High blood pressure

So the docs have decided I have high blood pressure- its been the same for the past decade but suddenly it is apparently a problem!

I'm 33, female, 74kg (so a bit overweight but not by much), do 6-10 hours of purposeful exercise a week (I compete in triathlons), don't drink caffeine (only fruit tea), drink moderate alcohol (maybe 4 * 500ml bottles of hard cider a week), eat a reasonable diet (as in almost everything is home-cooked, no added salt, no ready-meals, hardly ever eat out, eats laods of home-grown fruit, veg and eggs). I do intermittent fasting twice a week- one 24 hour and one 16 hour.

What else can I try? I'm not really bothered (as in I have no symptoms of high blood pressure other than the measurements), but I need to get it low enough that the doctors will leave me alone for another year (and refill my contraceptive pill prescription!).

Charli Wilson wrote: I'm not really bothered (as in I have no symptoms of high blood pressure other than the measurements),

Hence the name "the silent killer".  Most people have no symptoms until they get kidney disease or have a stroke.  

I have had good results from a supplement I got on Amazon here: Amazon - blood pressure

That is not an affiliate link, I don't make money from it.

Like Trace said the "Silent Killer", I didn't know there were symptoms of high blood pressure.    I have never had any though dear hubby says when his ears ring that means his blood pressure is high.

I have read that Hibiscus tea will really help.

https://permies.com/t/86422/kitchen/high-blood-pressure-herbs#711254

https://permies.com/t/71881/kitchen/Hibiscus-Tea

Charli - you sound like you are doing a lot of the right things.  High blood pressure can also be caused by stress though.  Could this be a factor?  

Anne Miller wrote:Like Trace said the "Silent Killer", I didn't know there were symptoms of high blood pressure.    I have never had any though dear hubby says when his ears ring that means his blood pressure is high.

I have read that Hibiscus tea will really help.

https://permies.com/t/86422/kitchen/high-blood-pressure-herbs#711254

https://permies.com/t/71881/kitchen/Hibiscus-Tea

Yes I read this too and would really appreciate an update i.e. from those that have posted on this saying they are trying it out.  It seems a lovely way of dealing with this condition and one I am on the verge of trying.

I don't really have an answer a side from suggesting this website.

Weston A Price Blood Pressure Search

Many articles on differing topics.

Hopefully this is helpful to you and good luck!

Be your own doctor: buy a bloodpressure meter (not the wrist version, very often incorrect readings), the upper-arm version. They are quite cheap.
Measure your pressure (pref. in the morning when it's highest) and record this in a journal. Maybe in the 1st couple of weeks, measure several times/day.
It helped me a lot. Going into the 105-170 area, left the working-in-shift job, and now in the 80-120 region (now almost 60 yrs old).
most interesting discovery, for me, was to find out that after eating too much sweets (read; sugars,bread etc.) my bloodpressure would increase AFTER 24 HOURS.... so a kind of killer-delay.
So, write in your journal what you eat and soon you will find the offending food

Tommy Wilder wrote:Be your own doctor: buy a bloodpressure meter (not the wrist version, very often incorrect readings), the upper-arm version. They are quite cheap.
Measure your pressure (pref. in the morning when it's highest) and record this in a journal. Maybe in the 1st couple of weeks, measure several times/day.
It helped me a lot. Going into the 105-170 area, left the working-in-shift job, and now in the 80-120 region (now almost 60 yrs old).
most interesting discovery, for me, was to find out that after eating too much sweets (read; sugars,bread etc.) my bloodpressure would increase AFTER 24 HOURS.... so a kind of killer-delay.
So, write in your journal what you eat and soon you will find the offending food

I have ordered a blood pressure meter! It should arrive in a few days- I didn't realise how cheap they were- even clinically-approved ones.

I've had much better success with the wrist version than the upper arm. I have both. I suspect it is going to vary person to person. But it needs to be used correctly, mine has a light that let's you know that you're in the right position. As well as the fact that the upper arm version can be very painful for some people. So try things out, find out what works for you.

