best friend). Another 10 knew the person in passing and less than 10% id truly random stray bullet or crazy criminal that just randomly attached you.

I think $10,000 per acre is a good price to start at if you are getting 5acres or more, in terms of price.
While I like eco building material. I am not afraid to use foam insulation and cement post and beam with stucco(cement) finish/drywall

You might like this house plan let me know what you think of it.

Welome to permies!


I think there's a lot to what S says about crime, up to a point.

I've had a few people tell me that a street with an Angel house on it is the safest place to live... nobody fucks with the Angels.

In a place where gangs are disputing matters stray bullets, and mistaken identities, are a very real risk. Does your car look like one that a gangers brother drives?

But the majority of crimes are not murders or rapes, they are theft and property crimes, especially petty crimes of opportunity by people who need to pay their dealer a lot more than they need to respect your private property.  This is where you encounter a lot more 'stranger crime'.

Stats are a hard way to get a feel for safety, I think I'd visit a place to check it out if crime statistics were the only thing spoiling it on paper..


When I was considering moving to the US, in 2015, I was leaning towards the Olympic Peninsula somewhere around port townsend, it ticked a lot of boxes for me. On the other hand I heard that this was where druggies from larger cities would go for a 'vacation', and there was certainly a noticeable population of homeless folks and rubber tramps when I passed through.

Since I intended to live well out of town with a gate, a dog, and a shotgun, this wasn't a big deal to me.

S Bengi:  You might like this house plan let me know what you think of it.

You read my mind.  This is very close to my vision for my dream underground house.  I have the land with a good slope to dig into with full southern exposure for a solarium along the front.  As far as your plan goes, I have a few suggestions.

1.   If this is for a homestead or small farm, I don't think you need the large wrap around closets.  I currently have one loosely packed 5-ft closet in my bedroom, I've been here almost 4 years and haven't worn about 3 feet of it.  What I do wear is 4 or 5 pairs of jeans that I could store folded on a shelf, half-a-dozen work shirts, and in winter 3 fleece shirts and 2 fleece hoodies.  My outerwear is hanging on hooks in my mud room by the back porch.  I only dress up for church, weddings, or funerals, so I rotate 2 suits that I keep in garment bags and a couple of dress shirts.  The rest of my wardrobe from my office days, skiing, and formal attire just takes up space.  I should take it all to a thrift shop and probably will soon, as I'm almost finished renovating the master bedroom at the other end of the 14x70 trailer I'm currently living in and will be moving all my bedroom furniture and clothing to that room so I can start renovating my current bedroom for guests.

2.  I would switch the pantry and bath so that bath would be closer to the bedroom it is associated with.

3.  I'd switch the sink and stove for efficiency because I move between the fridge and stove more often than from fridge to sink.  I use overhead cabinets near the sink for dishes and put canned goods and spices and the like in cabinets between the stove and fridge.  I installed drawer cabinets beside the stove for cooking utensils, potholders, aprons, hand mixer, etc., and next to the sink under the dish cabinet for silverware, dishcloths, towels, wraps, etc.

4.  The entry is large enough for a mud room with storage bench and racks for outerwear, boots, etc.

5.  You might want to consider a 2nd entrance on the E side of greenhouse for added safety and better ventilation of the greenhouse.

6.  I'm planning a cantilevered roof extending out over the solarium enough to block summer sun from overheating the interior rooms while allowing full winter sunlight.

7.  Also, a gambrel shaped greenhouse roof would allow more headspace and use smaller glass panels to be replaced in the event of storm damage.

8.  I'd want a wood stove or RMH for backup heat, though you may not need that in SW Florida.