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What is the better answer to fuel a vehicle?

 
Posts: 138
Location: Manotick (Ottawa), Ontario
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James Alun included a video regarding winter cycling


The video by a London, Ontario resident included a remark that people think winter cycling isn't realistic because of the cold. My experience from bike commuting was that slippery conditions are the real problem and a serious hazard when cycling in traffic. I once wiped out on black ice when carefully turning a corner on downtown streets, which convinced me to give it up until spring. Snow, of course, is a big factor, as well as terrain. As for holding up Oulu, Finland as a model for Ontario, it's worth considering the climate differences. As https://weather-and-climate.com/ says "Finland is still much warmer compared to other countries at the same latitude. This is mainly due to the proximity of relatively warm seawater and the absence of high mountains."
I can't readily find snowfall data for London, Ontario, but Ottawa, where I live, commonly gets a foot and a half (~50 cm) in January and somewhat less in the other winter months (including March). Without the phenomenal bike path network of Oulu and assiduous snow clearing, winter cycling in eastern Canada is closer to sport than transportation -- best done by motivated, athletic young people.
 
David Wieland
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...recognize that in many places the government and private industry have been doing their level best to get us all into cars for a long time now and
those are some very powerful adversaries.


I've heard similar claims before, but I think the impetus for cars comes from the people who use them, not "adversaries". How many car owners have you heard say they wish they didn't have or need a car? I enjoyed bike commuting (outside of winter) for the years when it was about as fast as taking the bus, but the freedom to travel and transport more than myself came from my car. Now that I live in the country, a car allows me to be far more productive by saving the ridiculous amount of time required to use the rural bus service or waiting for delivery of project materials. It also allows me to chauffeur my "car-free" non-driving son and my granddaughter to Grandma and Grandpa's for a Sunday dinner. Rather than being "enslaved" to the oil industry, I feel liberated and grateful to have ready access to such energy and transportation.

As for fuel, I think whatever your vehicle runs on is the right kind. I've generally bought compact used vehicles and maintained them until that was too expensive or became unsafe. Considering how good its current condition is, it wouldn't surprise me if my 12-year-old gasoline-powered car can stay out of the junkyard another decade. I'll see what the choices are then. Right now I would consider a hybrid, combining the good low-speed torque of an electric motor with the anxiety-free range of gasoline. But I know from reading and my brother's Prius experience that battery replacement is a major expense and would have to be factored into the cost. That brother also has a dual-fuel pickup that he's run on waste cooking oil, but processing that makes it more a warm weather hobby than a practical fuel.
 
pollinator
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Location: Southern Oregon
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Very interesting thread. I have a question. Lithium batteries for solar last a projected 20-25 years, that's vastly superior to other battery types. Do lithium batteries for cars have a shorter projected lifespan and if so, why?

A couple of comments, having had a Prius, the torque thing is a problem not a plus. And I could never own a diesel, they make me nauseous as I know they do others.

I agree heartedly that different areas require different solutions and berating people for not taking public transportation is areas why it is terrible or non-existent isn't helpful. But there are really only a handful of cities/metropolitan areas in the US that public transportation is reasonable. The SF Bay Area is not one of them.

I think it would be great if people worked on having a life that didn't require travel. It would be great if home were a haven, not something that one needed to escape from.
 
pioneer
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Location: North Texas, Zone 8a, Black Clay
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The way to measure the life of the batteries in cars would need to be based on mileage just as you would with an engine. Comparison by years would give a greatly biased result (in favor of gas/diesel).

The torque is dependent on how you use you vehicle and what you need it to do. It is usually considered a positive in most vehicles, it may be a trade off in gasoline engines but with diesel it would be very positive.
 
