Richard Force

Robert Ray wrote:Solar pasteurization of potable  water is  quire common www.solarcooking.org/pasteurization/solarwat.htm. Household quantities would be a pretty big system. Problematic when seperating potable from non-potable if that was a consideration.

I personally would be fine with only potable water coming into the homes so long as harmful microbes were eliminated as much as possible.

I know it may not be needed for say washing clothes but non the less I'm okay with that so long as there is not an excessive waste of energy in the process.

Orin Raichart wrote:

Richard Force wrote:
...
I was looking the distilling option but I am wondering if there is a way to set this up passively without excessive fuel usage. Such as solar for example. The only problem with solar is it would be extremely slow.

.....

If you noticed the Boot at Wheaton Labs, Josiah, worked on a solar device which melts glass. He used a fresnel lens which creates a super hot beam of light from normal sunlight. These lens can be found in big old 50" tvs (but not all old 50 inchers, research it first). The reason I didn't bring this up is because I wasn't sure if that was in the realm of what you would actually do.

With a little experimentation, you can easily get water to boil in a very short time and not melt your metal water tank with sunlight and a fresnel lens.

There is also the Rocket Stove Water heater which, if you build in such a way neither air nor steam can get trapped, will do the job also.

One method requires regular dependable sunlight and the other requires a small amount of wood and some skill so your device doesn't explode.

I just started looking up those frenel lenses and all I can say is wow! I have never heard of them before but I love the idea. Plus it can be used on metal, glass and other materials when needed. That is a major bonus.

Orin Raichart wrote:I've looked at purifying water before and here are the methods I've found:

To get rid of microbials means two things, removing bacteria and viruses.

-reverse osmosis (push the water through a membrane so small only a H2O molecule can get through (while the membrane may allow any chemical molecule equal in size or smaller, this membrane is too small for even a virus to get through);
-ceramics which are made in such a way to so the way through for water is too small for viruses and bacteria (my MRS Mini has a ceramic filter which disallows bacteria which I've used repeatedly in the badlands of NM and AZ);
-ultra violet light but I'm not convinced this would kill a virus or all bacteria I suspect UV only retards bacterial growth rather than out right kill all bacteria;
-boiling, but your temperature has to be really high for a 30 minute (some say less or more.) period (I am suspicious of this because there are heat loving bacteria in the magna vents in the ocean...some might point out these bacteria won't harm us?);
-catching only the steam from boiling water, condensing this back into water (oh yeah.  no bacteria can change phase and live to my knowledge);
-chemically poison the bacteria/viruses (no thanks, I'm drinking that water and....short answer hell no.).

Here's my recommendation:
No money and stuck in the wilderness:
-boil it after running it through (grass/sand/grass/charcoal/grass/sand) layered in two or three water bottles now ubiquitous to most of the world (this works I watched someone pour muddy water in one end and clear water came out the  bottom);

Alot of money
reverse osmosis  wins every time (I was in a coal plant whose RO filters produced 99.99999% water which is poisonous to a human cause it leaches/attaches chemically to all human body nutrients but most RO systems aren't that good);

Not so much money but enough for a distiller or the skills to build a distiller
boil water to create steam, catch the steam and condense it

Ceramics but you'll need to know how to create a new one once it becomes plugged -I currently don't know how to make a ceramic filter correctly for microbials

good luck!

I've looked into reverse osmosis and the problem is that it doesn't seem sustainable at all.
Part of my problem is I always look at thing from a SHTF perspective and this wouldn't be sustainable or a easily done diy solution plus like you said cost is ridiculously high.

I've only recently heard of the ceramics and easy working my way to the research there.

I was looking the distilling option but I am wondering if there is a way to set this up passively without excessive fuel usage. Such as solar for example. The only problem with solar is it would be extremely slow.

Thanks for the suggestion though Orin its given me some things to look more into.

I was wondering what were some good methods of removing microbes from water supplies. Primarily I am thinking in a manner that is used inside the home before the water comes out of the faucets or at least before it enters the home. Secondarily I was thinking in a method that would filter the water for large scale distribution (say 2-4 homes).

I understand using activated charcoal (and how to make it) to remove harmful chemicals but I am uncertain of the microbes at this point.
Any ideas or solutions would be appreciated.

Catherine Windrose wrote:  (Also planning a large-ish pond as water source, a way to bring water into the home what is not easily detectable from outside, and perhaps a separate small, sealed saltwater pond to create electricity without being on a short leash with solar.)

I've never heard of doing something like this for electric before and it now has me highly interested.

I know this may be a crazy question or idea in general. Plus it would be really expensive but I'm asking our of 1 curiosity and 2 for my lovely wife who has anxiety.

So here goes

We are still in the planning phases of how we would like to build our cob house. We have both agreed we would like to have the house to be somewhat of a fortress.

In doing so we have decided that bullet proof windows, heavy iron doors, and much more would be preferable.

But what we were wondering is it plausible (excusing cost) to put 3/4 inch steel into the core of a cob building and place the cob around it.

Yes we are aware that this would take away from the breathability of the cob but it something we are just curious about. Also any really strong alternative ideas would be great as well.


Also let me clarify why we are asking.

As stated my wife has anxiety and it is especially bad at night.

She is terrified of what happens if:
•We get shot at (the house we are in has been randomly shot at many times even though we are openly visible)
•someone tries to break in
•someone sets off a bomb/grenade (this is where the question comes from)
•a fire happens
•tornadoes (this is a big one we haven't gotten to planning yet)
•and sooooooo many more.


Anyway, thanks in advance for all the answers to come, and please have fun with your answers.

I was just curious if anyone know of or has seen a way that one could freeze food without using a freezer (or any for of electricity produced cooling) or pre-made ice to freeze foods for storage.
I'm not looking to just refrigerate but literally freeze the foods like meats for long term storage if possible in a sustainable local way.

I have no idea if this is even possible without living in colder areas but if it is in areas that are temperate or even up to the tropics that would be awesome to know.

Does anyone know of a copy of Permaculture A Designers Manual in audiobook form free or paid that I could find and download?

I own the actual book but I find that I have little time to read it but plenty of time to listen to audio books so this would be a great option for me as well as for may people.

Yea sorry I haven't posted in awhile.
No I haven't found nything as of yet. I'll give the link a shot.

Giselle Burningham wrote:A scholarship is a good idea but there are huge other issues.. who will run it?  Where will the courses be undertaken .. just Tasmania, or the whole of Australia or worldwide. This CAN all be done. I have experiance of dealing with trusts, scholarships etc world wide and these fall under philothropic trusts ... .  http://www.philanthropy.org.au/.   I would suggest a lawyer needs to work with the family. This will take at least!!! a year to work out, as it is a major commitment.  I think the family needs to space to grief first.  But over all I love your idea but not sure of the execution.

Honestly I'm not sure of how to go about it either that why I'm here to get comments like yours pointing things out and making suggestions.

I would like to see it globally set up and with a application process that proves ones inability to pay for a class themselves.