I've now got an upper-arm monitor- its what the doctors use so  I figured it would then match! I figure I shall write a food diary for a week, as well as taking blood pressure readings morning and evening- see if I can find any correlations.

I don't think stress is an issue.. I'm pretty laid back. Having said that- I do a lot, I have something planned for every evening! Am I creating my own internal stress? I'm on holiday from work for the next week so this might help me tell!

If you are not taking your BP at home you might want to try that.   Tests in England show that your tests can be 10-20% higher just because of nerves in a doctors office.  Take it at the same time, preferably in the morning.  Give up the coffee and the booze.  Easier said than done I know.  Hibiscus tea seems to work and studies from Iran prove it.  Beet juice as well. Research Ashwagandha and K2 MK-7.  I have also used mukta vati (IVY).  I tend to throw the kitchen sink at these kind of problems.  Please please do your own DD. I am so far away from being a doctor so don't take any of this as medical advice.  The long and the short of it, you can get it down.  Used to be heavy into triathlons training up to 20 hours a week, with a resting pulse of 42.  Didn't make a difference in the BP.  Good Luck, the solution is out there.

I think I'm mostly annoyed that the doctor can only give me generic advice (and obviously didn't listen to my answers). Like to give up caffeine- when I don't drink tea, coffee or soda! Or to do more exercise- well I can't fit more than 10 hours a week in and still make it to work! I wouldn't say I'm super fit, but I cycle a few hundred miles a month, and run another hundred so I'm not exactly a couch potato. I've got some hibiscus and will be trying it in tea, once I've got some 'baseline numbers'.

Charli Wilson wrote:I've now got an upper-arm monitor- its what the doctors use so  I figured it would then match! I figure I shall write a food diary for a week, as well as taking blood pressure readings morning and evening- see if I can find any correlations.

I don't think stress is an issue.. I'm pretty laid back. Having said that- I do a lot, I have something planned for every evening! Am I creating my own internal stress? I'm on holiday from work for the next week so this might help me tell!

If you like what you are doing, keep doing it! That's not creating stress, probably happiness . However if it feels like a burden, you might rethink your busy evenings. Good luck with the journal!
tommy

One easy fix for many people is something like oatmeal. In addition to decreasing all-cause mortality by 22%, swapping out refined grains for oatmeal, with its much higher levels of soluble fibre, could easily cut your blood pressure. This presupposes that you have any refined grain to cut from your diet, and that you aren't already taking in sufficient soluble fibre, but these are issues with many people on the typical western diet.

Additionally, it has been proven in lab studies (though I have temporarily lost the link to the article) that the chemical compounds that make up the smell of forest floor decomposition, that we are normally exposed to when walking through a mostly closed-canopy forest environment, cause us to relax, right down to our blood pressure. So if possible, take detours through forests on your bike rides, and perhaps, if you take scheduled rest breaks during training, make sure one happens in or immediately downwind from, a forest.

Lastly, coming at it from the other side, I was once cautioned by my doctor that I was borderline overdosing on my daily blueberry/kale/almond milk smoothie. Granted, after I added the kale, it was black in colour, and it was, shall we say, and acquired taste, but one of the things he told me that it was doing well was essentially scrubbing my innards clean of the deposits that, in some, clog arteries and cause high blood pressure.

Do you have any other dietary concerns that will complicate making changes? Allergies, or preexisting conditions that require a specific diet?

In any case, please keep us posted. We are all likely to be on one end of this issue or the other at some point. Good luck, and let us know.

-CK

It sounds like you are doing an excellent job of trying to fix it.  I have been using an arm style meter for over 20 years.  My grandmother was a nurse and always watched her blood pressure.  I have diverticulitis and my blood pressure goes sky high when I get an infection.  It took years for them to discover what the problem was and they tried medicating me.  The snake venom they were giving me was so strong I could barley get chores done on the farm.  I quit taking all medication about 10 years ago.  I have found Hibiscus kills my high blood pressure quickly.  It also make my lips numb like I just chugged a couple of beers.  If I have a blood pressure reading of 138/90 and drink one cup of hibiscus it will go down to 129/79.  Now, stress is the number one thing that I see that increases my blood pressure.  I hope you will find something that works for you.

