Allen Herod

I used to work in sign fab and have recently ventured out on my own and have the things needed to make any kind of signage. I used to make "simulated" sandblasted wood signs out of a dense foam type material. I've always wanted to make some with real wood. When wood is sandblasted it gets low spots along the grain but the hard veins stay high (best I can describe) Here is a google search of examples...
https://www.google.com/search?q=sandblasted+wood+signs&newwindow=1&tbm=isch&tbo=u&source=univ&sa=X&ei=mXOqUuqjIqnf2AW40YHQDA&ved=0CE0QsAQ&biw=1707&bih=1103
Although, Im guessing you would like at least most of the wood left natural looking. Seems like I may have noticed a couple black locust trees on my property, I'll have to go see if I can find them. I do have lots of Osage orange and cedar that might be good. Shoot me an email with more detail of what you want, maybe we can work something out. travelingpen@yahoo.com

Dave Hunt wrote:I like your ideas. My wife wants to start raising some meat chickens next year (we have layers now) she also suggested raising a few turkeys (naming them Thanksgiving and Christmas her joke not mine). You said you have about 1000 trees? How many acres do you have planted with trees? How long did it take from planting to harvest? Do you have any good bulk sources for seedlings? I was thinking about planting a few trees (50) on my property for Christmas trees. It would be pretty neat to make a tradition of taking my boys (20 months and newborn) out to cut down our Christmas tree every year.

The turkey names gave me a good laugh.... I really want some donkey's, I've already picked their names. Bad, Sweet, Stinky and if I could ever get a poitou donkey, his name would be Hairy. The Ass family, some of them even have middle names Sorry to get off subject.

I bet it would be VERY easy to propogate Osage cuttings. My land is covered with them, big and small. If you cut it down it grows back like a weed unless the stump is dug up or burned... Different topic I know but has anyone ever used the Osage wood in any kind of timber framing? If so, I would love to see pics. I have some that are HUGE and have surprisingly straight sections. Many of the big ones don't seem to be producing fruit anymore but younger trees near them are.


One more thing, my old redneck neighbor calls it a "M. F.'er Tree" (ok a little more french than that).... Cause "It don't matter how ya grab it, that mother F 'er is gonna stick ya!" haha

I'm not necessarily suggesting the use of an actual turbine in the system (unless absolutley needed to make the circulation happen), just the recirculation concept, if even possible, for added efficiency. I realize the pressures are NOWHERE near the same. I agree that any change down the line in this manner is going to change intake and burn (recirc. could be shut on and off as needed with a flue) and as I said previosly, various size pipes would be needed to make the pressure/draw happen and still should not let smoke off in the room with controling of the recirculation. Maybe you wouldn't open it until a good fire was going. And, I think you are incorrect about the operation of the diesel turbo not functioning until a higher rpm, as diesel engines are designed to operate high torque at low rpm anyways. Yes there is more recirculation pressure created (and you actually hear the turbo wind up) at higher rpm, but the turbo is running even at idle.... trust me, even at idle, the turbo on a diesel engine would try to suck your hand in if you put it up there (I've put my hand up there, lucky to still have all my digits). I thought this would start a good discussion. If the concept worked, I guess we could then call it a "TRMH"

As I said above, I believe the vertical plane of a recirculation system would be very important for this to properly work. (IE. the recirc. port would probably need to be as low as possible, due to the low pressures... AND pipe size will have an effect.

One more edit: Think about the natural draw already happening from the burn and the siphon effect... Siphoning can happen with air just barely skimming over an open port. Just a 1/2 inch recirc pipe might make a signicant difference in burn.

Kevin, not exactly a closed loop. Yes, a loop but there is still chimney exhaust and outside oxygen coming in to feed the fire.

Jim LaFrom wrote:

Allen Herod wrote:Maybe this has been tried. Forgive me, I haven't read all the RMH stuff but here's my brainstorm (possibly a brain fart). I saw some discussion on the intake coming from inside or outside. I'm on the bandwagon that it needs to come from inside for healthy air exchange. Now for my brain fart... What about an exhaust recirculation back into the burn chamber, much like a turbo charger on a diesel engine? On a turbo diesel engine (I believe this is the concept) fresh air is pulled in but exaust is also forced back into the intake (via the turbo, driven by exhaust pressure) creating more fresh air draw (kind of like a siphon effect) but also recirculating heat that would otherwise be lost out the chimney. Maybe it has been tried and failed or is already part of the system and im missing it. Seems like a possibility to me and should boost the initial heating up of the system at the very least? It would possibly increase air exchange in the room but also generate more heat in return. Point me in the right direction if I am missing something.

