Laurie Fen

Hugo Morvan wrote:Good idea. But for obtaining landrace seeds or adaptation agriculture movement as it has been dubbed now there is a worldwide organization that offers them. It's called GoingToSeed. I direct people there towards Permies site if i can, because to me permaculture and adaptation gardening are two strings on a bow reinforcing each other. They have a box travelling differing continents called the Serendipity Seed Swap or the European Seed Train in which people can put seeds that do well at their place and they can take what they like to try. I never had something boost my arsenal of crops i can suddenly grow as much as that. And i'm in Europe where we don't even have so many people's breeders as in US.
Exchanges is great, but i've just traveled an hour to one and there was one other man sitting at a table with scruffy envelopes of 2021. He was very pleased to see me though and so where the ten or so other visitors. my advice would be NOT to try to set up something apart, you know, like Permies only, but just pitch your idea to local seed swaps that already exist. Enthusiast gardeners are a dying breed and the grey hairs at those fairs are happy with all the younger people they can get to join and just have to come to terms with the fact that the younger generations see things in a much wider context than they do. Change goes slowly. First they laugh at you, then they fight you and then you win. There is a great book about Landraces by Joseph Lofthouse and there is David the Good who's done some great interviews about it as well.
We're also talking about breeding landrace shrubs, trees and cows and chickens, so this idea has come a long way already! You're not alone!

Awesome! I will look into it! Definitely would like to build on existing momentum rather than trying to start from scratch. Thank you for the tip!

M Ljin wrote:This is interesting! I might like to think about setting something up.

Reminds me a little of assisted migration—are you thinking about that at all?

Yes! That was part of what I was thinking--didn't want to necessarily do super long distance exchanges that could introduce potential problematic "pests" (although I am very "innocent until proven guilty" with introduced species; most "invasives" are turning out to fill niches IME). But I would love to help bring some of the Southern Appalachian species that may start to struggle in coming years up to my area--and help my local species move to climates that may be more suited for them in the future.

One of the other commenters mentioned that some of this infrastructure may already exist, so perhaps we just need to pile on rather than reinventing the wheel!

Lucky!

I would use them in this order, as they break down over time:

1. Build a winter shelter for a feral cat that I have been unable to catch + build it/ pile the extras around my house foundation as extra insulation + wind breaks for the winter.

2. Plant in winecaps in the spring (Northspore has some great videos on winecaps in straw bales--looks super easy)

3. After the mushrooms are done, you should have some great compost!

Had a random idea and wanted to do a temp check to see if anyone would be interested (or had already started something similar!)

I'm sure many of us have different local seeds and weeds that grow like gangbusters, as well as permie odds and ends in our gardens and seedbanks. What if we organized kind of a silk road for plant exchange?

We could have a series of local swap meetups, maybe following major highways or growing zones seasonally, perhaps meeting in state park parking lots or something in early spring--everyone could bring their extra seedlings or seed stock, and we could share or swap? It could be particularly fun for developing local landraces.

If people can attend more than one swap on different edges of their region, we could even get a kind of silk road thing going, with species being passed along to areas that need them.

For example, I could organize one around highway 90 or highway 87 in upstate NY, Catskills/Berkshires/Adirondacks/Upper Hudson Valley region for fellow cold weather gardeners, if people would be interested?

And if someone else wanted to do one further north for Vermont or New England or even Eastern Canada; or one for the Southern Hudson Valley/NE Coastal Regions, or one for Western PA, etc, on another weekend, I could also travel to that one and bring some of the things people bring to the swap meet I "host."

Thinking timing would be early spring, each event would be pretty short (an hour or two, so it isn't like a full day commitment or anything), different regions staggered on different dates/weekends, and the goal would be to have participants try to attend 2 different events per year, if possible, so there is some "flow" of genetics between nearby regions.

Let me know if you'd be interested in either organizing a regional meetup, or attending one, and if so, what your region is! If there seems to be interest, I can work on getting us organized!

Fall is coming, and it already feels like it's going to be a brutal winter here!

I'm still very new to living in a house and in a climate that is this cold! I have limited skills, confidence, and budget, but would like to make my house a bit more insulated. Right now it gets VERY hot in the summer, and just as cold in the winter--it's a timberframe house about 30 years old, so there is insulation in the walls and windows are doubleglazed, but it doesn't feel like it some days!

There's a crawlspace but I can't really access it to do anything there (and I'm not sure if I'm ready to even try messing around up there). The house is on oil heat with tanks in the basement and it just tears through heating oil each year. We have woodburning fireplaces but last winter I swear using them made the house colder--felt like all of the heat just went up the flues and made it colder.

Do you guys have any tips or hacks for insulation? Anything I should do now before the cold hits? I know that longterm a rocket mass heater or having an energy audit would be good, but right now those kinds of projects aren't in the budget or my scope of skills (I'm seriously struggling right now to figure out how to get some simple shelves up on the wall without them looking like crap!)

Late last winter I put honeycomb blackout blinds on almost all of the windows--they kind of trap a layer of air in them and that seemed to help a bit. I also added a couple of rugs, because we have old pine floors--not sure if that really did much.

