Ben Brownell

+ Follow
since Sep 12, 2024
Merit badge: bb list bbv list
Biography
Collaborative eco-design-build background. Most active on the creative edges of regenerative development and "wild placemaking" in temperate to arid western US states presently. Keen to cultivate more and better long term relationships between humans and their landscapes through apt engagement with and toward healthy whole systems.

I can help find, assess, and strategize optimal rural live-work real estate or land tenure situations if interested!
For More
Klamath-Siskiyou CA
Apples and Likes
Apples
Total received
In last 30 days
0
Forums and Threads

Recent posts by Ben Brownell

Excellent pointers William, thank you. Indeed, this is a somewhat improvised "working (I hope!) prototype" to be refined or replaced later, so keeping things semi-modular is ideal.

I had been looking for an old wood stove of suitable size to just plop in place, but haven't found any that would fit properly. I do want a good door and draft control on it at least, so may resort to having a metal shop cut the front face off of a salvage stove or buying a simple custom rig, or e.g. the barrel stove kits.

Will have to do more testing on my cob/plaster blends and see how they do under heat stress. I kind of suspect there's a sweet spot of aggregate type, size, and proportion that fares better. Going to look into some earthen oven threads and see what people recommend there next.
1 week ago

William Bronson wrote:I think cob oven that has a flat ceiling would be hard to make and not very stable.
This is one reason domed ovens are popular
Most of the tutorials I seen for making the domed ovens call for cobbing over a form, that has been constructed from damp sand.
After the cob sets , the sand is removed through the doorway of the oven.

If you don't object to metal, just cost, cast iron griddles can be had for cheap in second hand shops.
They have even been used as ceilings in the burn chambers of batch box rocket stoves, so they should hold up in this application.
Stainless steel steam table pans or even regular steel sheet pans might serve your purposes as well.
For a steel dome, try stainless steel mixing bowls.



Yes, sorry for confusion William, I am describing a cube shape fire box that is in its own separate chamber directly below the typical dome shaped oven. So, the flat 'roof' is actually the dividing layer between them; and yes I agree that a properly sized metal sheet could work well (and I'm keeping my eyes out). But lacking that, I was thinking possibly a ~2" mesh-reinforced concrete layer with clay brick embedded on top of that. I'm unsure how well ordinary concrete would hold up to repeated firing like that, and wondering if I should try a custom mixture for better performance, or pass on that idea and stick to metal in some form.
1 week ago
Thanks Cristobal, that info matches my sense about cob oven design and performance. In this case, I'm making the oven more as an experiment, for occasional use based on its performance. I think it will be useful for some form of cooking/baking, but I'm not too worried about getting especially high performance for any one specific use. Ideally, when firing, it would swirl the hot flue gasses and perhaps allow some secondary combustion rising out of the fire box below, as well as some conducted heat through the oven floor / top of fire box, to pick up as much heat as desired. When its up to good temperature, the fire can reduce to coals and sustain heat for a while during cooking use (either with or without continued flue draft, since it can exhaust to the side as well).

So, my main question here is how to build up the walls and roof of the firebox, on top of an existing stone seat or 'frame', so that they will hold up to repeated firing, without installing a metal box or lots of brick. I've done a good bit of burning inside another stone-clay fire box underneath my hot tub, and that's survived okay with some repairs as needed. I guess I'm curious what else could be done to improve the durability of earth and stone, if that's my default solution, incorporate cement/lime/other additives for integrity, or another option I haven't considered.

And I should have mentioned, I do intend to use a metal front face and door with draft control to enclose and regulate the fire that way.
1 week ago
Interested in creative solutions for building up a simple custom fire box from basic materials at hand - i.e. clay, stone, cement, etc - for a (protected) outdoor wood cookstove-oven assembly. I have done some reading on here and get the sense that combustion chambers are generally either metal, or fire brick, with some specialized cement based mixes that can work as well. The gist being that clay/earthen based material does not hold up to repeated high heat and will crumble with use. Is that a correct assessment?

If I'm lacking those preferred options (without significant cost or scrounging) and want to try and improvise an alternative, is there an obvious second tier option or options? I'd like to try some clay-mortared stone and see how it holds up. I'm not opposed to doing occasional maintenance touchup, and this stove won't see heavy or intense (high heat) use. The biggest challenge would be a decent 'roof' layer, which I'd be willing to do a custom steel reinforced cement mix to keep it on the thinner side, say 3-4", maybe incorporating old clay brick on the upper face.