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Location: Kansas City Area
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When I was getting a bid for Grid tied solar, I was a little surprised by how few panels would need to be added to the array to provide the power for an electric car.  
Told him we where thinking about a small car and drove 200 miles a week. So a small electric car gets about 3 miles per KWH(100 Miles per gallon equivalent or something) and four panels would make about 12 KWH/Day or provide the power for 36 miles a day. So about 1000 dollars worth of additional panels would power a small car for a couple of decades.

Now powering the new Electric Hummer might be a different story, but drive it just a little and it would work out.
Somebody will eventually make a basic car powered by LIPO4 batteries.  Yes, it still takes energy to make a car though.
 
pollinator
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I do not have anymore to add to my previous post on "best choice", but to further my support for public transit, that would benefit all but those of us who live rural.

I previously suggested free public transit was the simplest, most expedient and cost effective model to get fossil fueled transportation decreased. In BC, Canada, they now have FREE travel on transit for anyone under 12; subsidized fares for those older, attending school. I would like to see free expand; first to everyone under 19, and slowly increase that ceiling. Raise them on bus travel, and a personal car and the associated expense would likely ensure most never develop "the habit" of personal automobiles.

BC transit does not stop there (https://www.bctransit.com/about/sustainability)! They are eliminating all diesel buses, replacing them with hybrids or CNG; and have committed to becoming 100% electric by 2040.

Perhaps rather than take on the world of personal vehicle travel we should focus on raising a generation who NEVER considers owning a personal vehicle? Yes, the resulting benefits may take a generation to come to fruition, but I suspect the pay off would be much swifter, AND much more effective going forward.

Sadly, I live rural and the nature of what we do precludes going without a fossil fuel vehicle, at this time. Nor am I willing to trash a perfectly serviceable Toyota at 200,000 kms that will likely provide another 15-20 yrs (she is a 2005 we got used in 2012) of reliable transportation. I feel it is our duty to "use" her until there is no choice but to send her to the crusher. The longer she runs, the lighter her footprint on this planet.
 
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bio gas in a hybrid vehicle. electric with a biogas gen to charge it....
simple easy.
 
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Just a few things: (Observations)
My 1 ton dually, F-350 w/7.3 diesel is more fuel efficient than a Toyota Prius when you consider fuel used / work performed, getting 10+ mpg pulling 16-18,000 lbs. (stock) this can be increased with lower emissions by introducing Hydrogen/HHO or propane to the mix for a more complete combustion.

Electric vehicles to save the planet ? not likely, due to environmentally damaging processes currently being used to gather/mine/refine materials, build them and the batteries, coupled with the lack of adequate generation ability to charge/power said vehicles (at this time)

Electric over fossil fuels, Absolutely. The technologies to produce cheap/free electricity have been around (and suppressed) since the 19th century this also goes for battery tech.
Well designed electric motors are far more efficient at turning energy in to mechanical work and far more powerful than their IC counterparts.
Once you understand electrical systems they are far less prone to breakdowns (and can be DIY fix it friendly) and can be built robust enough for any transportation application, a motor I'm working on to replace my diesel's, when done "should" produce 750+ fp of torque, and weigh in at less than 200# more than enough to replace my IC's and then some.
Batteries ? many different battery chemistries may lend them selves well to electric vehicles, my hope is to see a (hemp) Graphene based chemistry become available (4-8 times the energy density of Li-po) more environmentally friendly all the way around, in the mean time I'm using modified lead-alkali based for high energy density and faster charge time than Lead-acid.

Electrical generation ? Personally I'm a big fan of Nicola Tesla's resonance processes but there's lots of ways to generate electricity, everything from old school wind, solar, hydro to the many zero point and over unity devices, once we stop thinking in the box of what we've been told, energy is everywhere.

Enough for now, God bless and good luck with all of your endeavors.
 
What could go wrong in a swell place like "The Evil Eye"? Or with this tiny ad?
the permaculture bootcamp in winter (plus half-assed holidays)
https://permies.com/t/149839/permaculture-projects/permaculture-bootcamp-winter-assed-holidays
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