No till with edible cover crops

There are several ways to start a no till garden. This is one way I do it. Start by mowing the area on the shortest setting possible. Then rough up the soil with a rake, seed and water. Before the seeds germinate (7-10 days usually) mow again on the shortest setting. By cutting short grass shorter you stunt it’s growth and give your plants a big advantage. You shouldn’t have to worry about the grass and weeds again this year because they’ll die back soon enough. This is a mix of kale, mustard and carrots that will do fine in zone 7 throughout the winter. I’ll eat any plants that become overcrowded while leaving the rest to grow to harvest next spring. Since kale is a biennial I’ll plant annual veggies around whatever is doing well.

Wow, I'm impressed that this can compete with the grass. I may have to try this.

I hope this works great for you Kalin!

Is 'green manure' in the same area?
You know, radish etc etc that grow down and break up the sil and then you cut it off.

Good morning John. I didn’t plant anything like that this time around. I do plan to help it along next spring though. I figured a good amount of compost mixed with powdered comfrey would be a nice boost before heavy feeders went in. I’m curious to see how just the edible cover crop works too. I usually mix in green manures but have never done what I’m trying now.

I`m very interested how you get on with this method. I`ve got quite an area of meadow to convert to mainly annual food production in a loosely "natural farming" style. So far I`ve tried planting mixed annual rye and vetch into mowed grass a few weeks ago. It looked good initially, but I think the birds and possibly voles have pretty much taken the nice new sprouts...
I`m going to try a few different things in different areas and see what works best to knock back my grass.

I have a field that had never been worked until last winter. Here’s how got the soil ready-ish. Our NC clay is very acidic and really needed some lime but that’s not my style. I refuse to buy things because I feel the land can provide for itself. My neighbor has a wood stove and burns hardwoods from our properties. I spent last winter spreading wood ash to bring the PH down a bit. I also chopped and dropped everything growing there. Since the soil is so acidic the field is covered with broom sedge all winter. It’s probably the worst thing to chop and drop but I was available so I used it. After several months of this process I had a really nice mulch to plant into.
I planted landrace pumpkins, gourds, corn, amaranth, cowpeas, honey melon and Malabar spinach.
The corn, amaranth, melons, and pumpkins all grew great but were eaten by mice.
The amaranth and spinach did great and should self seed next year.
The other unforeseen problem was the fourteenth hours of sun it received daily from May-September. Even the cowpeas couldn’t deal with it.
Since the area I worked was 3/4 acre it was a huge undertaking with hand tools. I will work some of it again but a much smaller spot. After I’m able to grow things successfully there I’ll attempt to branch out again.
I have been saving seeds from pumpkins, melons and cowpeas for years. I nearly lost all of them this growing season. Luckily, I had a few produce other places to keep things going. I won’t be so liberal with my seeds next year.

Scott, so impressive! I’m inspired to learn more about cover crops for my 100’x30’ garden here in NW North Carolina 30 minutes outside of Asheville. We just got the place in March & had to break through a field of well tended fescue which was a very very difficult undertaking. My garden did ok…some crops did great, some fizzled after a month or so & some never came up! Yes, the direct hot dry sun or deluges of rain make for difficult growing conditions.
And the bugs! Some odd ones I’ve never seen before that even liked my marigolds!
Do you know where to buy bulk seed to seed a big garden?
Any other cover crop suggestions for NC?

Hi Gaurī and welcome to permies! I’m thrilled to have someone local to talk to about crops and cover crops! I won’t be able to give you a good answer tonight but I will tomorrow. See you in the morning!