Any other hacks or projects I could try to take on before full winter hits? I'd love any hacks or tips anyone has--does hanging pictures or putting bookcases on outside walls help? Are rugs a worthwhile investment? Anything I should check for or repair in the house (dummy proof projects appreciated!) I saw someone who piled bales of hay next to their house foundation, which sounds good, but wouldn't it potentially cause rot to the siding or moisture accumulation or something?

Appreciate any ideas or tips!

Phoebes and dragonflies are both fantastic for this. This year one of our phoebes actually spent the summer following around a poor fly covered deer just picking them off, perching, eating and repeating. I saw this on 3 separate days so I’m sure it was a common occurrance, the phoebe just followed her all around the property perching nearby until they both went out of sight.
I also put a plant saucer full of water, a few rocks, a cheap solar fountain from amazon ($9), put it on an old stump and left my leaky hose in it to counteract evaporation. It attracted a booming dragonfly population all summer, and I swear there were 90% fewer biting flies and mosquitos in the yard this summer. Will def repeat the experiment and see if it was just a fluke of a year, but was cheap, easy and delightful to have a personal air patrol this summer!

Similar area, but a bit harsher here! Some of the things that are thriving among the goldenrods here are:
Echinaccea
Smooth blue aster (prob lots of other asters too)
Common St. Johns Wort
Fleabanes
Milkweeds
Amaranth (red root pigweed for me)
Gray dogwood
White snakeroot (this REALLY holds its own vs the goldenrods, but if you have neighbors with horses or livestock nearby might not be a good choice to put in intenitonally)
Orange lilies/tiger lilies (note: all parts very toxic to cats--not recommended if you have a cat out of an abundance of caution)
Blue flag Iris
Blueberries (bonus of goldenrod is that they can hide some of the younger growth from enthusiastic deer)
So. Many. Grapes.
Allegheney blackberry (I know you said you didn't want berries, but the deer don't eat the plants, and enjoy the berry snacks, so they could be for wildlife not you!)
Cranberries, elderberries, and hazelnuts are doing well as bareroot plants added this spring (from the NY state native plant sale)
Technically invasive, but the birds love it--bull thistle. I only get about 2 plants per year. They're like mullin, flowering in the second year, so if you get too many it isn't hard to stay ahead of them

On the edges oregano, thyme, sage, spotted knapweed, chicory, strawberries, raspberries, clovers, upright yellow wood sorrel, birds foot trefoil, orchard grass, foxglove beardtongue, and chickweed all grow like weeds.

Would love to hear what else is working for you--I'm just trying to build up as much diversity as possible!

I've been rummaging for seed sources to see if I can get some landrace breeding going, and ran across a post on Reddit where a lovely person shared a list of seed suppliers with helpful info. I know there is also a grid at the top of this forum, which I found SUPER helpful too, but there is some additional info below. Thought I'd share in case anyone has additional info or thoughts to add!

Below is a copy of the post from Reddit, thanks to r/bellaweather:

[i]So I thought I’d share this is a list I’ve been working on of seed suppliers. I started with who I’ve purchased from in the past and then organized by where are they located (I’m NE zone 6) and started researching- Company history, are they non GMO, are they organic, have they taken the safe seed pledge, and so on.

And this is what I currently have:

NY:

Fruition seeds https://www.fruitionseeds.com/ 7921 Hickory Bottom Road Naples, New York 14512 support@fruitionseeds.com In person sales and events, online sales

Harris seeds https://www.harrisseeds.com/ They have an app Been in business since 1879 355 Paul Rd. P.O. Box 24966 Rochester , NY 14624 Online sales only

Crossmans seeds https://www.crosmanseed.com/ Founded in 1838 Privately owned Online sales and in person sales at office. Each pack is $1.49

Other North East:

Johnny’s https://www.johnnyseeds.com Founded in 1973 Maine Employee owned No gmo seeds

Experimental farm network https://store.experimentalfarmnetwork.org/ Philadelphia-based 501(c)(3) non-profit cooperative committed to social, racial, and economic justice, and dedicated to practicing organic agriculture along agroecological principles.

Hudson valley seeds https://hudsonvalleyseed.com/ 4737 US 209 Accord, NY 12404 845-204-8769
mail@hudsonvalleyseed.com certified organic farm in upstate New York No GMO and they offer art packs with design created by artists paid for the art. The Hudson Valley Seed Company has its roots in the public library of Gardiner, New York. Co-founder Ken Greene, then working as a librarian, had been interested in the local food movement and, realizing there was little discourse about the seeds that grow our food, started the country's first seed library program in 2004.