I'm going to say something generally unpopular in the broad population, and i won't get into a big discussion, but if you haven't eliminated all animal products from your diet, that would be a good place to start and most likely a cheap effective cure.

as far as intermittent fasting there have been some interesting studies--webpage

note this is one article, with several other related studies mentioned there as well.  

Here's another link about treating HBP with diet  webpage

Charli Wilson wrote:So the docs have decided I have high blood pressure- its been the same for the past decade but suddenly it is apparently a problem!

eat a reasonable diet

Hi Charli
My 5 cent here ...

First. Change your doctor. Many traditional mainstream doctors will give you pills, and when your value gets to whithin a certain range, they call victory. Only a holistic or alternative doc will look at you in a complete way: sleep pattern, exercise, thiroid function, other organs, familiy history, allergies, intolerances, fungal infections etc.

Second. Maybe you want to revise your diet. By what standard is it "reasonable"? Depending on your body, you might want to give up gluten, or lactose, or meat, or pork, or carbs, or fats or .... etc.

Third. Take some sessions with a psychologist. Many chronic deseases and other physical conditions have their underlying cause in the mind. Mental conditions can get transmitted through the generations, without us knowing. Getting concient about all this, helps you decide about your own life, and about your health. I recommend somebody from the corner of NLP, family constellations, genosociograms etc. In my experience, these guys get you right to the point with unconcious work, helping and healing, instead of keeping you in endless sessions.

(disclaimer: this is not medical advice, just personal experience)
cheerio!

Chris Kott wrote:
Additionally, it has been proven in lab studies (though I have temporarily lost the link to the article) that the chemical compounds that make up the smell of forest floor decomposition, that we are normally exposed to when walking through a mostly closed-canopy forest environment, cause us to relax, right down to our blood pressure. So if possible, take detours through forests on your bike rides, and perhaps, if you take scheduled rest breaks during training, make sure one happens in or immediately downwind from, a forest.

I have the book written based off that research, it's called The Nature Fix. These relaxation parks/trips were very popular in Korea and Japan at the time of the book's writing, and picking up in other countries. They found that measured stress would drop for several days after 1-2 hours of walking in a woodland setting if I recall.

There was another study done that showed just petting your dog lowered blood pressure.  It works for me, but you have to be "in the moment".  If you do it mindlessly, it doesn't seem to work.  You have to be present and really interacting with the dog.  It's extremely relaxing when you actually do that and shut out your other issues for the time being.  

What you are doing sounds healthy.

Calcium buildup in the arteries can be a factor in HBP.

Are you taking a calcium supplement? Or a diet high in calcium? The body can only absorb somewhere between 500 - 700 mg of calcium at a time so do not exceed this amount. Are you taking Vit. K2? Vitamin K2 is like the person at the airport directing the planes where to taxi. K2 tells calcium to go to the bones instead of building up in the arteries. Citrate is most absorb-able form.

{Other supplements to assist with calcium absorption into the bones are D3, Boron, Silica, Magnesium (half as many mg of calcium).}

Hope this is beneficial and is a simple fix.

Bee Well.

jordan barton wrote:I don't really have an answer a side from suggesting this website.

Weston A Price Blood Pressure Search

Many articles on differing topics.

Hopefully this is helpful to you and good luck!

 ^
This.

And the index of Nutrition Tests For Better Health lists symptoms, then links to pages containing assessments in the form of questions that doctors and specialists might consider.  The introduction explains about identifying deficiencies and - if there is a deficiency - why addressing one deficiency at a time is important.  

If you doubt the diagnosis, have you thought about getting a second opinion?  

Maybe researching test results could bring some clarity.  How those are determined.  When and why a test range changes.  

Perhaps genetic predisposition, certain foods, or environment could be a factor as demonstrated in Weston A. Price's research.

Andrew Saul's site has been very useful when I was learning (still/always learning) to self-advocate.

