Ah, that is it - thanks Nicole! I'm sure it is a good course. I guess I'm developing a bit of an issue with the university system. I spent a decade, plus, paying off student loans. I'm sure the OSU program is absolutely awesome, but the free stuff is never "for credit". Of course, nothing worthwhile should be demanded for free! But, it really bothers me that I can take the same class (English, math or history, for instance) at a community college for $75 as I can at a state university of (minimum) $300 per credit hour (so, $1,600 per class?)… or $7,000 at a private college. Federal Financial Aid will cover the state university and lower cost.... and somehow, tuition at the universities increases as financial aid or access to student loans increases.... funny, that... But.... the certification or degree is equally valuable from all... no matter how much you pay. You "make your bones" in your first job... and after that, it doesn't matter if you went to MIT or Harvard... or Backwoods Community College. When it comes to a PDC.... the value really depends on the instructor/s. My PDC was well worth the money, and really much more. Meanwhile.... I really have concerns about modern college education... and I guess Bill Mollison did too, since he didn't want Permaculture taught in colleges. My uncle was a very prominent Landscape Design Architecture pof… wrote the books that are used in university programs.... but it was all "theory"... he denigrated my self educated, "ignorant farmer" grandfather (who built and designed homes, cleared land, grew a farm into an amazing success and became a prominent "gentleman farmer")…. but he never even had a garden or even cut his own grass.... he wrote textbooks and computer programs, but never even attempted to do what was in them... Well, I'm way off on a tangent... I have tons of (crazy expensive) post grad education that turned out to be little more than a mental exercise. I guess, were I to pay someone to teach me something... I'd damn sure rather an "ignorant farmer" than a college prof.... that is, if the prof has no practical experience.... if he has both the academic and practical knowledge, well... that is something... but I still wouldn't ever go into debt for any education, in anything, ever again! The OSU Permaculture program doesn't qualify for federal financial aid... so, Id probably just got find an old farmer to work for.... and maybe learn something about life, as well. Regardless, I've just taken the long way around of saying that if a university program's "certificate" ever carries more weight than a traditional or online DC, for a fraction of the cost... or even more, if someone were willing to pay it... I'll be quite negative toward that program.