Ok Gaurī, one cup of coffee finished so let’s give this a try. 😂  ☕️
I believe your options are limited due to the season. Possibly the best is to sheet mulch with cardboard. That would really give you a leg up on the grass and any weeds that are there. That’s a pretty large garden though and may not be possible.
Austrian winter pea and winter rye are my favorite winter cover crops; so far at least. Winter pea is a nitrogen fixing, biomass behemoth that produces edible shoots all winter. Winter rye is the same stuff you can buy at your local big box store. Given the season you may get a good deal on some. The package will say, “Plant forty days before your first frost.” Feel free to ignore that. I planted some the week after Christmas a couple years ago. A week later it never got above freezing; it all grew. By June I had a three foot tall stand of rye that was incredible for biomass! Let some go to seed because you can plant it again a few months later.
Your other option now is deer plot mix. Wherever you live there’s a mix for you. They all produce well and will die in time for spring planting. The decaying plants leave a great biomass for planting into.
Buying individual bulk seeds was a problem for me when starting out. I could call out some online seed companies for astronomical shipping prices but won’t. After seven years here I’m pretty set though. I save seed from everything. I only buy now when I want to try something new.
I’ll stop with winter cover for now. I’m happy to get into summer whenever you like though. I love talking to local gardeners about soil, plants and seed so I’m happy to help with any questions you may have.
PS. Next time you’re in Asheville check out Mela’s Indian restaurant. Makes my mouth water just thinking about it! 😋

Good morning Scott. Where are you in NC? We’re 20 min outside of Lake Lure where it’s quiet & very rural. And beautiful.
Any thoughts on cedar vs pine mulch? And I have been using flood refuse, from our crazy flood a few weeks back - mud, leaves & small sticks - that I’m harvesting for compost as well as mulch from a magnolia we had taken down.

I think we both fired off messages at the same time! After coffee #1
Will check out Mela’s. We were completely disappointed w Chai Panni. Our fav is Taco Temple for a quick but fabulous lunch.
Ok so update….I did a second tilling w my Super Bronco. Because I damaged my hands breaking in these garden spaces this spring, I really have no choice. Must stay healthy. So I tilled, am raking out all the roots & clumps then heavily mulching. Using flood refuse, mulch from an old magnolia we had taken down & we’ll purchase some cedar mulch…unless pine is better.
We have very rich “bottom land” - brown, sandy, not one rock in it! Easy to work with. Like butter as my neighbor likes to say.
I did use cardboard quite a bit this summer but the floods & wind just carry it all away! Will try to get more before I lay down the mulch.
And/or if I can find seed I may try a cover crop. I really like that.
Oh and I plan to send in a soil sample to get analyzed. Do you recommend Cornell?

I live in Cabarrus county north of Charlotte.
I like cedar because it doesn’t attract termites like other wood can. If you are planning to use stuff you’ve collected from the floods in compost stay away from cedar. It just doesn’t break down like you would want it to.

Nothing wrong with tilling to get your contours right. I’m a big fan of no till. I’m a bigger fan of one time tilling. It sounds like you could be loosing great garden soil to flooding with some regularity. A great fix is roots from perennials. All of my gardens are tree guilds. There’s never soil loss. All the leaves and chop-n-drop means the soil just keeps getting better. Stopping flood waters is a difficult task though. If you want to try this I recommend elderberries.
I bought an at home soil test a few years ago and my property is very acidic. Lime is the quickest fix but doesn’t last. Plus, I feel like the land provides for itself. I’m not a scientist but I believe that season after season of chop-n-drop corrects all issues, even using weeds.
My neighbor heats with fallen hardwoods from our properties. After he collects a bucket of wood ash I sprinkle it over my gardens. It brings the soil PH up a bit while adding trace minerals. It’s not a quick fix but I’m fine with that.
I’ll check back this evening. Gotta seed more kale and carrots before it starts raining.
It’s great talking to you!

Scott, thanks again for all this great information…all very helpful.
The garden’s raked out & I started mulching today. Really looking forward to an even healthier soil by next spring.
We live right on a very active creek. Two other creeks flow into this one so when it rains hard she really starts flowing. Twice this year the creek overflowed to the point of flooding well into our fields. It became a raging river, with logs & branches rushing along, breaking fences and being quite dangerous. So no, no stopping floodwaters here, but we’re working on minimizing erosion. I’ve built up a bit of an edge all around the garden, mostly of logs from the flood & piles of weeds I pulled. Should all compost down.
Do you put ground eggshells in your garden?
Going to get some elderberry bushes come spring. There may be some growing wild in our woods, too.
Going to lol into seeds for some of those cover crops. How about clover?

