Are you Kombucha or Kefir?

You know that question "are you a dog person or a cat person"? I feel like the more appropriate question for permies is "are you Kombucha or Kefir?"
Kombucha prefers to be left alone. If given everything it needs, it can survive and flourish in solitude. Ignore it for days, weeks even, please.
Water Kefir loves attention! Check up on it every day! Feed it! Stir it! It will excel with a variety of additives! Gets bored and sad if you forget about it...
Which one better matches your personality? Unique people beget unique personal descriptions.

I have never had Kombucha or Kefir though I have read a lot about them.

I would say I would be a Kombucha person since it likes to be left alone and my understanding is that it is a tea and I like tea.

I've only ever had Kombucha and even it eventually got ahead of me! I'd like to try water kefir, as I can't tolerate much milk.

As a general rule, I try not to "drink" my calories. Clear herbal teas and lots of water are my fluids of choice.  Other than the very occasional 2" of wine (my friends all consider me a *very* cheap drunk), I will drink Black cherry juice as a medicinal, or if symptoms suggest it's needed, Cranberry juice.

That was one of my concerns with the Kombucha - I had to feed it sugar and I was never sure how much of the sugar had been consumed vs how much was left over in the liquid I was drinking.

BOTH! I do get that having either can feel high maintenance at times. I remember my sister saying "I'm not making sourdough, I don't want a pet."
I use the freeze dried kefir starter which goes through about 5-6 batches of milk (or cream for sour cream) per sachet as an alternative to maintaining grains. I'm working on getting some grains since I'm going to be more able to take care of them better going forward. My issue with kombucha is all of the scoby sheets. I feel bad discarding them but there is only so much kombucha I can cycle through at a time!

Jay Angler wrote:That was one of my concerns with the Kombucha - I had to feed it sugar and I was never sure how much of the sugar had been consumed vs how much was left over in the liquid I was drinking.

I was thinking that perhaps you could use a hygrometer to test the specific gravity of kombucha like we do when brewing beer, but the information is a little confusing since those are more geared toward sugar being converted into alcohol via yeast and the bacteria aspect of kombucha alters that. it may still give you enough info to know that your sugar content has dropped to where you want it. However, a refractometer, used to measure the brix in wine would be a more specific and accurate option.

I also realize this may be way more than most people would do for homemade kombucha, but thought I'd post it in case anyone was looking at this thread in the future with questions about larger scale kombucha brewing or needing it to be as on the nose sugar-free as possible. And some people are comfortable with more precision and control in their brewing/ferments, some like to wing it!

Mercy Pergande wrote: However, a refractometer, used to measure the brix in wine would be a more specific and accurate option.

A refractometer would be awesome to own, but very hard to justify on the scale I'm working with! My blood sugar tends to crash low - the opposite of diabetes - and it's really a very mild version of this problem that I control completely by just eating regularly and avoiding simple carbs or too much sugar. I can get pretty grouchy if it drops though...

And wrote:

I use the freeze dried kefir starter which goes through about 5-6 batches of milk (or cream for sour cream) per sachet as an alternative to maintaining grains.

Can you actually make a version of yoghurt this way? Will the kefir grains make yoghurt?

I understand that the kefir grains for milk are different than "water kefir" grains, but can anyone tell me what that difference is?

(I'm moderately lactose intolerant also - full fat yoghurt is easier to cope with than low fat and I can still eat milk in baking and cheese so long as it's not after about 7 pm. I'd probably do better with goats milk - particularly fresh goats milk - but I'm having enough trouble herding ducks and goats are another whole level of trouble!)

I don't know if personality wise I am one or the other.  But, I have been making water kefir and kombucha for several years now.  Gradually my kefir grains have adapted to needing much less care.  I make around two gallons at a time and drink that, pouring from my fermentation vessel, leaving it n the grains, never bottling it.  I only brew a new batch when it is running low.  So, often my grains go a month or so between batches.  I add a little molasses from time to time to keep them healthy, and citrus and raisins in each batch.  It took some time, but my grains did adapt to a bit of neglect.

Mercy Pergande wrote:BOTH! I do get that having either can feel high maintenance at times. I remember my sister saying "I'm not making sourdough, I don't want a pet."
I use the freeze dried kefir starter which goes through about 5-6 batches of milk (or cream for sour cream) per sachet as an alternative to maintaining grains. I'm working on getting some grains since I'm going to be more able to take care of them better going forward. My issue with kombucha is all of the scoby sheets. I feel bad discarding them but there is only so much kombucha I can cycle through at a time!

You ought to stash the SCOBs in a SCOBY hotel! Just another jar with kombucha vinegar in there. They keep for a long time. Great for storing them for gifts, recipes involving SCOBYs

Another (possibly better?) analogy might be, -Are you a sour dough person or a wine production person.

Jay Angler wrote:

Mercy Pergande wrote: However, a refractometer, used to measure the brix in wine would be a more specific and accurate option.