Still early in design process with this, and getting a sense of what's reasonable before finalizing plans, so I welcome thoughts, tips, or reference points. I know there's lots of accumulated knowledge here and maybe some good discussions that I missed in my initial search. I will elaborate on the design in a separate thread when it's ready to go, but I'm hoping to have this approx. 20"x20"x16" firebox placed underneath a typical domed earthen oven, with one flue pipe leading up into the back of it (for heating) as well as a second close-able flue going up and out the side into a single 'burner' cooktop set into a small cob countertop.
1 week ago
Some big questions tied up in that inquiry! Without knowing a lot more personal particulars, I'd be curious what sort of local community and broader ecological landscape you would want to be a part of? And where do you see yourself on a general learning curve of the skills/experience needed to reach your goals? If those things aren't real clear, you may want to consider allowing yourself the opportunity of a lower commitment 'test run' or self-directed apprenticeship in a space/setting that provides informal support, while familiarizing with a wider region that you can eventually home in on optimal long term living situation with lots more confidence, and more time to scan for uniquely suited properties.

Another route might be working with a capable consultant who can convey lots more personalized insight and advice to avoid unwelcome surprises and course corrections. *raises hand* ...which is something I can probably offer if interested, reach out to discuss!
4 weeks ago
Without heavy equipment, options seem rather limited on that scale. Dealing with not just trunks but stumps there is quite a challenge, if you want to convert toward meadow conditions. I'd be inclined to consider large pit burning to further reduce woody material into charcoal, and slowly work through the area in patches. It sounds like it's pretty flat topography, or I'd consider stacking log segments into any gullies or depressions and burying. One more thought is just playing with some creative "snow fence" lines of log poles to create a bunch of minor microclimates and more protected zones (shade and browse) that also catch winter snow drifts for additional hydration.
1 month ago
Timber frame construction, which generally has wider spacing between supports like rafters/joists, typically uses 2x6 tongue and groove for decking on roofs, sometimes floors (especially lofts). Pricier than ply, but maybe worth it for certain advantages.
1 month ago
I don't have specific pointers, but a couple additional considerations: for one, the water table or depth to standing water in your well may be much shallower, for purpose of your pump rating calculations. There is always some standing 'water column' in the bottom of the well that can fluctuate a bit seasonally or based on use, but may average 100' or more of total well depth. Your neighbors or the well driller may have local insight on estimating that. Second, the pump will need to be suited for a particular water system design and usage. There are different ways to set things up, like using a cistern/tank and gravity feed (how far above well head?) vs pressure tank that's more 'on demand'. What kind of water (volume) usage do you expect, and when (daytime & season)? What's the power supply going to be - standalone unit, or connected to house/other system? No need to elaborate here, but those are things you probably want to get clear on to discuss with a professional or installer.
1 month ago
I would offer that one helpful way to approach a big reset / relocation like that is to leave yourself some options to reorient again to an even better situation in a few years' time after you've given yourself a practice run and chance to test the waters somewhere new. Basically, don't get hung up on needing to find the perfect happy-ever-after home right away, and pick someplace that will allow you the flexibility to a) try a bunch of new things out on a small scale while you learn and build your confidence, and b) give you the option to resell easily at a modest return for your efforts if you choose to in a few years.

Rural real estate is not as reliable financially as more conventional city properties that have a much bigger buyer market behind them. But that also means you can find some great deals out there if you know what to look for and what kinds of improvements you can manage on your own. There are a few more pitfalls to avoid as well, when it comes to assessing what's there and potential liabilities, so it's good to have a trustworthy professional on your side before finalizing anything. Feel free to ask more questions here as you search, and good luck setting yourself and a little patch of earth up for satisfying growth ahead!
1 month ago
How goes the excavations, Josh?

I've gotten sucked in down the hand-dug rabbit hole myself, slowly but surely, for similar reasons (or, arguably, lack thereof)! Mainly due to combination of good workable geology that's near a sweet spot of carveable X stable, desire for bulk fill material supply, and the appeal of year round passive climate control.

So far about 15' into an exploratory tunnel just to see how goes, and what's possible, but starting to dream bigger as the potential utility + feasibility expands. Not really thinking in terms of living space so much, but I suppose having a manageable 'bolt hole' in case of emergency (like fire) could be a real life saver. Originally thinking more for root cellar and general cool (non-freezing) storage. Currently most excited about the prospect of large volume underground water storage, since I can fairly easily channel a good amount of winter surface flow down in there, and the substrate is pretty near impervious to drainage as is. It's pretty slow going so I'm sure I'll be able to experiment and adjust over a few seasons to home in on good long term plan for it. Fun side project anyhow, especially during hot weather! Amazing to just climb in to 20-30F cooler temps like that.

Photo of current "R&D" status here:

1 month ago