Greg Coffey

That dog definitely earns her keep!

Last year was a real egg hunt year over the summer, but this year they've prioritized the nesting boxes in their coop. My chickens might just be spoiled with the nesting boxes, but we have not yet had a hen disappear and return with a clutch of chicks (maybe we just found all the eggs they were planning on raising out). To get new chickens, the solution I've hit upon is incubate for 19 days in the machine (fits 22 eggs), then place the eggs under a broody to hatch, where she promptly takes on the mothering role. Last year our chicks were raised by the mother hen until she was taken while protecting them, and then the chicks raised themselves. They did end up piling into the nesting boxes each night after she was taken (and consequently soiling the boxes regularly), which probably had a non-zero impact on the other hens' desire to use the boxes.

I got our original chicks from Sandhill Preservation, and I found that if we hatch the new chicks out in June, they're usually ramping up egg production in the late fall as the older ones wind down.

I do have the clear polycarb roof panels on the south-facing roof of the coop, so they do get a lot of natural light in the winter, which helps with the coop temps and laying. Looking to add some foiled insulation panels on the inside north of the coop this year, under the steel roofing panels, to reflect/keep some of their radiant heat in on cold winter nights.

I also do an annual deep-litter system with hemp, so they have over a foot to dig through on those snowy days when they don't go out. I empty last year's coop hemp into their covered run below the coop at the end of each fall, and take the churned composted stuff out of the covered run up to the garden to sit for the winter (top-dressed over the beds if we're ambitious). The coop gets the fresh hemp before the winter so they can have fresh litter to dig through all snow season, then by the time they start fowling it up, they're back in the woods nearly full time.

We've not had a problem with owls, or with our birds in trees for the night, although they do fly up into them when a fox or bobcat comes through.
Honestly, if they were in the trees overnight, I'd be more concerned about the pine martins around here... for that reason our birds have the coop and a sprocket-driven automatic door (a little splurge, but well worth it) to close it up each night.

I have tried to bring a little bit of the wild into their coop setup, so their roost bars are all pole-wood-sized saplings cut to span the coop, and suspended from the rafters... makes for an interesting racket if they get them swinging into the beams (big drumming noise), but I think they like it better, and it forces them to maintain their stabilizer muscles in a way that stationary roosts can't.

~Greg

Michael Waddington wrote:Interesting. We have a half pyreness who will be 2 next spring and she has dropped predation this year down to 1 bird that I think was her fault- she got too rough with and it died the next day. We had been losing 1/3 of our flock annually to predators (hawks, foxes, raccoons, and bobcats have been sighted) before that so I think she’s earning her keep anyway- just gotta keep working on getting her enough exercise and I’ll be watching her closely w them for a while.  We are mid CT by the river. That’s a good point about combs- I will be looking for a rose comb or pea comb variety of Icelandic if possible. Who did you source from?

Two open questions I have- do you have a system to keep getting eggs?  What about owls picking them off in winter if they roost in trees?  I’m expecting a lot of them to try to roost in trees and hide their eggs in the coming years- and if we eat a lot of eggs that end up in boxes we might be selecting for egg hiders, that may be the downside of my landrace plan. I’m still in the figuring out phase.

Hey Michael,

Really exciting news; moving into some more land!
I'm no expert... the birds do what they do, and the only power I have taken is in which eggs to set in an incubator periodically lol (But I'll share some thoughts, nonetheless)

I did find that, for whatever reason, this year the pressure from bobcats was very high, and even though I watched some great evasion by the flock, there were many times that I just found feather trails. Makes me hanker for a livestock guardian dog in the future.

Looking back, I'm glad for introducing the icelandics for their overall hardiness, but my main rooster had a floppy straight comb, and he would get frostbite each winter, so I'm not sure if you can control for combs a little better in your icelandic acquisition, but the straight comb is something I'm trying to breed out of subsequent generations, now that my main rooster is a gameXGSH (our icelandic roo finally fell in battle to a bobcat this summer after serving us well for 4ish years).

I, too, would love to get a composting run established for my birds in the winter, because as of right now they are on grain for the snowed-in months, with recess here and there as the weather permits.
Lots of ideas from these guys:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=65li_zGrHOo&list=PLihFHKqj6JerKruLfMcxdNKDRHkGxgwwz

Will you be more on the eastern or western side of CT when the move happens?

~Greg

Michael Waddington wrote:Hi Greg,

have been a chicken owner for well over a decade but it looks like we may get a property large enough to start landracing chickens this fall in CT.  I have a backyard flock with several breeds now (including ancona, dominique, buckeye, welsummer and easter egger), just did a bunch of research and decided on getting icelandics and golden spangled hamburgs and maybe a few game hens this spring (27) to mix with my existing flock.  Looks like you had the identical idea years earlier.  im looking for a free range forest chicken that can survive with minimal help, great at foraging and great with winters here, great at dodging predators and generally helpful in the forest for bugs and fertilizer.  I may do a composting operation to take them through winters.  I dont need anything now other than ideas or pointers if there is anything i need to know moving to forest free range.   I'll be ready to start trading birds in coming years.  

This upcoming weekend is processing time, so if anyone wants an Icelandic, Mixed American Game, or Heritage Red X Ice, speak now

Timothy Norton wrote:I'm currently working on getting local ordinances changed for where I live (No roosters) but I am excited for your project!

