Horvath Patents Allowed Engine To Run On Water Improved Electrolysis Efficiency

Re: Horvath Patents Allowed Engine To Run On Water Improved Electrolysis Efficiency

The Engineer Horvath had 3 related Patents for hydrogen from water auto conversions. Final cell as low voltage , another at high voltage with same instilled circuit, and the more elaborate water cell with central radiation Magnetron tube.Photos do not tell which type was displayed.  I studied the low volts model and typed out page of proof reading errors not caught .Patents  designs included obvious non essential parts to deter people from replication, - such as cast special carburetor, large diameter cell, interior - rather than external transformer.
Outer box strong magnets on sides of narrow cell would suffice to speed ions . I had 2 steel plates knurled rough with matching flutes nickel plated at machine shop.. They would face each other in narrow gap. High temp gray PVC plates measured for cell + removable cover. Source for free distilled water would still be needed.

The Nuclear fusion conversion conversation in video was wrong. That's not what it was . Just greatly improved Radiolysis of water to hydrogen + oxygen gas fuel method #3. . The#1 and #2  low + high volts designs were not shown.

Horvath had 3 established Patents on high efficiency made hydrogen gas electrical circuits. One was Magnetron glass radiation tube in water cell center. The other two were low volts out and high volts out to water cell . Two were VERY similar to your well known CDI that fires the ignition coil primary side. He beefed it up for 450Watts for the cell, while the alternator recharges battery , about 40 amps. He added efficiency measures to cell such as magnetic field and pulse flowing ions. 200A pulses to electrolysis cell at 30v DC. About 45% duty cycle cell. Designed in high frequency put to low frequency iron laminations core transformer TR2 , so as no diode needed, - called positive Critical  Wave Form. READ the Patent  on line and print it out for study later. Things were added not necessary so as to discourage others from duplication such as special machined carburetor, and separation screens for gases. The old style SCR switch is now replaced with MOSFET. The Inverter transistors as Bipolar type is replaced with Mosfet. The type Inverter is now changed to the "IC driven " type for on+ off switching of current 50% duty cycle. The oscillator frequency is adjustable which gives the wattage wanted. Three cars were converted to water, 6yl, and( 2) 4cyl engines. Hydrogen gas is the fuel of our future . Read # 3980053   1976     . Old electrical parts list was included.  A single barrel Carter carb can have a spud in jet on side at venturi point for hose connection.  (Similar to the old VW engine conversions in 1970's to propane.) Saw out an aluminum plate adapter for intake manifold mount of carb. The expensive Impco apparatus is not needed.
P.S. -  The time of Patents as 17 years has run out, and is in now what's called public domain!

Just more tech data.-  US Patent 3980053 contains parts list I went over carefully. There are a few proofreading mistakes and a couple parts in parts list were wrong. The Author didn't want the unit duplicated, so as some electronic parts were changed. The main UJT oscillator should be R1 Pot 25Kohm , capacitor as .006uf, R2 as 100ohm. This will give proper frequencies for operation of electrolysis circuit at 10khtz. The SCR switch is old style , mostly discontinued, and would be replaced by MOSFET on heat sink. Fast repeating DC pulses to cell is way better than straight DC for gases evolution of Hydrogen.Time is there for stuck ions to release, making faster operation. Any one interested should study the online Patent. Final output of 30volts + 200 pulse amps is sufficient for making free fuel. The approx 40 amp battery draw at 12v is replaced by standard alternator. Beefed up 450 Watts , instead of low watts CDI for an ignition coil.The magnetic field pulses also increases efficiency. Potassium Hydroxide as electrolyte allows passage of heavy current to water cell. I may replicate this also, as side project, as used at LOWERED output level, to fire just single spark plug as no separate cell, in engine.

(By the way, Archie Blue, engineer from new Zealand with Patent, also ran 2   4cyl cars on water using his special vertical cell of staggerd, perforated discs and side electrodes. Small air pimp input from cell bottom, bubbled upward, allowed the neutral air to CLEAN SWEEP the stuck ions from the thin aluminum discs. Improved Hydrogen Gas Generator efficiency. Seek and ye shall find.)

The high wattage CDI power supply, 2nd transformer Tr2 as inside the water cell, had no rectifier on secondary side output wanted. The waste heat was not desired by use of a rectifier as it was running on 200amps  current. Energy was then conserved, and Tr2 transformer had been changed to iron laminations instead of Ferrite material normally for high frequency. It's use allowed for what is expressed as a positive + pulse output as DC , due to the formation of a degenerated, type, of Critical Positive Wave , as seen on oscilloscope. Brilliant!. Taken all together, the electronic circuit was successful, and 2nd similar CDI Patent was issued as final output high voltage type, and 3rd Horvath Patent issued using Radiation Magnetron tube in water cell. That one was shown in the Ford Fairlane V8 engine, back in those days.

