Young Jun Lee

Burra Maluca wrote:
My understanding was that sugar can only be converted into SOME amino acids, and more to the point some of the NON-ESSENTIAL ones. Carbohydrates contain carbon, hydrogen and oxygen. Proteins also need nitrogen, sulphur, phosphorus and sometimes other elements too. They can't just be magicked up from sugar. I'd be very much looking for other sources of protein to go along with anything you can get from cellulose.

That is true. I believe the process can be modified to allow essential ones to be made also. I think you are referring to Strecker synthesis. However, you are correct that sulfur and nitrogen compounds would need to be supplied outside of the glucose. The nitrogen, I can see it being sourced from urine, and chlorine from stockpiled salt. Sulfur, I am less sure. Perhaps as elemental sulfur ore?

And how to make the exact needed aldehydes and ketones? I am even less sure.

But I know for sure that if I apply electricity in a specific way to a specific mixture, something will happen. That means theoretically, with enough electricity (or more broadly, energy), raw inedible materials (such as raw carbon, raw salt, raw sulfur, etc.), and the correct procedure, it must be possible to make those amino acids without using organic life (such as bacteria). Just like inedible wood has been converted to glucose, so can inedible carbon, ammonia, sulfur, etc. be converted to food, likely.

Now, what exactly is this procedure, and what conditions must I use to make amino acids? Further research is needed, and the Strecker synthesis will be my starting point.

Many here will not understand my contempt for organic life, but I fundamentally see humanity as being caught up in an evil cycle where we must harm other beings to survive. I am very troubled by this. I also do not trust life, as it is unpredictable, which is why I am trying not to use bacteria to synthesize amino acids, despite them being able to make them from glucose. I also see the fungi as fundamentally self-serving entities that will turn against us once they become energetically desperate.

I see more hope for vitamins, such as the Reichstein process for synthesizing vitamin C. At the very least, I won't get scurvy!

Hopefully, mankind can separate itself from Animalia, Fungi, Archaea, Bacteria, and Plantae. I yearn for a day when no animal, fungi, or bacteria will be present, so no entity will suffer for our sake and no human will suffer for theirs.

Linden Sai wrote:Interesting thinking. 1 quite important point is missing thus far, though. FUNGI are the a main nature's decomposers of cellulose. They, as well as the process, are vital for the health and stability of the whole / (eco-)system and health and wellbeing of individual, alike. Trying to by-pass this important component of the whole-system design would come at a great energy cost and dire consequences.
The least is you need varied diet, with vitamins, oils, aminoacids, minerals, etc., not only carbs/calories.

I would be using the same enzyme used by the fungi, cellulase. In fact, since the human can pocket all of the glucose without paying it for fungal growth, we can get more calories overall.

Sugar can be converted to vitamins, oils, amino acids, etc. using chemical processes. Minerals are trace, so not much stockpiling will be needed.

I have two contrasting visions: scale this up and make a new way of life, or use this technology on a small scale for my 80-year personal bunker. The former would require me to care about the ecosystem, but the latter doesn't. I am going for the latter option, as humanity is not ready to change. The latter option also allows less engineering due to the small-scale nature.

Thank you for your input.

Hello, fellow urbanite here. It has been tough lately for me as well, thankfully I am still in school.



Potential Work Options:
If you have a college degree, there are English teacher programs in East Asia, you would need to apply for it and get a visa. But from what I've seen, the qualifications don't seem very high. Worth a try, I guess?

Try Amazon Mechanical Turk if you can't find a job. I haven't tried it, but I heard it's better than nothing.

Unironically, panhandling is an option. They look poor, but they make surprising amounts of money. Make a sad backstory or something. I don't know much about this field, however. It will work better in a city where cash is still normalized (like NYC).



Restructuring and Benefits:
What is your diet? Can the foods become cheaper? Rice and beans + cabbages can work for a while. I have survived on Starkist tuna packs (1 dollar per pack) + mashed potato cups (1 dollar per cup) for a while now, and nutrition-wise, I am doing fine. The lack of fiber can be fulfilled by eating coleslaw for cheap.

