Frank Troy

I was at Sun Dog Building last summer for a cob course, and he's got some really incredible RMH stuff going on. You can probably find it either on his forum (http://donkey32.proboards.com/) or somewhere here.

Anyway, his system for safely heating hot water is to heat an open container (can be covered to conserve heat, just NOT sealed) of water with the RMH. I think he was using industrial size pressure cookers (obviously with the lid not sealed), but you could probably use any large waterproof container that can take direct heat from the RMH. Then you have copper pipe from your water source (your hot water main) running into the open container, coiling around several times, and running out to your sink or shower or whatever. If I ever get my construction projects started, this is the system I plan on using. I think the most important thing is that the copper pipe can't be touching the bottom of the container. This ensures that the RMH is only directly heating the water in the open container, which can easily dissipate as it turns to steam.

The thing to be careful about here is that water turning to steam is extremely dangerous because it expands something like 1,000 times in volume. If you have a sealed container of water that you're boiling, you're essentially creating a bomb.

I think this system would work best in a RMH used for cooking, because you would be using the RMH more time during the day. I don't know if a one or two hour burn over the course of 24 hours would get you enough hot water to use throughout the day.

Disclaimer: I'm by no means an expert, and you should do some serious research. I just saw this system last summer, and it resolved a series of theoretical problems I was having in my head about the eventual system I'll build.

Interesting to see all of the different methods. I'm also in Portugal, and curing olives from the extreme north, almost on the border with Galicia (Minho is the region). Wendy, I think my variety is also Galega: they're small, oval-shaped fruits, and very dark in color when completely ripe. I took the advice of a friend and mixed it with various Portuguese recipes I found on the net. I only harvested maybe two kilos, as this is my first year (and I only have one olive tree!), but I divided them. I should note that I harvested in mid-October, so my olives were a mix of green to black and anywhere in between. I didn't separate by color/ripeness, and I just rinsed them in water. I think perhaps the most important rule (at least judging from what the Portuguese have told me) is to use either well water or spring water (i.e. not chlorinated).

With one portion, I left them in water in a wine cellar in glass jars, and will check on them monthly; they'll supposedly be ready in about 6 (!) months. According to my friend, this is the most "traditional" way, and as with many crops, one spends the summer consuming last year's crop. He did his olives this way last year, and I can attest that they were excellent. I didn't seal the jars that they're in, because mine were releasing some gas (CO2?), and I didn't want the jars to explode or the lids to pop off.

With the second portion, I'm changing the water every day, and usually it looks like diluted cranberry juice in color when I dump it out. I've tasted these periodically, and after about 15 days, they're definitely still bitter, but are becoming palatable. I hope that they'll be ready after about a week more.

About 1 week after starting that process, I divided the second portion as follows: I'm maintaining the same process with one bucket.
With a second bucket, I'm changing the water daily, but with salt (I usually eyeball it, about 2 teaspoons of salt per 750 ml of water).
With a third bucket, I put them into glass jars in a brine solution (90g salt, 100 ml apple cider vinegar, 1L water) with spices (peppercorn, lemon slices, coriander seeds, thyme, whole garlic cloves), screwing the lids tight. In the space at the top, I put about a finger's worth of olive oil, to keep them from contact w/ air, and stored them in the back of my cabinet in the kitchen (sadly, no cool room available!). I'll probably open one of these jars in about 2 weeks to a month to see how they're doing.

I didn't try a salt cure this year, maybe next year! Great salt is so abundant and cheap here that it would definitely be easy to try.

I have heard of two tricks to greatly reduce curing time while only using water: one either hits each olive with a wooden hammer or makes several indentations with a knife along the surface. This allows the liquid to penetrate more fully and leech out the bitterness more quickly. The drawback is that it greatly compromises the texture of the olive, and they don't keep as long. If you want olives for next week, and you're going to consume them all in a few days, I think this is the way to go.

If I remember, I'll have to report back in a few weeks when I feel they're ready. Maybe I'll post pics too if I figure it out. This year saw many firsts for me. I also harvested my chestnuts and walnuts for the first time!

