invasion of privacy

How interesting to see this thread being resurrected 3 years later.

What we know now that wasn't commonly known 3 years ago.

1.  That there is a booming business out there that buys and sells consumer data.  Let's call it "Big Data".  With unlimited storage capacity, Amazon, Google, Facebook, Netflix, Twitter, YouTube, and others are tracking every purchase, every search, every "like", your social circle and what they are into, and the networks and associates that you are connected to.  Once they've installed their cookies on your computer, they're tracking you.  They scan your photos with facial recognition software and know who you were at the party with, they listen in on your conversations and even sex via Alexa, and they know when and where you drive your car.  NSA is listening to every phone call.  Most of us would be absolutely shocked to know how comprehensive and accurate the files that they keep on us are.

2.  They can predict they kinds of shows you want to watch.  They predict the products they think you'll buy.  They predict when you're going out, what you'll order when you get there, and perhaps even what you'll wear.
They target their advertisements directly to what they assume you'll want, or what your circle of friends want.  So not only are they catering to what they are increasingly sure you want, but they are also leading you toward their pre-set conclusions.  Buy this.  Vote like this.  Support this cause.  Think like this.

3.  These people are not politically neutral.  They have an agenda.  If that sounds like crazy conspiracy guy, then smirk, but its true.  Does anyone think Apple or Amazon or Google isn't trying to shape public opinion?

4.  Your data is being sold.  Constantly.  Why would Facebook create this massive "free" infrastructure that billions of people use?  How do you get income off of offering a free social website?  Advertisers pay millions and millions because Facebook can target their message directly to the people most likely to buy their product or service.

5.  The vast majority of people say, "Whatever" and click the "Acceptance of terms" page.  


Sorry if this little rant just swerved violently into Cider Press territory, but it all goes back to Paul's OP: it's an invasion of privacy.

Nicole Alderman wrote:They still ask these questions at each child wellness check-up. It rather aggravates me, because we're given a form with all these questions (how often does your baby breastfeed, do you serve juice, do you have feelings of postpartum depression, do you have guns in the house, do you have fluoride in your water, etc). We fill out a form while waiting for the doctor, and the doctor doesn't even discuss the questions with us. I could see asking those questions if the parent was going to be educated about the "right" answers...but they don't. What do they do with these questionnaires we fill out?

It's not just those questions. Why do they ask a ton of medical history if they are not going to use it? I have REALLY complex health stuff, if I fill out a form accurately, it's a chaotic mess. They glance at it, and that's it. Why do you ASK if you don't need to know and aren't going to use the information?! When I did medical work I had forms, I asked about everything I needed to know, and ONLY that. And I went over the forms, and asked about every single item that was checked, and took good notes, because I needed the information, that's WHY I asked! If I asked possible pregnancy status, that was to be sure I didn't hurt you or a baby, not so I could put you on a list that sells baby stuff. I wonder how much of the medical data on forms gets data mined. "Oooh, he had heart issues 10 years ago, put him on the email list of things to scare him about so he'll buy stuff from us!"

I needed to get test results back fast last week, I had to sign up for one of the hospital portal things. There was no decline option on the data mining. I read every word of the agreement, and damn near threw up as I clicked "accept." This is SO immoral.

I do not do fb, never have, I run ad blockers and cookie blockers, and everything I can. The only place I say things that could get me data mined is on permies, and I KNOW crawler bots run through here, they hit everyplace on the net. There is no place safe, and I HATE that. Permies is at least friendly, smart people to talk to as I feed the crawler bots. I wish the world wasn't like this.  :(   I hate feeling paranoid all the time. But turning a blind eye to it just means you don't see it coming up behind you, you can't attempt to avoid something you are not aware of.

I reread the OP here, Paul's thing on them asking questions in public that you don't want the answers to be public knowledge (if they even need it.). That, to me, is a criminal offense. I'm a dumpster diver, and I pay attention to things, and I have been stalked, and I KNOW how easy all of this is to milk for information. One guy in the room jots down your phone number as the receptionist reads it to you, and you may have a VERY serious problem. Throw away papers without shredding them, and I can tell you more than you would expect about your life from them. I'm not a problem, I have no malicious intent, I'm not going to use that information against people. There are people who do, and it's SO SO SO easy. "Shredding my papers is a pain in the ass!" Having your identity stolen is a LOT more effort to deal with. I wish I know how to wake people up.