I used to volunteer at a food bank and at the end of my shift, I could take a few items. If you can't get a job, a similar arrangement may be an option. If you are in critical need, just ask them for food, they will be glad to help you.

Can you cut out any subscriptions? Perhaps it's time to sail to the high seas.

If you have a pool of cash and can't afford America, there are many nations where housing and food are cheaper. It might be risky, but consider it as an option.

The job market is tough now. See if there are any public benefits you can get (you just fill out a short form online), if you can get unemployment benefits, and if there are technical training programs that might give you a stipend. It will take a week or so, but if you get approved, you can sleep easy.



Misc.:
Do everything to avoid homelessness. Once you go into that pit, it's hard to climb out of it. Avoid the shelters like the plague, the employees treat you very poorly and it's hard to sleep. If you are about to get evicted, perhaps rent a car and live there for a while. The cold is bearable, but the way society views you isn't (which is why so many homeless end up addicts).

If you are willing to bet America's future is bright, go back to university and get student loans, for a field that has a bright future. If the future is bright, you should be able to pay them back quickly. If you believe otherwise, focus on cutting down all costs.



Regarding Arts:
Arts are saturated right now, there are also a lot of art school graduates looking for jobs and making their own crafts. The entertainment industry in America is not doing well, so a lot of people are also freelancing. The arrival of AI art doesn't help. It seems to be a dark era for your skills, which are being automated away. The general economy is also unhealthy, so there aren't many asking for commissions anymore.

That being said, if you want to sell art, find an underutilized fandom that still has a demand for merchandise. Many fandoms have significant amounts of people, but their owners don't make good merchandise for them, or the fans want "unique" stuff. Make consumerism your friend.

If you want to draw original stuff, you need a following, and to get a following, you need to start by making fanart (or making connections, but that also takes time). People start on Newgrounds, DeviantArt, etc. Use Reddit, Facebook, Instagram, etc., and go to relevant threads to advertise your art. If people like the show, they won't mind the art so long as it features the show's character.

Connect with fellow artists on Xitter/Bluesky/Discord, and build up a reputation. The art world is filled with nepotism and favoritism, so you might have to go to a few gatherings here and there. This won't be easy. However, once people like you, they will be the ones coming to you asking for art, instead of you having to actively market stuff. Perhaps make a Patreon also?

I personally recommend art as a hobby, because just like sports, most people can't survive off of it. But if you are determined, perhaps you can make it.

You said you are in a city? Alongside food pantries, public benefits, and networking, you could try selling art on the street. A tourist destination (or anywhere with foot traffic) will work, but make sure the local authorities are lenient. Ask the street vendors already there if they needed permits, and also ask nearby authorities about any unspoken rules.



I wish you the best of luck in these difficult times.

Young Jun Lee wrote:

A proposed example would be a 3rd-floor treehouse, a 1st-floor woodhouse with a flat top, and a 2nd-floor "house" made of lightweight tarps.

Either this, or vertical campsites with lightweight platforms, where each floor can have a tent set up. I am no civil engineer, however, so take my proposals as a half-joke.

I remember treehouses from my youth, often put in between the branches and able to hold many children at once.

Such treehouses were put easily at a 2~3 floor height, with nothing below it.

Perhaps then, treehouses can be used to build quick, dense, 2~3-story housing (similar to how Brooklyn is) stably? The tree can hold on to the 3rd floor, and the building below it would not be load-bearing, allowing the usage of containers or other cheap materials, perhaps allowing the 2-floor building below to be made of weak parts.

A proposed example would be a 3rd-floor treehouse, a 1st-floor woodhouse with a flat top, and a 2nd-floor "house" made of lightweight tarps.

What are your thoughts? I haven't seen such attempts yet.

