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Amicable divorces

 
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This was an interesting conversation that was derailing the thread it was in, that deserved it own discussion thread.
It was in https://permies.com/t/163382/nonsense
:D
 
pollinator
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Amicable divorce: Most folks think they need a lawyer. They don't. There are forms to fill and you still need to go in front of a judge. Of course, you need a mate who feels as you do that if we both get lawyers, we'll both get screwed and they'll get rich off of our misfortune. In other words, a mate who can be reasoned with. We no longer had children living at home, so that was a lot easier.
In 2000, it cost me $600. That was the price of the paperwork, the amicable divorce kit, the notary public and the property appraisal. I wrote what I wanted, what he wanted, we discussed it and agreed. We showed our essay to the Judge and that was it. We still had to wait a year but it was done and we were both happy it didn't cost us much.
 
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In California, we didn’t even need to go before a judge. Easy peasy. Best decision of my life.
 
Cécile Stelzer Johnson
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Stacy Witscher wrote:In California, we didn’t even need to go before a judge. Easy peasy. Best decision of my life.



Wisconsin laws are different. They should not be. I know there is a big debate about States Rights but only in this country can you be married in one State and not in another. Can you imagine the complications, the complexities of administering a system like that? 50 different sets of Laws, and folks can move within the country, so if you paid into FICA in a high paying State, then retire to a low paying State [which cannot afford to be as generous, so their Social programs are close to non-existent], you may well end up getting screwed on your benefits. OK. I'm done ranting. [I believe in some  measure of States Rights except maybe where it screws things up].
 
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Cécile Stelzer Johnson wrote:

Stacy Witscher wrote:In California, we didn’t even need to go before a judge. Easy peasy. Best decision of my life.



Wisconsin laws are different. They should not be. I know there is a big debate about States Rights but only in this country can you be married in one State and not in another. Can you imagine the complications, the complexities of administering a system like that? 50 different sets of Laws, and folks can move within the country, so if you paid into FICA in a high paying State, then retire to a low paying State [which cannot afford to be as generous, so their Social programs are close to non-existent], you may well end up getting screwed on your benefits. OK. I'm done ranting. [I believe in some  measure of States Rights except maybe where it screws things up].



Marriage licenses are non-transferrable between states.   The state of being "married" is honored in all states, regardless of where you were married.  The license simply means that you're allowed to get married in that particular state, under that state's particular marriage laws.
 
Cécile Stelzer Johnson
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Good to know. You stated "The state of being "married" is honored in all states, regardless of where you were married."
Do you know if a person married, say in Wisconsin, under the regime of the "community property" would be respected in another State if when you part company you are in a different State? I'm not sure that is automatic.
 
Eric Thomas
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Having been through a messy divorce a very long time ago, and being in two states, me in one, the ex in another, I can tell you what happened to me.  If you're a legal resident of one state, and your soon-to-be ex is a legal resident of another state, either of you can file for divorce under the laws of your state.  In my case, she filed on me and I was required to get legal consul there to represent me (I very much encouraged that as Oklahoma is an alimony state. Her state was too, but it's harder to sue for.)  Her state was a common property state, and allowed the use of real estate equity as part of child support, Oklahoma didn't.  It all worked out, not that I would want to go through it again.  I really can't do that.
 
Cécile Stelzer Johnson
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Eric Thomas wrote:Having been through a messy divorce a very long time ago, and being in two states, me in one, the ex in another, I can tell you what happened to me.  If you're a legal resident of one state, and your soon-to-be ex is a legal resident of another state, either of you can file for divorce under the laws of your state.  In my case, she filed on me and I was required to get legal consul there to represent me (I very much encouraged that as Oklahoma is an alimony state. Her state was too, but it's harder to sue for.)  Her state was a common property state, and allowed the use of real estate equity as part of child support, Oklahoma didn't.  It all worked out, not that I would want to go through it again.  I really can't do that.



Smart of you to get counsel in her State. But that is what I was getting at: things are so complicated when States have different laws that you end up having to get special counsel, at a pretty high price and you both lose $$$.. Wisconsin is a Common Property State and we both lived there, children out of the nest. That too is what made the amicable divorce possible at a rock bottom price. It isn't always possible to have an amicable divorce.
 
Stacy Witscher
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So in California, I just went to a paralegal to help with the paperwork, first for the separation, years later for the divorce. California is a community property state. We really didn't have the legal system take charge of very much. I was legally eligible for child support and alimony after the separation, and there was an order but he never paid either. By the time we divorced, he agreed to give up his ownership portion of the house in exchange for not pushing for the back child support or alimony. He was a truly horrible husband and father, but we actually get along fine since I don't have to depend on him for anything. Some of the kids still hate him and he pushes me to fix that, but their relationships are what they are because of him. It's nothing to do with me, and I just hold that boundary.

He's actually coming to visit this Wednesday for a week. He will stay at my daughter's house, not his daughter. She is actually the most devoted to him, rather than his biological kids. She got the best of him. And, of course, he took her son's death very hard.

I am extremely grateful that neither of my children's fathers tried to take them away from me. It was very clear to both of them that I was the primary caregiver for the kids and that's the way they wanted it. That's not to stay that's true for all fathers, but that was very true for my kids fathers, and I'm glad that they recognized it.
 
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I don't understand the hatred that seems to come with some divorces.  This is a person you loved at one time.  I get it, people say and do ugly things to one another, but it is very, very rarely only one person's fault, even in cases of infidelity and the like.  I've had people cheat on me, and it hurts and it's terrible, but if I was honest with myself, I probably wasn't being a good partner and brought at least some of it on myself.  Truly happy people aren't usually looking for something else.

I've been through a divorce.  We sat down, discussed what we each needed or wanted, split things up and went our own ways.  It helped that the woman I chose to marry wasn't a materialistic jackass, and just wanted things to be fair, and I didn't want anything more than things that were truly mine anyway.  In this case, I wanted my dogs, my motorcycle, and my truck.  She left me other things as well, but those were really the only things I cared about, and we both knew they were mine.

People grow apart, the things they want change, life moves on regardless.  I don't think it's a reason to hate someone or make them miserable over.
 
Eric Thomas
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Apologies for the previous non sequitor mis-post, I was looking at the wrong page.  Two best pieces of advice my father ever gave me were, "always do business in a businesslike manner," and "a man ain't worth a damn 'til he's forty."   When I went through my first divorce (married waayyy to young) and moved on with my life, I was lucky enough, graced enough, to realize I needed to do some growing up before I did that again.  When my first ex announced she wanted a divorce, I looked at her and said something to the effect that now it was no longer a marriage, now it's a business negotiation, thus taking the emotion out of it.  Paid the law-dawg and it went pretty well after that.  

I spent the next twelve years getting the things I wanted (property in the boondocks,) and building what amounted to a pretty sweet work gig that gave me the time to do the things I wanted to do on aforementioned property.  I told myself that I wouldn't get married again until I was sitting on the porch thinking that I had everything I wanted (peace, prosperity, quiet, a couple of bucks in the bank and all-paid-off, getting past '40') and the only thing I was missing was someone to share it with.  

Took me another 12 years but I did it.  20 years of being married to the 'right' person, and things are good.  My ex wasn't a 'bad' person, just the 'wrong' person.

Best way to get through a divorce is to avoid it in the first place.  
 
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