A refractometer would be awesome to own, but very hard to justify on the scale I'm working with! My blood sugar tends to crash low - the opposite of diabetes - and it's really a very mild version of this problem that I control completely by just eating regularly and avoiding simple carbs or too much sugar. I can get pretty grouchy if it drops though...

(I'm moderately lactose intolerant also - full fat yoghurt is easier to cope with than low fat and I can still eat milk in baking and cheese so long as it's not after about 7 pm. I'd probably do better with goats milk - particularly fresh goats milk - but I'm having enough trouble herding ducks and goats are another whole level of trouble!)

I grew up with a type 1 diabetic and am close to someone with hypoglycemia so I'm very familiar with the roller coaster of blood sugar issues and the need to manage that carefully. Fermented (but non alcoholic) things should be helpful since they typically convert sugars (like lactose) into a less metabolically volatile substance (like lactic acid). The bacteria involved is usually specific to the type of sugar it eats and the temperature at which it is active. That's essentially the difference between sourdough starter and yogurt starter, as well as between water and milk kefir grains or kombucha scobys and jun scobys.

I understand that the kefir grains for milk are different than "water kefir" grains, but can anyone tell me what that difference is?

Kefir and yogurt are different bacteria/ cultures (there are actually a lot of different strains of yogurt bacteria or cultures) but to me the most significant difference is that kefir is mesophilic (which is an organism that thrives at a moderate temperature, usually in a "room temperature" range), while yogurt is often thermophilic (which requires higher temperatures to be active, say around 110F). The texture of the final product is based more on the type of milk used and the way it is denatured (which makes it thicker by heating) or the addition of dried milk, or if why is strained out, than the culture. I make really thick sour cream with kefir starter, and have made pourable yogurt with thermophilic yogurt cultures. Kefir does tend to be more of a drink/pourable texture in general though.

And finally, goats milk has a smaller casien protein than cows milk which is why it's more easily digestible! (It also makes it behave differently when cultured but I'll stop before this turns into a book-length reply)

Jay Angler wrote:

Mercy Pergande wrote: However, a refractometer, used to measure the brix in wine would be a more specific and accurate option.

A refractometer would be awesome to own, but very hard to justify on the scale I'm working with! My blood sugar tends to crash low - the opposite of diabetes - and it's really a very mild version of this problem that I control completely by just eating regularly and avoiding simple carbs or too much sugar. I can get pretty grouchy if it drops though...

And wrote:

I use the freeze dried kefir starter which goes through about 5-6 batches of milk (or cream for sour cream) per sachet as an alternative to maintaining grains.

Can you actually make a version of yoghurt this way? Will the kefir grains make yoghurt?

I understand that the kefir grains for milk are different than "water kefir" grains, but can anyone tell me what that difference is?

(I'm moderately lactose intolerant also - full fat yoghurt is easier to cope with than low fat and I can still eat milk in baking and cheese so long as it's not after about 7 pm. I'd probably do better with goats milk - particularly fresh goats milk - but I'm having enough trouble herding ducks and goats are another whole level of trouble!)

The Milk Kefir grains are (in my understanding) sort of like a big glob of yogurt bacteria but a different breed/type. Animal-based. Water Kefir grains come from the inside of a cactus, they're also called Tibicos and are plant-based.

Jim Fry wrote:Another (possibly better?) analogy might be, -Are you a sour dough person or a wine production person.

Haha that's a good one!

Mercy Pergande wrote:

Kefir and yogurt are different bacteria/ cultures (there are actually a lot of different strains of yogurt bacteria or cultures) but to me the most significant difference is that kefir is mesophilic (which is an organism that thrives at a moderate temperature, usually in a "room temperature" range), while yogurt is often thermophilic (which requires higher temperatures to be active, say around 110F). The texture of the final product is based more on the type of milk used and the way it is denatured (which makes it thicker by heating) or the addition of dried milk, or if why is strained out, than the culture. I make really thick sour cream with kefir starter, and have made pourable yogurt with thermophilic yogurt cultures. Kefir does tend to be more of a drink/pourable texture in general though.
)

Oh yeah, also MK tastes different from yogurt (IMO). MK tastes very lemony/vinegary

Mercy Pergande wrote:BOTH!. My issue with kombucha is all of the scoby sheets. I feel bad discarding them but there is only so much kombucha I can cycle through at a time!

haha I give the scoby sheets to the dog -- he is like me: he will eat anything!

Edit: I forgot to answer the question: kombucha definitely: I get two-fer: I make my sourdough from my scoby pets (well the ones the dog doesn't get)
If I resurrect a really grungy scoby, I will give the dog some like jerky. The rest gets oldest flour and sugar and next day it is on its way to being doggy sour sourdough hahaha
11 years old, a 90 pound euthanasia biting rescue with a positive attitude and no hip displasure so before anyone things I am guilty of food abuse

Kefir. I really just don't like kombucha. Kefir, on the other hand, I really enjoy.