Thanks for the great reply! After looking at the site again yesterday, we are now leaning towards taking advantage of some granite walls (about 50 cm thick) already standing, and building the rammed earth walls inside the granite with spacing in between them to let moisture drain. I feel like this could help keep the interior walls warm and minimize the amount of heating/cooling we have to do. This should also minimize the exposure of the rammed earth to the elements.

Hello all, and let me apologize if this post is redundant...but I didn't find anything about this specifically in the forum.

I'm currently planning a 60 m2 house out of rammed earth in N. Portugal, an area that receives a lot of precipitation over the winter–very humid–but the summers dry out. I see so many concrete structures with humidity problems (among other things) so rammed earth immediately appeals to me. However, I'd like to find a good finish for the inside of the walls that's breathable (if that's the right word) so that I can fully take advantage of the humidity-regulating properties of the rammed earth.

N.B. I have very little experience building, but I've got a voracious interest and have been researching every spare moment. The house will be on a north slope, with the lower part of the south wall butted up against an earth berm. It'll be heated by a RMH and I'm thinking of using cob for the floor.

Thanks for any and all input. I've been reading the other posts with enthusiasm!

When you go, make sure you visit Gaudix, North of Granada. They have a bunch of houses built into natural caves in the hilly part of town. I would say that the reason for cave dwelling (there at least) is less about sustainability, and more about necessity. Maybe they're related. Anyway, I visited once, and though the town looks a bit sketchy, if you offer them a few € after the tour, a lot of the folks are quite friendly and welcoming and will tell you all that they know about their house. They let me see every part of the home except the bathroom (although I didn't ask). As I recall, most of their cooking is done outside, and their kitchens are always situated in a way to vent to the outside as much as possible. We went in the summer, and it was wonderfully cool. Central Spain can get a bit chilly in winter, so I'm not sure about heating.

I'm currently living in Portugal as well, and have basically the same dream as you. I'm a bit more limited in my choice of land, but if my wife and I see our project to fruition, it will be quite a few years into the future. In the interim, I've been trying to soak up as much info as possible, both about permaculture and Portugal. Just some random thoughts I've noticed in my (limited) time here:

It's true organic hasn't caught on like in other places, but you still can find people who value it and who are willing to spend a bit more for organic produce. It's definitely a niche market at this point, though. That being said, things here seem to be a lot less formalized and the lines are a lot less defined as to what's organic and what's not. Like the fig tree in the middle of the village that nobody tends and everybody picks from in August–is that organic? What about the rows of cabbages planted in a little triangle of earth where two streets intersect? These things end up playing a part, especially in rural Portugal. As an American, where I feel like we tend to formalize everything and do everything in a very organized way, this realization fascinated me when I first started noticing it.

Also, don't discount the sense of community you'll encounter in the country. I have a pair of friends who are also homesteading in the Guarda area, and I recently visited them. I noticed all of the great homemade olive oil, cured meats, wine, etc that they had, and asked them where I could buy such products (in bulk to take back to the city). They informed me that it would be hard, because they were given all of those products. One reason they find life in the country so cheap is because in any month, they're given (and give away) dozens of € in goods from neighbors who have too much.

One big thing I've learned (as my wife's Portuguese family has several lawyers) is that yes, gov't regulations can be the end of any plans of this nature. Regarding housing, I'm told that the best way to do it (it's almost impossible to get a building permit for even a "conventional" house without dropping a ton of money in licenses) is if you can build your shelter on any sort of existing structure whatsoever (abandoned house, shed, etc). Even if you don't take advantage of any existing materials, you can count your work as repairs to an existing structure, and therefore you either don't need a permit, or it's easier to obtain (not sure which). I don't know all of the particulars about this, but it's what I've been told and seen over and over in various parts of the country. If your plots of land have any remnants of structures, you might consider this. Another option, according to my friend in the Guarda area, is to check out the records of the particular area you're living it. I've heard that it's possible to claim that your structure already existed on the land, but the municipal records were either lost, incorrect, incomplete, etc. I guess you can only get away with this in really rural areas.

Anyway, I hope this helps some. I'll eagerly keep up with your progress; I can use all of the advice I can get as well. Good Luck!