And possibly what might help to consider above the rest, is ways to reduce stress.  Stress alone can be the root of all manner of things.

I feel doctors have been terribly challenged to provide the kind of health care many of us need, which kind of leaves some of us fending for ourselves.  Here's one example:  https://www.statnews.com/2018/07/26/physicians-not-burning-out-they-are-suffering-moral-injury/

My husband went to a naturopath here in Portland, and the advice for high blood pressure was:

-hibiscus tea (already mentioned, and delicious!)
-celery - lots and lots of celery
-beets - he roasted them and ate them like apples

This worked for a few years, although he's now taking a pill.  He's quite a bit older than you, though.

If you are unhappy with your doctor, get one you are happy with.

I too have high blood pressure and have looked deeply into this. I need to lose weight to really make a dent. But plant-wise here is what I found:


Radish (Raphanus sativus L.): dry dosage range = 13-55 grams.
1. Leaf: 2.5%/day of feed = ∆ 19/? in one study. Assuming 500 grams of carbohydrate feed = 13 grams, dry weight assumed.
2. Radish Leaf ethyl acetate extract: 7.5 grams/day, Leaf Weight/extract ratio = 56:1. About 420 grams leaf weight assumed = 55 grams leaf dried weight. NOTE: 4X THE DOSE OF OTHER STUDY!

Eclipta Alba leaf: dry dosage range = 3-17 grams, invasive 4”-40” high annual, 45-60 day delay for results.
1. Alcoholic extract was found safe up to 5000 mg/kg orally given to rats. ∆ 139/x to 112/x. A 25% reduction of blood pressure in rats! Human dose: 17 grams/day for 185Lb man of extract evaporated from 80% ethyl alcohol soxhlet. Dried plant leaf/extract weight ratio unknown.
2. 3 grams dried leaf/day human dose = ∆ 19/11. Less professional human subject Indian study.

Mukia Maderaspatana leaf: 4.5grams/day, after 45 days = ∆ 23/15 Raja 2007. Note: also called Melothria Maderaspatana. Vine grows to zone 5, eBay only seed source found (from Poland).

Stevia leaf: 11% stevioside. 11% at 750mg extract = 7 grams/day dried leaf.
2nd study claimed concentration 4.4%-9.9%. (17 grams/day worst case)
3rd study claimed concentration 6.5%-8.6%.  
1. A 3 x 250mg/day of stevioside extract = 10% BP reduction.
2. 2nd study: 500mg/day of stevioside extract = 6.5% reduction.
3. Try say…11grams/day dry leaf + 500ml HOT water. (1:45 ratio).
-------------------------------
Possibly dangerous stuff:
Hibiscus tea: 2.6 grams/day ABSOLUTE MAXIMUM = ∆ 7/3.
Testicular/sperm issues above max dose! Try 1.3 grams?

Beetroot Juice: 250ml = ∆ 8/5. Nitrate causes cancer? Also use of mouthwash kills bacteria in the mouth needed for nitrate-nitrite conversion.
-------------------------------
OTC Remedies:

Cardamom powder: 3 grams/day, after 90 days = ∆ 19/12.

Chlorogenic acid: after 90 days 140mg/day = ∆ 15/5. Maximum dose 300mg/day.

Olive Leaf extract: absolute minimum 1gram/day of 20% oleuropein extract decreased BP by ∆11.5/4.8. 20% x gram = 200mg. Oleuropein is generally the most prominent phenolic compound in olive cultivars and can reach concentrations of up to 140 mg/gram on a dry matter basis in young olives and 60–90 mg/gram of dry matter in the leaves. Which at 60mg/gram to get 200mg requires 3.33grams of dried leaf. 6mg/gram dried leaf 2nd source = 33 grams dried leaf/day.

Taurine: 1.6grams/day = ∆ 7/5. A 6 gram/day study found improvement in 1 week.