I'm at Verizon waiting to get service and the guy in front of me is setting up service on a new phone.  I've now heard his name, address and four digit security code.... Privacy in this type of situation is generally a joke. But I still try for me and to give it to others.

Shawn Harper wrote:

Peter VanDerWal wrote:When asked for a phone number, my wife just pulls out her cell phone and gives them the phone number from one of the recent SPAMers that called her.

Just stumbled on to this thread. Stealing this idea. Take that robocallers.

Except that many of those numbers are spoofed from people who are totally innocent. The robocallers have their numbers routed through several legitimate numbers and the real source well hidden.

It's actually interesting to watch. I am very careful what I do online, I seldom if ever buy anything, I don't click on adds, I don't watch movies or sports. I don't have a TV. I have a 20 year old car and no cell phone. I pay cash for just about everything. I don't think their algorithms know what to do with me.

I can usually identify the "exploration" adds--"Lets see if she takes the bait. If she does, we have one more data point nailed." Which is really meaningless, since I usually click on stuff for one specific purpose and then I move back to familiar territory. And because I'm a writer I often research odd stuff.

But there's the programming aspect as well, and I see people falling for that all the time. Get asked once, you'll refuse. Get asked fifty or sixty times, you're likely to give in from simple exhaustion. And once you give in, even once, they've got you. Click "accept" and they know whether you read it or not by the amount of time spent on the page before you click--or if you selected the link to the actual document, or just read the company-verbiage precis. We're being programmed to accept this level of oversight, and the fact that we have no privacy. Think about yourself 20 years ago, and how you would have responded (or did respond) to these same attacks on your privacy.

Likely you would have responded very differently.

Didn't  they ask about your sex life?

Stacy Witscher wrote:Dan Boone - I have to say that I've never heard of a doctor's office wanting to know my SS number other than if you have Medicare. My experience has always been they want your insurance card. Even Medicare has changed to having a Medicare number that is different from your SS number, primarily because people don't want to carry a card around that has your SS number on it. Are you referring to new client info for uninsured patients? Because if you are, I would think that they want your SS number so that they can either check your credit, or ding your credit if you don't pay.

I know this post is older but I can also confirm that this is routine. I have friends in admissions for a couple of local hospitals. It's basically so they have redundant pathways for information when they send stuff out for collections. Additionally, I was once refused treatment when I wouldn't give it. I had some acute reaction to something and had hives, itching, etc. It was on a Sunday and I didn't want to take the financial hit for emergency care so I waited until Monday morning. It was murder. Couldn't even sleep. I did not have a primary care physician. It took me two hours tp get an appointment. I went there and had check-in via tablet. I filled out everything except financial info and SS. I had insurance. I was called up about 15 mins later (15 mins past appointment time) and told I hadn't filled in the SS part. I statyed I realize that but since it is illegal to use it as an identifer and that this was an insurance case, I wouldn't be providing it. She said, "They always ask for it." I stated I knew this but payment for treatment would follow my insurance number. She asked me to wait while she spoke to the physician. About 10 mins later she said the physician would not see anyone without the SS. I said that was fine and asked them to erase all of my information. She asked in surprised fashion, "You don't want your appointment?" I said not with a barrier like that and an unreasonable requirement to go against federal law and I walked out.

It took me another 1.5 hrs to find someone who would see me and I asked on the phone whether this would be an issue and they said no. I drove over and they took me straight in. No problems, quick visit, prescription, and a day later I wasn't on fire. I reported the issue to my insurance company and my employee insurance office but doubt anything substantive happened.

Many of these stories are devastating. I deleted my Facebook, Instagram from my phone, and WhatsApp when the privacy settings got even worse. I really enjoyed Instagram for permie stuff, schooling alternatives, health and alternative news info and I do miss it. I’m glad I have these forums! Though, I have noticed a huge increase of spam comments on my website since joining permies. I think I need to change the comment settings to approve each comment posted.