Horvath Patents Allowed Engine To Run On Water Improved Electrolysis Efficiency


Horvath Math for designing circuit for hydrogen generator. requires PULSE PEAK input 900w  into primary for 22A 2uf capacitor discharges at 10khz. Use old style scientific calculator for the formulas. I just went through it.  Secondary of TR2 has output diode, so as there being an on + off time for release of stuck ions from plates. I have flat nickel coated plates with flutes, knurled, with N + S magnets on back side. 3/8" acrylic plastic box, 400mesh nylon screen. The capacitor is 2uf as induction stove range type polypropylene capacitor high frequency type. .P type Mosfet paralleled as used for high side switching direct to spark plug, or N channel for regular use as applied to water cell. POH is 25% solution by weight,  meaning gallon is from both together same time -not gallon input water. .22 pulse amps becomes 200 amps pulse to plates. fast recovery heavy amp rectifier, or Horvath just used 3/4" iron laminations block with no diode, to get the critical positive wave out. AS used on input high frequency . China sells open board 1000 watts inverter with option of 330v terminals (to get about 600watts necessary) Can wind your own 2 transformers TR1 + TR, and can build your own switching inverter. L primary = C / I squared divided by E squared.  I = E X square root C / L.   Magnet wire as gauge # circular mills = 750 X I X duty cycle from wires chart. 10khz, .09joules each, 22A peak pulses, 371uh primary, 900w, 2uf, #16 #18 gauge primary, 2gauge secondary, Ratio 10:1 turns, duty cycle secondary .5 , water cell receives 450 Watts. Peak amps or watts is not average watts over the period time, .etc.

Grok  AI

What is average power in watts drawn from input 12v battery required for 900 PEAK pulse watts CDI capacitor into transformer with secondary diode and 50% on time only? Does this assume 450 watts average power to load

To determine the average power drawn from a 12 V battery to supply a CDI (Capacitor Discharge Ignition) system delivering 900 W peak pulse power into a transformer’s primary, with a 50% duty cycle (50% on-time) and a diode on the secondary, and to confirm if this results in 450 W average power to the load, let’s analyze step-by-step.
Key Parameters:

   Peak pulse power: 900 W into the primary during the on-time.
   Duty cycle: 50% (0.5), meaning the power is delivered for half the cycle.
   Battery voltage: 12 V (DC).
   Secondary side: Has a diode, delivering power to the load.
   Question: What is the average power drawn from the battery, and does this setup imply 450 W average power to the load?

Step-by-Step Analysis:
1. Average Power to the Load:

   The primary side delivers 900 W peak power during the 50% on-time. For a pulse transformer, the instantaneous power delivered to the primary is transferred to the secondary (assuming an ideal transformer with no losses).
   The average power delivered to the load on the secondary side is:
   Pavg, load=Ppeak×D=900×0.5=450 W.
   Pavg, load​=Ppeak​×D=900×0.5=450W.
   This confirms that, in an ideal system, the average power delivered to the load is indeed 450 W. The presence of the diode ensures unidirectional current to the load during the on-time, consistent with the 50% duty cycle.

2. Average Power Drawn from the Battery:

   In an ideal system (100% efficiency), the average power drawn from the battery equals the average power delivered to the load, as energy is conserved. Thus:
   Pavg, input=Pavg, load=450 W.
   Pavg, input​=Pavg, load​=450W.
   The CDI system stores energy in a capacitor during the off-time and discharges it into the primary during the on-time to achieve the 900 W peak power. The battery supplies a steady average power to charge the capacitor over the full cycle.

3. Average Current from the 12 V Battery:

   The average power drawn from the battery is:
   Pavg, input=V×Iavg.
   Pavg, input​=V×Iavg​.
   Given V=12 VV=12V and Pavg, input=450 WPavg, input​=450W, the average current is:
   Iavg=Pavg, inputV=45012=37.5 A.
   Iavg​=VPavg, input​​=12450​=37.5A.
   Thus, the battery supplies an average current of 37.5 A to provide 450 W average power, which supports the 900 W peak power during the 50% on-time.