Fred Frank V Bur wrote:No one wants to be doing more work to reap the same amount. I am not sure about using any cellulose for all my dietary needs still. But farming is thought to be hard, but even without machinery it could be done much more easily than generally thought in our modern culture, and in other circumstances too, clearly. The Fukuoka method of natural farming would be much easier, I would try making use of having seedballs prepared for casting to the area where I want the plants from them to grow. There cannot be no work but I think living should not be such great work and effort to keep going. Having others in community should be for making things easier. But the way it has been it yet really isn't, still it could be, if with others this way.

The Fukuoka method sounds very interesting, I will check it out.

Thank you for your input, and I agree nobody should be living a hard life in this modern era.

Kevin Olson wrote:Young -
[...]
Back to the liver: metabolizing large quantities of fructose (sugary beverages are the primary culprit, but it's in all manner of packaged foods) will lead to fatty liver disease and sclerosis (the same sort of damage seen in chronic alcoholics).  I've heard of cases of children as young 12 years of age presenting with fatty liver disease and sclerosis.  Not only will there be the potential for the poor metabolic health downstream, but also for permanent liver damage.

Please (please!) be very careful with long-term diets high in fructose.

I think I detect that your are moving toward a more typically "permie" position - pass the food stuff through something else first, before you eat it.
[...]

That is very good advice, thank you for your input.

Yes, I think people's criticisms are valid, and eating sugar long term probably will lead to diabetes, or other chronic illnesses as you and others have pointed out. Perhaps then I can use just one intermediary, and a very efficient one at that, honeybees. That, or some form of snail bred in a parasite-free environment.

I am considering the potential impacts of using cellulose processing in tandem with animal husbandry. Perhaps the usage of wood glucose as animal feed (supplemented by grass and its micronutrients) can allow Brazilian ranchers to prevent deforesting, instead, coppicing the jungle wood (though they must be careful to make sure it's not poisonous). It may also allow the lessening of methane emissions by preventing cellulose fermentation in the first place.

https://www.fpl.fs.usda.gov/documnts/pdf1975/baker75a.pdf

Fascinating project! Reminds me of Spiral Island near Cancun:

One more thing I forgot, another potential advantage of preserving the mangrove is carbon capture and preventing shore erosion.

Andrew Parker wrote:Jonathan, I have done some research for a project in the mangroves of West Africa.  My files are unavailable, so I will have to do some remembering.  In the meantime, I suggest you search for "saline agriculture" online.  That ought to give you a few weeks of reading.

Do you have a description of your project area? Will you be working in virgin stands or will you be rehabilitating abandoned shrimp ponds? Try to contact the relevant research centers in the Philippines. There are some very capable people there that are doing great work.

Review the Mangrove Action Project's website.

If I can put some things together I will post them.

Folks living in the mangroves tend to rely on high-ground gardens and/or trade to supply themselves with a balanced diet.  If your project population is restricted to the mangroves, look for articles about the Sunderbans.  There has been a lot of work done to provide the inhabitants there with fruits, vegetables and staple starches.

Mr. Parker,

I am interested in coppicing mangroves, and I know that while most mangroves cannot be coppiced, many still can, especially on the American continent.

Given your experience, do you think cellulose from coppiced mangrove branches converted to sugar as a feasible way to solve food shortages in coastal Haiti and Central America?

This could also allow the original poster to convert the mangrove wood to something edible (despite grass and leaves being edible, most animals cannot eat wood), such as a glucose/cellulose mixture, and allow them subsistence by milk or blood from animals fed with the chemically modified mangrove wood.

Since mangroves live near the brine, they are also in the perfect position to use electricity (perhaps from a direct solar panel w/o batteries) to make the bleach or NaOH needed to delignify the wood to make the cellulose available to animals.

While my other posts mention cellulase enzyme to break down the cellulose further into glucose, perhaps if the original poster is feeding ruminants, they can feed the animals the delignified wood, and let the animals process the cellulose.

I haven't experimented with this yet, however. If someone attempts this, they must make sure the pre-treated wood is free of bleach or NaOH by washing it in water (such as the brine), perhaps soaking it for a day, even a week.