Nowadays with Covid, there is a whole new line of questioning almost everywhere that violate medical privacy and rights. My friend, who works at a health food store in CA, is daily getting asked by fellow employees and patrons on whether or not she’s received the vaccine or plans to. People are happily and proudly posting pictures of themselves on social media with their medical info showing that they’ve received one of the various vaccines.

Flying internationally? You need to write all the cities, states, countries that you’ve visited in the last 14 days.

Curfews, checkpoints with police, army & medical people, closures, lines of questioning, forced temperature taking on wrist and forehead, forced hand sanitizer upon entry places, forbidding the entry of children... I read a lot of biographies and the tolerance for all this is beginning to really creep me out and reminding me of other times in history.

When I went in for blood and other tests, the only time in my life as an adult, the doctor didn’t want to order tests to find out what was happening and why but just wanted to write me per script ions for the symptoms. She also wanted to give me many unnecessary shots like the flu shot and was irritated when I said, no thank you.

I try to not focus on the ‘bad guys’ or those who are blindly just doing what they’re told without thinking but the tracking, invasion of privacy, and societal norms are quite disturbing.

May 2021 have some positive changes,

*Ordering a Pizza in 2022*
CALLER: Is this Pizza Hut?
GOOGLE: No sir, it's Google Pizza.
CALLER: I must have dialed a wrong number, sorry.
GOOGLE: No sir, Google bought Pizza Hut last month.
CALLER: OK. I would like to order a pizza.
GOOGLE: Do you want your usual, sir?
CALLER: My usual? You know me?
GOOGLE: According to our caller ID data sheet, the last 12 times you called you ordered an extra-large pizza with three cheeses, sausage, pepperoni, mushrooms and meatballs on a thick crust.
CALLER: Super! That’s what I’ll have.
GOOGLE: May I suggest that this time you order a pizza with ricotta, arugula, sun-dried tomatoes and olives on a whole wheat gluten-free thin crust?
CALLER: What? I don’t want a vegetarian pizza!
GOOGLE: Your cholesterol is not good, sir.
CALLER: How the hell do you know that?
GOOGLE: Well, we cross-referenced your home phone number with your medical records. We have the result of your blood tests for the last 7 years.
CALLER: Okay, but I do not want your rotten vegetarian pizza! I already take medication for my cholesterol.
GOOGLE: Excuse me sir, but you have not taken your medication regularly. According to our database, you purchased only a box of 30 cholesterol tablets once at Lloyds Pharmacy, 4 months ago.
CALLER: I bought more from another Pharmacy.
GOOGLE: That doesn’t show on your credit card statement.
CALLER: I paid in cash.
GOOGLE: But you did not withdraw enough cash according to your bank statement.
CALLER: I have other sources of cash.
GOOGLE: That doesn’t show on your latest tax returns, unless you bought them using an undeclared income source, which is against the law!
CALLER: WHAT THE HELL!
GOOGLE: I'm sorry sir, we use such information only with the sole intention of helping you.
CALLER: Enough already! I'm sick to death of Google, Facebook, Twitter, WhatsApp and all the others. I'm going to an island without the internet, TV, where there is no phone service and no one to watch me or spy on me.
GOOGLE: I understand sir, but you need to renew your passport first. It expired 6 weeks ago...