Magnesium Citrate: 600mg/day = ∆ 5.6/2.8

1 ounce 90% coca/day
1 gram fish oil/day
200mg CoQ10/day (expensive)

How's it going, Charli?  Are your daily readings showing improvement?

marcus thompson wrote:I too have high blood pressure and have looked deeply into this. I need to lose weight to really make a dent. But plant-wise here is what I found:


Radish (Raphanus sativus L.): dry dosage range = 13-55 grams.
1. Leaf: 2.5%/day of feed = ∆ 19/? in one study. Assuming 500 grams of carbohydrate feed = 13 grams, dry weight assumed.
2. Radish Leaf ethyl acetate extract: 7.5 grams/day, Leaf Weight/extract ratio = 56:1. About 420 grams leaf weight assumed = 55 grams leaf dried weight. NOTE: 4X THE DOSE OF OTHER STUDY!

Eclipta Alba leaf: dry dosage range = 3-17 grams, invasive 4”-40” high annual, 45-60 day delay for results.
1. Alcoholic extract was found safe up to 5000 mg/kg orally given to rats. ∆ 139/x to 112/x. A 25% reduction of blood pressure in rats! Human dose: 17 grams/day for 185Lb man of extract evaporated from 80% ethyl alcohol soxhlet. Dried plant leaf/extract weight ratio unknown.
2. 3 grams dried leaf/day human dose = ∆ 19/11. Less professional human subject Indian study.

Mukia Maderaspatana leaf: 4.5grams/day, after 45 days = ∆ 23/15 Raja 2007. Note: also called Melothria Maderaspatana. Vine grows to zone 5, eBay only seed source found (from Poland).

Stevia leaf: 11% stevioside. 11% at 750mg extract = 7 grams/day dried leaf.
2nd study claimed concentration 4.4%-9.9%. (17 grams/day worst case)
3rd study claimed concentration 6.5%-8.6%.  
1. A 3 x 250mg/day of stevioside extract = 10% BP reduction.
2. 2nd study: 500mg/day of stevioside extract = 6.5% reduction.
3. Try say…11grams/day dry leaf + 500ml HOT water. (1:45 ratio).
-------------------------------
Possibly dangerous stuff:
Hibiscus tea: 2.6 grams/day ABSOLUTE MAXIMUM = ∆ 7/3.
Testicular/sperm issues above max dose! Try 1.3 grams?

Beetroot Juice: 250ml = ∆ 8/5. Nitrate causes cancer? Also use of mouthwash kills bacteria in the mouth needed for nitrate-nitrite conversion.
-------------------------------
OTC Remedies:

Cardamom powder: 3 grams/day, after 90 days = ∆ 19/12.

Chlorogenic acid: after 90 days 140mg/day = ∆ 15/5. Maximum dose 300mg/day.

Olive Leaf extract: absolute minimum 1gram/day of 20% oleuropein extract decreased BP by ∆11.5/4.8. 20% x gram = 200mg. Oleuropein is generally the most prominent phenolic compound in olive cultivars and can reach concentrations of up to 140 mg/gram on a dry matter basis in young olives and 60–90 mg/gram of dry matter in the leaves. Which at 60mg/gram to get 200mg requires 3.33grams of dried leaf. 6mg/gram dried leaf 2nd source = 33 grams dried leaf/day.

Taurine: 1.6grams/day = ∆ 7/5. A 6 gram/day study found improvement in 1 week.

Magnesium Citrate: 600mg/day = ∆ 5.6/2.8

1 ounce 90% coca/day
1 gram fish oil/day
200mg CoQ10/day (expensive)

You've certainly done your homework!  So....from all this comprehensive/detailed study, what are you taking away from it - presumably not the whole lot!? 🤪

I did a little research into beetroot i.e. hoping it might prove a valid alternative to the wretched tablets I loathe taking daily for high blood pressure.  What I came away with is that, being a plant, there is no way of establishing a stable/standardised dosage.  Of course you could err on the side of caution but it scared me off going down that route.  Also, as you say, there's a link between nitrate and cancer; it seems to be a complex issue, yes?   So, thus far, I'm still stuck with the tablets.  

What are you now doing about your condition?