• Post Reply Bookmark Topic Watch Topic
  • New Topic
permaculture forums growies critters building homesteading energy monies kitchen purity ungarbage community wilderness fiber arts art permaculture artisans regional education skip experiences global resources cider press projects digital market permies.com pie forums private forums all forums
this forum made possible by our volunteer staff, including ...
master stewards:
  • Nancy Reading
  • Carla Burke
  • r ranson
  • John F Dean
  • paul wheaton
  • Pearl Sutton
stewards:
  • Jay Angler
  • Liv Smith
  • Leigh Tate
master gardeners:
  • Christopher Weeks
  • Timothy Norton
gardeners:
  • thomas rubino
  • Jeremy VanGelder
  • Maieshe Ljin

Mexican sunflower - Tithonia diversifolia

 
Posts: 103
Location: Zone 5, Maine Coast
11
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
    Number of slices to send:
    Optional 'thank-you' note:
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator
I just planted a bunch of these behind my tomatoes and peppers for my fiancé. She wants them for the long-keeping flowers, but when I wikipediad them I was impressed at their potential as permaculture plants.
Check it out...



Tithonia diversifolia is a species of flowering plant in the Asteraceae family that is commonly known as the tree marigold, Mexican tournesol, Mexican sunflower, Japanese sunflower or Nitobe chrysanthemum. It is native to eastern Mexico and Central America but has a nearly pantropical distribution as an introduced species.[1] Depending on the area they may be either annual or perennial. It has shown great potential in raising the soil fertility in soils depleted in nutrients. [2] Originating in Mexico; research has shown its potential in benefiting poor African farmers.[3] This plant is a weed that grows quickly and has become an option as an affordable alternative to expensive synthetic fertilizers.[4] It has shown to increase plant yields and the soil nutrients of nitrogen (N), phosphorus (P), and potassium (K).[5]

Contents [hide]
1 Description
2 History and Geography
3 Symbolism and uses
4 Growing Conditions
5 Economics
6 Social, Gender, and Cultural Issues
7 Constraints to Wider Adoption
8 Practical Information
9 References
10 External links
Description[edit]
T. diversifolia is 2–3 m (6.6–9.8 ft) in height with upright and sometimes ligneous stalks in the form of woody shrubs. The large, showy flowers are yellow to orange colored and 5–15 cms. wide and 10–30 cms. long. Leaves are sub-ovate, serrate, acute, 10 to 40 cms. long, simply or mostly 3-7 lobed, somewhat glandular, and slightly grayish beneath. The seeds are achenes, 4-angled, and 5mm long. The seeds are spread by wind.[6] The leaves of the plant alternate in sides they grow on, which is where the plant gets the name diversifolia. This is accompanied by flowers which are yellow in colour and range from 6-13 cm in length. [7] It can grow throughout the year and its seeds are spread through way of wind, water, and animals.[8]

History and Geography[edit]
This plant was originally domesticated in Mexico and spread to other parts of Central and South America and north into the United States.[9] It was brought over to parts of Africa and Asia as an ornamental plant and has become an invasive weed that is widely spread.[10] It is most commonly found in areas with an altitude between 550m and 1950m.[11] It is commonly found scattered among rivers and roadsides.[12] In Asia and latin America this plant is also referred to as kembang mbulan (Indonesian and Javanese), jalacate (Spanish), and thantawan-nu (Thai).[13]

Symbolism and uses[edit]
In Japan, towards the end of the Meiji Period, they were imported as ornamental plants although seldom cultivated there. Having a characteristic bitter taste, they were used to induce a fever to help fight poisoning, although not used for direct medicinal purposes. There is also the story of the species being introduced to Japan by Nitobe Inazo, hence its Japanese name, the Nitobe chrysanthemum (ニトベギク; Nitobegiku).
They are sold in herbal medicine markets in Taiwan.
It is the provincial flower of Mae Hong Son Province, Thailand.
It is the unofficial symbol of Da Lat city, Vietnam.
T.diversifolia can be used as a green fertilizer for poor African farmers. It can also be used as chicken feed, fuelwood, soil erosion control, and building materials.[14] For fertilization, it is used as a mulch which can be spread on top of the soil or buried beneath it.[15] The advantages here is that using the plant as a fertilizer has proven to increase crop yields.[16] T. diversifolia has the ability to restore phosphorus in high amounts to the soil.[17] T. diversifolia as a fertilizer contains 1.76% N, 0.82% P, and 3.92% K. All three properties are lower in cattle manure, and P is higher in poultry and swine manure.[18]
Growing Conditions[edit]
Being a weed, T.diversifolia can grow in many different environmental conditions. It has a moderate drought tolerance.[19] It is ideally grown in areas with an annual rainfall ranging from 1000-2000 mm and a temperature of 15-31 degrees Celsius.[20] This plant does not require a large amount of nutrients because it is able to increase the amount of essential nutrients in the soil itself.[21] As a weed it spreads rapidly which allows farmers to obtain large amounts for the use of fertilization.[22]