I live in NY on the Vermont border, if things change and I have the opportunity to expand my flock I'll be reaching out.

Sounds like you're up by Lake Champlain?
Definitely keep me posted on your quest, and if you want to grab some quality roosters when you succeed.

I take it you are looking at the NY Right to Farm Law, and any angle you might approach from where State Law supersedes County Ordinance?
https://rinckerlaw.com/overview-of-new-york-right-to-farm-law/

There's also this movement:
http://www.liftroosterban.com/

We're fortunate to live in a town that codified chickens (including roosters) as a right of the people

Hey All,

It wasn't that long ago that breeders in RI, NH, and NY produced some of the most successful breed-standard chickens, whose descendants are (to this day) among the most numerous on the planet.
Being permies, though, forces the focus toward a little more sustainability than breed-standard selection will typically produce... which is great because folks here are already interested in landrace flocks!

Before posting, I checked the forum and found the following threads, but there weren't too many New Englanders represented, and the threads are old, so here's to starting a new one!
https://permies.com/t/71257/Landrace-chickens
https://permies.com/t/138215/Landrace-Chicken-project-breeding-thoughts
https://permies.com/t/138104/thoughts-developing-landrace-breed
https://permies.com/t/204746/permaculture/Chicken-breeding


I've got a little of a landrace project going on my acreage in North Western RI, and am wondering if anyone wants to get in on the action with their own farms to share roosters and foster genetic diversity... or at least make sure that inbreeding is kept to a minimum.

All my original birds come from Sand Hill Preservation (who have been wonderful to work with if you're looking for specific breeds and hardy stock) and have been free-ranged (by day) with all the hard knocks that come with that.
I've got Icelandics, Golden Spangled Hamburgs, a [heritage] Rose Comb RI Red, Mixed American Game Foul (raising out this year), and some hybrids from last year's survivors.

If anyone is interested in Cockerels (free to any Permies interested in doing some landrace breeding collaboration), I've got the following (copying from my Craigslist post):

Icelandic (3):
As a medium-sized bird, Icelandics are known for their feed conversion (to eggs) and hardiness in the winter months.
One of these guys would be a perfect genetic specimen to breed into an existing flock to sire out hardier stock.
A super-hybrid adapted to the harsh environment of Iceland, they are the descendants of all the chickens brought by the Viking Settlers (all the chickens that could survive, that is).
Known as a 'landrace,' there is no breed standard, so they naturally express different coloration.


American Game (4):
We got these to breed further hardiness and independence into our flock. They are a genetic collection of various American Game Foul that were allowed to mix together to get back toward a 'wild' chicken. As such, they thrive on free range, will raise out their own young, and make great table birds (which is what will happen to any cockerels remaining).
They also have some of the most beautiful, complex plumage I've seen!
A YouTuber in FL has a playlist on why Games are the best homestead chicken; see:

*Games should not be brought into a flock with another rooster; once they hit sexual maturity, they will fight fierce for dominance. Anecdotally, Game Cocks have been known to kill off predators attacking the flock (like hawks and owls), while maintaining a pleasant temperament toward humans.*


Red-Ice (2):
Cockerels whose father was Icelandic and whose mother was a heritage-breed RI Red (not the modern production red from the farm stores...). All the benefits of the Icelandic Breed, with the ability to pass on genes for a little more laying.
Perfect homestead rooster.



If you're interested in some cockerels, let me know, but more importantly, if you're in the New England region and want to help make an überhuhn for permaculture homesteads, let's get organized in this thread!

Opinion:

It sounds like a great idea to incorporate wool, as long as it's carded and spread evenly throughout the mix.
The idea is not unlike tried and true technology, like horsehair plaster, reinforced concrete, or modern resin composites (laminated carbonfiber/fiberglass in resin).

You create the composite by combining a strong but brittle material (plaster, resin, etc.) with a flexible fiber that can bind across multiple fragments if/when there are microfractures. This holds it all together.

It sounds like your design constraints are pushing you toward a batch-box-style RMH, built with a lot of perlite mixed into whichever medium you choose for your mass (cob / concrete / other masonry).

The trade-off here is that light-weight means, literally, less mass (i.e. less thermal mass to store the heat) in the unit itself.


In light of the above, here are two options to consider, and do further research on:

*Add framing to your floor so it can support more mass above it.

*Construct a light-weight RMH with a large heat exchange that conveys the heat into a large, insulated, open tank of water somewhere to hold all the excess heat you scavenge.
You can then put loops of your domestic potable and/or hydronic water lines through that tank to preheat them and save some energy.

Based on that picture, it looks like a series of old puffball fungi that fruited out a while ago... potentially on some of that disturbed soil.

This may or may not be too helpful in your situation, but one path for more research that may help out is how the mycorrhizal networks are working together in the soils.

Depending on how much soil you've moved with your little guys, you may end up creating miniature subterranean battlefields where the fungi are trying to assert dominance in slightly different soils, only to be starved off of nutrients and water.

Growing up around their parent tree, the wildlings will be 'nursed' a constant supply of what they need to grow, transmitted by the network of roots and fungal strands. Ween them too soon, and they will not do as well.


You could also try potting them and then making a business selling wild-crafted bonsai trees...

You can probably help the apple out by planting some garlic or similar allium family foods with it. The space will be productive, and the shared root space will provide for the exchange of some of the pungent factors of the allium into the apple to dissuade insects and other pathogens from damaging your young trees.