• Post Reply Bookmark Topic Watch Topic
  • New Topic
permaculture forums growies critters building homesteading energy monies kitchen purity ungarbage community wilderness fiber arts art permaculture artisans regional education skip experiences global resources cider press projects digital market permies.com pie forums private forums all forums
this forum made possible by our volunteer staff, including ...
master stewards:
  • Nancy Reading
  • Carla Burke
  • r ranson
  • John F Dean
  • paul wheaton
  • Pearl Sutton
stewards:
  • Jay Angler
  • Liv Smith
  • Leigh Tate
master gardeners:
  • Christopher Weeks
  • Timothy Norton
gardeners:
  • thomas rubino
  • Jeremy VanGelder
  • Maieshe Ljin

integrating chickens into the homestead

 
  • Likes 5
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
    Number of slices to send:
    Optional 'thank-you' note:
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator
We jumped with both feet into chicken ownership. Our municipality, after dithering for two years, finally approved chickens in our zoning area last week, and I promptly ordered 15 chicks, who arrived yesterday. I hadn't gotten as far as planning where exactly they would fit on our land, because I had given up hope of them being legalized, at least this year. However, earlier in the year my husband had picked up two secondhand coops. Very sturdy, Amish built, on wheels. Intended as chicken tractors, but they're so heavy that they're difficult to move or maneuver. Right now the 15 chicks seem happy inside one 4x6 coop parked next to our garage so their mama brooder plate can be plugged in. My question is, is there any way I can allow them some degree of free range/foraging that would work with the limitations of our 5 acre infant homestead.

We have three cleared areas that are arranged as fingers spreading out from the house on very hilly, woody land. Using a small tractor to move the chicken tractors is tricky because none of the cleared areas has a lot of space to turn around. We have 3 fenced areas, and I'm wondering if it is possible to teach the chickens to come when I call/throw corn so that I could herd them in the morning into a fenced space, and take them back to a stationary coop in the evening. We know that hawks hunt in our trees, and the neighbors frequently talk about foxes and coyotes. We have a 9yo lab mix, who I'm afraid is too elderly to either learn a new trick of chicken herding, or be very energetic or reliable at chasing away predators. Roosters are not allowed.

The first fenced space is a raised bed garden, currently in very abandoned condition, right against the back of the house. Maybe 10x20. The second space is 30x50, within view of some of the house windows and overhung by large walnut trees. It currently has a large strawberry patch and other mixed crops, including the remnants of green beans (which I've heard chickens shouldn't be allowed to forage in). The third space is down a hill and completely out of sight of the house; 40x100, with trees around the edges but not overhanging it. Half of it is 1 or 2yo blackberry and raspberry plants; some was garlic last winter, and some is currently tomatoes and peppers, and will be garlic this winter. All of these fences are about 5ft high, enough to deter deer (I realize they can jump, but it discourages them; we don't see deer damage inside); we need to add tighter wire at the bottom to block rabbits, but haven't yet. All are too large to realistically cover against hawks.

My questions are: 1) how much will young chickens damage overwintering berry and garlic plants, if they spend time in there over the winter? We're in SW PA, so frequent snow but with intermittent melting. 2) any suggestions for how to protect the chickens from predators during the day; do we need a new young dog who wants to spend winter days outside learning to herd chickens, are we absolutely obliged to get geese (I would love to have some, not sure how the neighbors will feel, particularly since they don't know about the chickens yet), would a rooster wearing a no-crow collar actually not crow AND also still protect the hens, or should I give up and build a permanent covered run, and depend on throwing weeds and kitchen scraps into it to vary the chickens' diet?
 