Economics[edit]
A study on the use of this green fertilizer on tomato plants shows that this is a useful method to increase crop yields in order to benefit the farmer’s wealth.[23] However, this is not without a serious look at the labour requirements. A different study found that, with maize, the overall labour demand versus the financial prospects is not worthwhile, especially in areas of unpredictable rainfalls.[24] This same study also found that growing T. diversifolia on farmer land is not as beneficial from an economic standpoint. Instead, it is better to harvest from an off site location and transport to the fields.[25] From this study, fields that received only a P fertilizer yielded an income to the farmer of $50USD/ha. When only T. diversifolia was applied, this income rose to $494USD/ha.[26] The latter results are high, as another study showed an increase of only to $116USD/ha.[27]

Social, Gender, and Cultural Issues[edit]
Harvesting and distributing this fertilizer over the land by hand is very labour intensive on women.[28] The best yields come when T. diversifolia is grown off the land as to not take up growing space. For this reason, when time spent on labour has been factored, this approach may not be beneficial to a farmer.[29]

Constraints to Wider Adoption[edit]
While T. diversifolia does have moderate drought tolerance, the amount of rainfall that the African subtropics receives may not be enough to support the growing of this biomass.[30] T. diversifolia currently grows in humid and semi humid areas in Africa.[31] However, no evidence was found to suggest that it had been attempted in desert conditions.

Practical Information[edit]
T. diversifolia can be distributed as for biomass green fertilizer. Since this fertilizer requires high labour, it is recommended for use with high value crops such as tomato, kale, carrot, and maize.[32] First, the plant is grown in hedges around the edges of harvest land.[33] It is important though to keep the maximum amount of growing area a farmer has. The green stems (not the woody stems), leaves, and flowers can be removed from the plant at a farmer selected time, though it is recommended that cutting every 5 months will give a plentiful amount of nutrients in the biomass.[34] Biomass refers to when a plants’ foliage is planted into the soil as a dry fertilizer.[35] The biomass can also be used as a mulch and can be left on top of the soil to decompose into the ground.[36] It has been found that the biomass from T. diversifolia breaks down rapidly and releases nutrients quickly. [37] When applying the mulch or biomass to the soil, it should be applied at the minimum amount of one ton to every hectare of land. However, the best yield is given when 5 tons/hectare is applied.[38] The downside here is that a lot of foliage is needed to cover a small area of land because it has a high water content.[39] Mixing this biomass with a synthetic fertilizer will bring higher yields. A study found that when applying tithonia with triple superphosphate (TSP) that the yields increased by 220% compared to a control test containing only an inorganic nitrogen fertilizer (Urea).[40] When using T. diversifolia it should be supplemented with a Mg fertilizer as this nutrient is lacking in quantity when compared to other green fertilizers.[41]

 
Dan Tutor
Posts: 103
Location: Zone 5, Maine Coast
11
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
    Number of slices to send:
    Optional 'thank-you' note:
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator
Floridasurvivalgardening blog says these can get 20' tall!!!
Check this picture out...



Aaannd, link - http://www.floridasurvivalgardening.com/2013/11/meet-amazing-giant-sunflower-that-fixes.html

Now I can't wait for mine to come up!
 
Posts: 98
4
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
    Number of slices to send:
    Optional 'thank-you' note:
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator
Dan can we get an update on these, how did they work out for you?
 
steward
Posts: 16058
Location: USDA Zone 8a
4272
dog hunting food preservation cooking bee greening the desert
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
    Number of slices to send:
    Optional 'thank-you' note:
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator

Robert Marr wrote:Dan can we get an update on these, how did they work out for you?



I would also like to see how they worked out for Dan.

We planted one this year as part of our Monarch Garden project.  It was planted in a pot and got about 4 ft tall.  It require a lot more water than I expected.  We didn't get any rain from May to August so it had to be watered everyday.  The Monarchs, other butterflies and hummingbirds  loved it.

While the blooms are striking I don't think they would last as cut flowers.  I think they would wilt too soon.  The real sunflower genus would work better.

We plan to plant them next year.  Due to the amount of water required they were annuals in zone 8a.  DH does not want them in his vegetable garden area because of their seeds, so I am planning to put them in a spot I have planned for a medicinal garden. [Things less desirable like sida]

I would also like Dan's opinion on the permaculture aspect.


https://permies.com/t/59341/critters/Monarch-butterflies-caterpillars-Creating-Monarch
 
Posts: 5
Location: Grass Valley, United States
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
    Number of slices to send:
    Optional 'thank-you' note:
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator
the photo is of Tithonia rotundifolia.. the wiki. entry is for Tithonia Diversifolia.. these are two separate plants and, while the Rotundifolia variety is a lovely plant (and one of my faves) the Diversifolia is considered invasive in SOME locales, and is useful as a permaculture plant when it is controlled. Confusing the two due to their common names is, well.... common.
 