Ohio Heirloom Seeds https://ohioheirloomseeds.com/ Columbus Ohio

High Mowing Organic Seeds https://www.highmowingseeds.com/ 76 Quarry Road Wolcott, VT 05680

True love seeds https://trueloveseeds.com/ Farm based seed company Philadelphia

Turtle tree seeds https://turtletreeseed.org/ We are a small, non-profit seed company that sells 100% open-pollinated vegetable, herb, and flower seeds. Every single seed we sell is grown using Demeter certified Biodynamic® and organic practices.  All our seed is non-GMO, non-hybrid, never treated, and grown without the use of chemical inputs. We are part of Camphill Village U.S.A, a 501(c)(3) nonprofit organization.  Camphill Village is an integrated life-sharing community located in Copake, NY.  Of Turtle Tree Seed’s approximately 30 person team – 20 have some sort of developmental difference.  These individuals are involved in every aspect of helping to grow, clean, and pack our seeds.  Our mission also includes encouraging and educating people who want to grow and save open-pollinated vegetable, herb, and flower seeds.

Pine tree garden seeds https://www.superseeds.com/ Maine Founded in 1979 No gmo

Fedco https://www.fedcoseeds.com/ PO Box 520 • Clinton, ME 04927 Co-op founded in 1978

Landreth Seeds / American Meadows https://www.landrethseed.com/ Since 1784 Vermont

Galosh hill seeds https://galushahillseeds.com/ Vermont Heirloom

Richters Herb Seeds https://richters.com/ Canada

Ferry-Morse Seeds https://ferrymorse.com/ 1856 Norton mass.

Ox and Robin https://www.oxandrobin.com/ Massachusetts Heirloom seeds

Burpee https://www.burpee.com/ Founded in 1876 Pennsylvania

Long Island regional seed consortium https://www.lirsc.org/seed-swap Annual seed swap in long island

Other areas:

Seed savers exchange https://www.seedsavers.org/ Missouri, founded in 1975 Heirloom seeds

Hoss Premium Garden Seeds https://hosstools.com/ Georgia (Gardening tools and they sell seeds)

Eden Brothers https://www.edenbrothers.com/ Arden, NC Heirloom, seeds and hard to find types

Sew True Seed https://sowtrueseed.com/ Ashville NC

Southern Exposure seed exchange https://www.southernexposure.com/ Virginia

Territorial Seed https://territorialseed.com/ Oregan

West Coast Seeds https://www.westcoastseeds.com/ British Columbia

Victory Seeds https://victoryseeds.com/ No gmo Open pollinated and heirloom Irving Texas

Marry’s Heirloom Seeds https://www.marysheirloomseeds.com/ Texas

True Leaf Market Seeds https://www.trueleafmarket.com/ Utah

Native seeds.org https://www.nativeseeds.org/ South West

Gurney’s Seeds https://www.gurneys.com/ Indiana

Annies Heirloom Seeds https://www.anniesheirloomseeds.com/ Wisconsin

Jung Seed https://www.jungseed.com/ 1909 Wisconsin

Urban farmer https://www.ufseeds.com/ Indiana

Botanical Interests Seeds https://www.botanicalinterests.com/ Colorado Non gmo

Renee’s Garden Seeds www.reneesgarden.com 6060 Graham Hill Rd. Felton, CA 95018 Non GMO

Other Resources:

Open source seed initiative https://osseeds.org/ Founded 2012 Minnesota Good resource to find open source seeds for specific plants - the list vendors.

I've been on my property (zone 5a, northern catskills) for 2 years. The area is foothills--slopes and very swampy (most things I identify growing wild have "swamp" in their name if that's any indication). Trees growing include silver, red, and sugar maple, white ash, white pine, pitch pine, old apple trees (all are in decline/dying), northern red oak, bitternut hickory.

The maples are all struggling, even though they are about 30+ years old. An arborist came and drilled into a few of them for a stemx treatment last fall, but didn't give a diagnosis. One of the treated trees died over the winter, one silver maple is hanging on but had very tiny leaves this year, and the sugar maples are green but their leaves are shriveled and "crispy."

In the areas around the maples, thickets of gray dogwood are thriving, as well as some ~30ft buckthorn. The buckthorn isn't excessive--just a couple of them--so I could cut them down, but since all the other trees are struggling in the area, and they are the tallest/healthiest things I don't want to take them unless they are the problem. I really need the windbreak and the erosion control (and something sucking up the water during the spring thaw), so I figure something filling that role is better than nothing.

Any ideas on what could be troubling the maples? I see lots of standing/dead wood around this general area, so not sure if it's an overall decline, the gray dogwood or buckthorn is causing the issue, or if the buckthorn is just being opportunistic.

Any ideas or insights appreciated! The areas in question are on the north and west sides of the property and get absolutely pummeled by winter storms so I'm looking for something that will provide wind break and shelter that might compete or work with the common buckthorn.

Thanks!

john lindsey wrote:

Now half of the soil is gone. but it sounds like what I need for this sandy soil.  I wish some one here with knowlage of these grasses would tell me some thing about them.

and where to get bulk seed.
Big blue stem, Sundial, Lupine, Ridged golden rod,

Tall blazing star:



Ridged golden rod:

Just got a bunch from https://www.ernstseed.com/ They have both native and farm crops, so just be sure to read the description of each if you are looking for natives. They only sell by the pound, so wildflowers are pricey, but if you click on the page for the species you want, if it is included in a mix, it will be listed above the price. Just click on "included in mixes" and you can see all the blends they offer that have it.

Prairie Moon also has bulk prices for many species. Depends on how much you need on which will be more cost effective!