     I am a nurse, educated and, more importantly, experienced.  I have been up to my elbows in feces and blood more times than I can count, forearm deep cleaning out cavernous pus-filled wounds while thinking "man, I am so hungry" 'cause in 34 years of nursing I have gotten 5 meal breaks.  I have been punched in the jaw so hard that it knocked me into the wall three feet away (and I  got right back up).  Being called a see-you-next-tuesday doesn't even catch my attention; it's happened too often. Disoriented people and drug addicts, my oh my!
 And I was, and always will be, a nurse who looks every person in the eye and treats them with compassion and respect. Let us begin.
      I don't give my social security number, nor my drivers license number on forms.  However, there are time when official picture IDs are crucial.  For example, immunotherapy.  Simplified to a basic level,  immunotherapy treatments use your own body's "stuff" to treat cancer and other diseases. Identifying the patient with picture ID is a must; we keep a copy on the record and must compare it to the patient's face and the physical license every time the treatment is given.
   Those questions? Government required. There were regulations in the past and the Affordable Care Act brought more.  That is a statement of fact, not an opinion about the ACA.  Some information is required before we treat and some you have the right not answer.  I suggest being nice. That lab tech/front desk person/nurse/doctor is just making a living, doing the best they can with what they have.  Should there be HIPPA compliant spaces? Yes.  You should be complaining to the heads of the companies: Solaris, CVS Caremark, Humana, Northwell, Optum etc. and the private equity firms that own them all: that is where  the decisions are made right down to the spaces that are rented. There are very, very, very few private practice physicians anymore.
    A few tid-bits of info about some common misperceptions. There are now evidence-based clinical pathways which determine what test should be ordered, when, and how often, so your provider is not ordering tests just for fun and profit (unless your provider is stupid or completely unethical).  Unless one uses a concierge service, Provider's fees are set by your insurance company, medicare, and medicaid. Co-pays are set by your insurance company as well; a provider is not supposed to waive them and will be in trouble if they do it too often.  Incidentally, inflation has gone up 20% in the past two decades. Medicare payments have gone up 4%.  
   Note that I use "provider", not physician. I'll leave you all to guess why it is so hard to get an appointment with a physician and why it's so easy to get one with a physician extender. Hint: It's not because the Dr. makes more money.

 
     

Susan Mené wrote:      I am a nurse, educated and, more importantly, experienced.  I have been up to my elbows in feces and blood more times than I can count, forearm deep cleaning out cavernous pus-filled wounds while thinking "man, I am so hungry" 'cause in 34 years of nursing I have gotten 5 meal breaks.  I have been punched in the jaw so hard that it knocked me into the wall three feet away (and I  got right back up).  Being called a see-you-next-tuesday doesn't even catch my attention; it's happened too often. Disoriented people and drug addicts, my oh my!
 And I was, and always will be, a nurse who looks every person in the eye and treats them with compassion and respect. Let us begin.

Hey Susan. I can't speak to the politics but I know how much of a difference front-line "soldiers" like you make. So here's a tip of my hat to you. It's a tough gig, and a precious few who can handle it.

As Douglas suggested, thanks for being there for all of us.

Unfortunately I cant get medical care with out all of that ...

They even took my picture the last time I was there as if my drivers license was not enough ...

Anne Miller wrote:As Douglas suggested, thanks for being there for all of us.

Unfortunately I cant get medical care with out all of that ...

They even took my picture the last time I was there as if my drivers license was not enough ...

Thank you for the thanks and kind words.  I loved being a nurse: all of it.
Why the past tense? I just retired.  LOL, I just can't answer to anyone anymore.  

Things are getting way too intrusive for me.  Now that you mention it, I had my photo taken at an orthopedic visit this year. They said it was to prevent insurance fraud.  Computers have reduced medication errors dramatically, but like I said above, I'm not handing over my SSN.  It's easy enough to steal one's identity, I'm not handing it over.

Douglas Alpenstock wrote:

Susan Mené wrote:      I am a nurse, educated and, more importantly, experienced.  I have been up to my elbows in feces and blood more times than I can count, forearm deep cleaning out cavernous pus-filled wounds while thinking "man, I am so hungry" 'cause in 34 years of nursing I have gotten 5 meal breaks.  I have been punched in the jaw so hard that it knocked me into the wall three feet away (and I  got right back up).  Being called a see-you-next-tuesday doesn't even catch my attention; it's happened too often. Disoriented people and drug addicts, my oh my!
 And I was, and always will be, a nurse who looks every person in the eye and treats them with compassion and respect. Let us begin.

Hey Susan. I can't speak to the politics but I know how much of a difference front-line "soldiers" like you make. So here's a tip of my hat to you. It's a tough gig, and a precious few who can handle it.

Thanks , Doug. I think I was born for it.  I apologize for the bad nurses out there..
There's no need for a medical facility to have your ssn that I know of.
For everyone out there who are asked all those personal questions with just a curtain in between: it's a clear HIPAA violation. Just because I feel the staff shouldn't be yelled at, It doesn't mean the subject shouldn't addressed politely. If enough people speak up, the powers that be will (late rather than sooner) change it.  HIPAA violations are no joke.