Anne Miller
steward
Posts: 16058
Location: USDA Zone 8a
4272
dog hunting food preservation cooking bee greening the desert
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
    Number of slices to send:
    Optional 'thank-you' note:
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator

bobbie joh wrote:.. these are two separate plants and, while the Rotundifolia variety is a lovely plant (and one of my faves) the Diversifolia is considered invasive in SOME locales, and is useful as a permaculture plant when it is controlled. Confusing the two due to their common names is, well.... common.



Bobbie, can you tell me how to determine which variety I have? Mine came in a packet of mystery seeds.  It seems the genus is correct.  Can you tell by the leaves? My leaves sound like the description of diversifolia.  And the Wikipedia for rotoudifolia only says "Leaves, despite the epithet, are deltoid to lanceolate, occasionally lobed."  Which doesn't tell me much.  And both have orange flowers.  Mine was very much like a tree rather than a shrub.
 
pollinator
Posts: 1701
Location: southern Illinois, USA
294
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
    Number of slices to send:
    Optional 'thank-you' note:
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator
There are Wikipedia articles on both species (T. rotundifolia and T. diversifolia) Rotundifolia is the more common plant in temperate regions, usually an annual, maxing out at six feet or so, with intense deep orange flowers.  Diversifolia is more likely perennial, growing easily to over ten feet, and blooms yellow with shortening daylength.  It needs a warm climate to persist, killing to the ground with frost, and it needs warmth late into the season to bloom.  Northern Florida is about as far north as I've ever seen it bloom.
 
bobbie joh
Posts: 5
Location: Grass Valley, United States
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
    Number of slices to send:
    Optional 'thank-you' note:
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator

Anne Miller wrote:

bobbie joh wrote:.. these are two separate plants and, while the Rotundifolia variety is a lovely plant (and one of my faves) the Diversifolia is considered invasive in SOME locales, and is useful as a permaculture plant when it is controlled. Confusing the two due to their common names is, well.... common.



Bobbie, can you tell me how to determine which variety I have? Mine came in a packet of mystery seeds.  It seems the genus is correct.  Can you tell by the leaves? My leaves sound like the description of diversifolia.  And the Wikipedia for rotoudifolia only says "Leaves, despite the epithet, are deltoid to lanceolate, occasionally lobed."  Which doesn't tell me much.  And both have orange flowers.  Mine was very much like a tree rather than a shrub.



Anne - the two look quite different: the photo by the original poster is the Rotundifolia variety.. there is another photo further down the topic of the Diversifolia, which also shows some flowers at the top of the growth. The flowers of Rotundifolia (often sold by seed companies) are very orange. I believe the Diversifolia is usually more of a yellow - sunflower color. The Diversifolia is the one used for permaculture application. Sadly, I have never seen the seed for this variety so I cannot tell you if it looks different from Rotundifolia. Hope this offers some small help.
 
Anne Miller
steward
Posts: 16058
Location: USDA Zone 8a
4272
dog hunting food preservation cooking bee greening the desert
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
    Number of slices to send:
    Optional 'thank-you' note:
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator

bobbie joh wrote:

Anne - the two look quite different: the photo by the original poster is the Rotundifolia variety.. there is another photo further down the topic of the Diversifolia, which also shows some flowers at the top of the growth. The flowers of Rotundifolia (often sold by seed companies) are very orange. I believe the Diversifolia is usually more of a yellow - sunflower color. The Diversifolia is the one used for permaculture application. Sadly, I have never seen the seed for this variety so I cannot tell you if it looks different from Rotundifolia. Hope this offers some small help.



My plant is getting ready to bloom.  I had saved the seed from last years orange blooms.  So now I know which variety it is!

"This is accompanied by flowers which are yellow in colour" and "The flowers of Rotundifolia (often sold by seed companies) are very orange."

Mine is "Mexican sunflower - Tithonia diversifolia" as the blooms this year are yellow.  My plant looked very similar to the original photo.

I am very sad as I loved the orange flower.  I planted 4 plants but something, maybe cutworms, cut the tops off three of them so I only have one left.

 
I'm a lumberjack and I'm okay, I sleep all night and work all day. Tiny lumberjack ad:

World Domination Gardening 3-DVD set. Gardening with an excavator.
richsoil.com/wdg


reply
    Bookmark Topic Watch Topic
  • New Topic