gardener
Posts: 1251
Location: North Carolina zone 7
446
5
hugelkultur forest garden fungi foraging ungarbage
  • Likes 2
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
    Number of slices to send:
    Optional 'thank-you' note:
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator
Hi Phoebe and welcome to Permies! We’re thrilled you are here!
I’ve had free range chickens for years so I’m only going off my experience.
I’m not familiar with a no-crow collar but I do know the importance of a rooster when free ranging. They spend more time looking out for their flock than anything else. But, if your area doesn’t allow them there’s not much you can do.
I do not believe they would do any damage to your berries but they’d definitely fertilize them for you.
I remember one case of them damaging a garlic plant. That was due to a fat grub next to it they wanted badly.
If you want some mobile protection that is easily moved I highly recommend fishing line. I made a PVC frame and wrapped it in chicken wire. The top was simply fishy line woven into a grid pattern. Hawks see it and don’t want to get tangled up.
 
pollinator
Posts: 1518
Location: Southern Oregon
463
  • Likes 4
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
    Number of slices to send:
    Optional 'thank-you' note:
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator
You can train your chickens to come when you call. Many people use dried meal worms or black soldier flies for this.

I would probably put them in the first area by the house. They could do some good clean up in the abandoned garden. I have a stationary coop and run because we are a heavy predator area. I plan on adding some fenced free range area for them, but wanted to have a more secure run for them just in case.

Personally, I don't worry about the chickens having access to plants that others say to keep them away from, like green beans, because in my experience they just don't eat things that make them sick or at least not enough to make them sick. Maybe if they were starving they would, but they are definitely not starving.

Congratulations on your new chicks.
 
gardener
Posts: 2212
Location: Central Maine (Zone 5a)
910
homeschooling kids trees chicken food preservation building woodworking homestead
  • Likes 3
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
    Number of slices to send:
    Optional 'thank-you' note:
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator
Hi Pheobe,
With the amount of predators you say are in your area, I would be leary of free ranging them... though that would be the easiest way to get them back in the coop at night. No need to train them, if there is a way to get to their coop.

Electric fencing can be a huge help to deter the predators from an area.

A couple from NC who do a podcast, had a similar problem. They wanted to free range, but the predators were too much. So they ended up building a super long chicken tunnel like 18" high and wide from their coop and run over to a larger area under the trees where the chickens could hide better. I wonder if you could come up with some sort of moveable tunnel to get the chickens back to the coop from any of the three areas. Just move the far end to a new spot when you want them to move there. In my experience, while it is possible to get chickens to come when "called" (more like come when they see a treat), it is still a pain in the rear. There is always a chicken or two (or ten) who can't figure out how to go around the edge of the fence and end up in the wrong spot.

As to the strawberries... or any plants on the ground. I would expect them to damage them. Chickens don't generally try to go eat strawberry plants (though they love strawberries), but while scratching around, they don't care what they have to move to get that yummy grub. I had a few chickens get out one day and into my strawberry patch. They were trying to get to bugs and stuff under the woodchips and in the process had pulled up maybe 10 plants and buried 50-60 while looking before I got them back in.
 
Phoebe Rehoboth
Posts: 16
7
homeschooling chicken fiber arts
  • Likes 1
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
    Number of slices to send:
    Optional 'thank-you' note:
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator
Thanks for your thoughts. The PVC frame sounds like what I was looking for. I will need to think about whether a moveable tunnel would fit in our space. I still need to figure out how to get them from the coop to wherever the PVC frame is going to be, maybe that's the answer.
 
Matt McSpadden
gardener
Posts: 2212
Location: Central Maine (Zone 5a)
910
homeschooling kids trees chicken food preservation building woodworking homestead
  • Likes 1
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
    Number of slices to send:
    Optional 'thank-you' note:
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator
Good luck Phoebe. Please let us know what route you take and how it turns out. If you and this couple I heard about, both have this problem, others probably will too. Hearing how yours turns out could be helpful to someone else.
 
Ever since I found this suit I've felt strange new needs. And a tiny ad:
GAMCOD 2025: 200 square feet; Zero degrees F or colder; calories cheap and easy
https://permies.com/wiki/270034/GAMCOD-square-feet-degrees-colder
reply
    Bookmark Topic Watch Topic
  • New Topic