White clover is a perennial self seeder that I like a lot. Can’t go wrong. Crimson clover is one I plant in the fall. It sometimes self seeds but will only live one season.
All egg shells go in my compost. I have a good friend that goes to a lot of trouble to wash, dry and crush the shells. Wood ash accomplishes many of the same things but much easier to make.
I think that having my fields routinely flooded would be heartbreaking. I wonder if your property would be a good place for a chinampa style setup?

Well just typed a whole response & lost it…
So I’ll just say that you’ve got me curious about chinampa style setup?
What on earth is that? I’m going to look that up

Looking it up gives a way better explanation than I could. The most brilliant agricultural feat in history as far as I’m concerned. Possibly permaculture in one of its earliest forms.

So I looked up the chinampa gardening system…quite fascinating. Thanks for this info.
I’m choosing cover crop this year…it’s late to plant but hopefully some will take. I got a mixed cover crop seed.

I’m sure some will take Gaurī. Please keep us posted on how things are going for you up there.

Will do! It’s all so exciting/intriguing!
I must say I go to bed & wake up thinking about my garden!

I’m thinking about your garden too! Feel free to post pics and questions. There are a lot of helpful folks here way smarter than me. I’m sure we can figure this out together.

Here’s the garden expanded, tilled, weeded & with first mulching using flood debris, wet leaves harvested from the creek & a truck load of cedar mulch. I ordered mixed cover crop seed which I’ll be broadcasting in a week.
Help, people! What more can I do to continue to amend this already quite nice soil?
I do plan to have the soil tested.

I’m really curious to hear about your soil test. Since it gets flooded occasionally there should be tons of silt there to help drainage.
Whether the soil is acidic or alkaline all the mulching you’re doing should start correcting that. I mentioned this before but using wood ash is great for acidic soil. Given the slow process of it shifting PH I would still use in a alkaline garden space. Just not around blueberries or azaleas.
What’s in your cover crop mix?
Somewhere on this site is a picture of a cover crop crimper I made years ago. It was a four foot long 2x4 with a piece of angle iron drilled into the bottom. On each side I drilled holes and inserted rope to use as a handle. I’d walk along crimping the cover at the base to where it would fall over. It was immediately good for transplants and in a couple weeks for direct seeding. Plus you could use it to make realistic crop circles for Halloween! 🤣🤣🤣 Unfortunately I stepped on it to many times and broke it.
I must apologize for recommending the cedar mulch. For some reason I thought you’d be using it around the house instead of the garden. It won’t hurt anything but it’s pretty anti fungal. For garden spaces I believe that most hardwoods are better. However, when I get chips I ask for arborist chips. That just means everything is mixed, leaves and all. I’ll add some as a top layer in the garden but most I’ll pile up for a year or so. The soil here is terrible for growing potatoes but a pile of chips is magic! Don’t be afraid to mix sweet potatoes and regular ones together. They’re barely related and rather nice neighbors.
If you ever decide to add a layer of chips on top of your garden do it in the fall. A couple weeks before spring planting rake them to the side so the soil warms. A lot of direct seeded veggies need a certain soil temp to germinate. The chips keep the soil cool for much longer.

Interesting that you suggest raking wood chips to the side of the garden. I would have thought to rake them into the soil to enrich it??
Cover crop mix: Austrian Field Pea, Hard Red Winter Wheat, Triticale, Daikon Radish, and more.
Yes, I’m looking forward to the soil test results.
I do have different areas of garden that require different soils: blackberry/raspberry/blueberry patch, 3 kinds of melons, squash/pumpkins, zucchini/cukes, tomatoes…just to name a few…
Yes, the last big “100 year flood” left a good 1/2” of fine silt on everything.
Will try to find wood ash. We don’t burn our wood but take it to our wood refuse pile.

I only suggest raking them to the side to heat the soil better. I don’t till anymore so working them in isn’t an issue for me. Whatever hasn’t made it’s way into the soil yet gets pushed aside or into the compost.

Thanks again Scott!