I think the goal for this project is to have everything be done as 'passively' as possible. (No other energy inputs.) As you well may know, turbo chargers involve compressors and re-circulation under pressure which is nice for the technology in cars, jets and watercraft but for the purposes of this discussion/ brainstorming session we are looking for as simple as possible. Those Turbos need other energy inputs and at the end of it all would be a net energy loss.. Just re-venting the smoke back into the fire chamber without some sort of closed loop would just force smoke into the room because of the open feed tube. Secondly cooling the smoke too much, without forced air circulation would kill any draw to vent to the exterior resulting in SRS, smoky room syndrome.

Any ideas of forced air movement, turbocharging, outside air sources really need to be focused into a 'batch fed', airtight, system. Essentially a wood burning stove.Keep brainstorming though. We need to keep those neurons activated.

I figured I might get some turning wheels with this idea... A turbo charger (technically) DOES NOT involve "outside power" to turn a compressor. You may be confused with a super charger that is belt driven by the engine. A turbo differs, in that it is driven by wasted exhaust fumes(no electricity or belts turn it), making it at least somewhat "passive" in my opinion. If it weren't there, yes there would probably be less energy input (in this case more or less wood). However, that little extra input comes out exponentially on the other side (hypothetically in a RMH, more heat). In my mind, this system wouldn't even need the "turbo" to create the same effect. Instead, if the pipes ranged in size and were on the proper plane to work together, it should, in my theory, naturally aspirate... just the same as a draw is created thru the intake and out the chimney I think, unless we have a math genius out there, experimentation would be the only way to prove or disprove this theory.... And I personally know a "mathmetician" (spelling?) with a masters degree that couldn't solve a simple geometry problem for me a few years ago, so I would have doubt in any mathmatical "proof" against this. I know "turbo" sounds like alot of energy and waste but it doesn't have to be. Just food for thought.

Maybe this has been tried. Forgive me, I haven't read all the RMH stuff but here's my brainstorm (possibly a brain fart). I saw some discussion on the intake coming from inside or outside. I'm on the bandwagon that it needs to come from inside for healthy air exchange. Now for my brain fart... What about an exhaust recirculation back into the burn chamber, much like a turbo charger on a diesel engine? On a turbo diesel engine (I believe this is the concept) fresh air is pulled in but exaust is also forced back into the intake (via the turbo, driven by exhaust pressure) creating more fresh air draw (kind of like a siphon effect) but also recirculating heat that would otherwise be lost out the chimney. Maybe it has been tried and failed or is already part of the system and im missing it. Seems like a possibility to me and should boost the initial heating up of the system at the very least? It would possibly increase air exchange in the room but also generate more heat in return. Point me in the right direction if I am missing something.

Dale Hodgins wrote:I would truly like to be dictator of the Americas, but my chances are so slim, that it's not something I lose much sleep over.

No No Dale, You just need to learn to be serious, funny and lie thru your teeth.... As the liquor store marquee on the way to my farm said during the last election, "Want to get elected into office? Tell a joke, all the other politicians are."

I didn't read all the replies to the original post but here's the $0.02 of a guy not much older than you (and I'll admit probably less wise)... and I won't go into the number of schools and dollars wasted on them after high school (much less... ok more, the fun I had haha). I never earned enough credits to be a sophomore, I did however complete a technical school by the skin of my teeth haha (they didn't like that I took advantage of "my allowable missed time" 1.5 days a week if i recall, to make money and get real life job experience. They wanted to suspend me and make me pay more money for skating the thin ice when I had two weeks left. I finished on time and they still gave me that paper I paid for and don't use tho.) ... First, I think a college education is way over rated. There are people out there that really think everyone should go to college... I think they are off their rocker or need to find one (does my trash man or the burger flipper at Mc-ee-D's really need a law degree or something?) . Second, I believe there is alot of mis-information passed along in secondary education (I learned lots of better ways to do things on the job than I did in a class). This is partially (probably mostly) due to the people teaching are teachers, teaching what they were taught out of a book and they don't have the real world experience to prove or disprove what they are saying (Nothing against techers, but, I mean the book says it, it must be true right?). It sounds like you probably have quite a few credits. You pursued a music teaching career, and an ag career correct? I never took it but in high school, some of my friends favorite classes and teacher were agriculture. If you have enough of the right credits you could complete a teaching degree in this. Teachers have outstanding benefits, decent real world pay (not getting rich but making a living) and alot of their summer off. AND WE NEED MORE GOOD TEACHERS! OK, so maybe that doesn't sound awesome... But it will gain you the credibility and money you are looking for now. I can assure you we've all had to work some un-awesome jobs (I won't even go into my resume) but it, hopefully, will lead us to success and enjoyment in life. When the goin gets tough, the tough get goin. Keep on keepin on and do what feels right not what someone tries to push on you Again, just my opinion (an uneducated person in many peoples eyes)

That is definately a machine weld or someone at least halfway knows how to stick weld Mine is slightly curved (draw knife that is). I made it out of a piece of old leaf spring from a jeep I put new suspension on. I also used the spring eye and cut out one side of some high carbon angle to make a froe. Haven't had the chance to use either yet but should in the near future.