4. Real-World Considerations:

   Real CDI systems have losses due to:
       Transformer inefficiencies (core losses, winding resistance).
       Diode forward voltage drop (typically 0.7–1 V for a standard diode, reducing output power).
       Capacitor charging/discharging inefficiencies.
       Switching losses in the CDI circuit.
   Assuming a typical efficiency of 80% (a reasonable estimate for CDI systems), the input power required to deliver 450 W to the load is:
   Pavg, input=Pavg, loadη=4500.8=562.5 W.
   Pavg, input​=ηPavg, load​​=0.8450​=562.5W.
   The average current from the 12 V battery becomes:
   Iavg=562.512≈46.9 A.
   Iavg​=12562.5​≈46.9A.
   The average power drawn from the battery is thus approximately 562.5 W with 80% efficiency.

5. Answering the Questions:

   Average power drawn from the 12 V battery:
       Ideal case (100% efficiency): 450 W.
       Realistic case (80% efficiency): ~562.5 W.
   Does this assume 450 W average power to the load?:
       Yes, the setup with 900 W peak power and a 50% duty cycle inherently results in 450 W average power to the load in an ideal system, as calculated (900×0.5=450 W900×0.5=450W). This is consistent with the transformer transferring 900 W peak power during the on-time, averaging to 450 W over the full cycle.

Final Answer:

   The average power drawn from the 12 V battery is 450 W in an ideal system, or approximately 562.5 W with 80% efficiency (requiring ~46.9 A average current).
   Yes, this setup assumes 450 W average power delivered to the load, as the 900 W peak power with a 50% duty cycle naturally results in 450 W average power in an ideal transformer syste

Horvath Tech Data CDI Circuits Build Project

Patent 3980053 Hydrogen generator was studied by me in great depth, quite a while back in time. I had way earlier, typed out a 2 page corrections of minor errors and items involved , not necessary to add to car engine to run on hydrogen fuel . Fuel upon demand, no gaseous storage. Things were printed as too expensive or particular design manufacturing, to detour others from duplicating the system. I was already aware of these common inclusions in a $5000 Patent. This letter is to inform you of my recent solution to a section of Patent data PROBLEM that was missed by me earlier, as wrong on purpose AND DESIGNED IN,,, the Patent literature. I am presently building the Horvath power supply and water cell tank for duplication, as an average individual would do it without the up above parts/ designs not necessary, but including all of the important EFFICIENCY IMPROVEMENTS as Horvath did. This project was on my mind for years, and quite similar to a beefed up Capacitor Discharge Ignition circuit, as used for powering an improved efficiency Electrolysis cell. He also took data from previous Patents of theirs and incorporated them in his design. It's really the amount of fuel generated, as important, not the efficiency of a power supply!

Here we go:-- A pulse energy into coil has a reverse flow back. The secondary side coil of a transformer follows the primary method the same, except for a ratio change of turns. There can be 60cycles or 20,000 cycles frequency or higher. In general, iron lamination sheets are used for lower frequency range, while Ferrite is on high frequency. As frequency increases, less turns are necessary on primary side. It makes it easier to wind on core. The Patent was correct in that on + off time is required for cell plates, as about/around 50% duty cycle, on the SECONDARY side transformer. This allows the stuck polarized ions to release and rise up in the solution. Horvath said to use iron laminations for TR2, as the secondary side receives what's called Positive Critical wave form as seen on Scope.( High frequency used on low frequency type core.) This was to get a DC pulse for making Hydrogen gas and WITHOUT A Rectifier which would cause loss of 40-70 Watts heat loss, reducing efficiency, the rectifier forward volts drop loss times the current 200amps. This inclusion in Patent was INTENTIONAL TO DETOUR others from duplicating the design as printed. NOT POSSIBLE to get sufficient Inductance in 100-300 microhenry range, at LOW turns, as necessary with the associated capacitor, on iron laminations!!! Ferrite must be used for way higher inductance on low number to turns to be able to get 10:1 ratio for 22A going to 200 A, with heavy battery cable low turns secondary side of transformer.
All you have to do is put fast recovery high frequency diodes/ rectifier on primary side to stop the reverse wave form, on both sides!

The secondary side sees the same thing!!! I have heatsink with flat pack diodes in parallel to increase current rating with balancing resistors .

My rectangle aquarium tank was made with 3/8" thick plates, expecting 6lbs pressure. Presently ordering #6 red cable and gauges. The separate plastic water safety container will have pop off rubber plug, microswitch shuts off oscillator capacitor ground connection, while the flashback arrestor is hand made with brass tube and brass wool, and SS screens. KOH is hard to find. Water solution is done by weight of water + chemical together, as 25% and 75% for total weight solution together.

Recent response came back back from GROKAI.COM assures I was right about how to get secondary side on + off DC properly for water cell with only diode on primary side of transformer TR2. Horvath Patent 3980053 is available to read on line.