Question about bad customer

First off, let me say that there were red flags about a customer that recently contacted me here.  He used a name that was going to be flagged for not being real sounding.  He had no posts, just a request to buy comfrey from me.  I sent it in good faith, and didn't receive funds from him.  It was a small amount and, besides shipping cost, only cost me some time.  

I am willing to just write it off and use it as a lesson not to send to people that haven't at least been members for a while.  I have always had fair dealings with people here, and this little glitch isn't going to change how I do business.  On the other hand, I don't want someone else to have the same thing happen to them with this same person.  I guess my question is, is there an appropriate place to make a "bad guy" list of people that don't follow through with trades or purchases?  Or will this lead to a never-ending he-did/she-did mess of accusations and it is best left unsaid?  There is an area for this with regards to businesses, because you can give the business a bad review and a write up about why youleft that review, but not sure if there is an appropriate way to deal with a person?

Frustrating, I feel your pain!

I don't think a bad guy list would meet publishing standards.  And a lot of marketplaces used to have customer reviews and ran into huge legal trouble for it so they got rid of that feature about 10 years ago.

But you pointed out some of the big red flags.

If someone doesn't post and doesn't bother to try to fit in with the culture of the community, then it's really difficult to get a read on them.  They are just using the community instead of becoming part of it.  

It's probably good to get the money before sending the item.  I don't know about other countries, but unless you have both signed a contract, shipping before getting the money is legally considered a gift here.  It's especially good if there are red flags.  

r ranson wrote:Frustrating, I feel your pain!

I don't think a bad guy list would meet publishing standards.  And a lot of marketplaces used to have customer reviews and ran into huge legal trouble for it so they got rid of that feature about 10 years ago.

But you pointed out some of the big red flags.

If someone doesn't post and doesn't bother to try to fit in with the culture of the community, then it's really difficult to get a read on them.  They are just using the community instead of becoming part of it.  

It's probably good to get the money before sending the item.  I don't know about other countries, but unless you have both signed a contract, shipping before getting the money is legally considered a gift here.  It's especially good if there are red flags.  

Thanks R.  I assumed that would be the case.  Interestingly, the person owns his own business.  I think I will just make an attempt to contact him through that business and see if he does the right thing.  If not, well, that's how it goes.  

You may be right about shipping before getting funds, I'm not sure how that works in the US.  In any case, I prefer to believe that most people here will do the right thing, and I've always been right until now.  As you mentioned, I probably won't extend that courtesy to other "fly-bys" in the future.  I generally deal with trades with people on permies, so there has to be an element of trust in both directions in that case.  Those have always worked out well, and that is a product of the great people that inhabit this community.  I'm very grateful for the overwhelming number of great people here, and the tiny number of not-so-great ones.

All of the projects at wheaton labs would be 7 times further along if people kept their word.  

7

Sometimes I like to imagine 7 times more things.  7 times more gardens.  7 times more events.  7 times more people here.  7 times more wofatis.  7 times more experiments complete.  Sometimes the people that don't follow through behave poorly to make up for their falling short - this is a really awful human trait.  And sometimes they just come to terms with "I learned some things about myself and ...  I am rather disappointed in myself" - this seems healthy even though I am left high a dry.

And then there are people that do more than they say.  So I wish to develop an excellent relationship with these people.  

I kinda feel like the bootcamp is designed to guide people through the path of "learning things about yourself" to "do more than you say" ...   from being less than industrious to being industrious.  I think the bootcamp is great at that.



Back to your question.  I've had it happen enough that I almost expect it.  What is the point of throwing them under the bus?  That bus is gonna be a hundred feet off the ground and nobody else is gonna care anymore.   In fact, with so many bodies under the bus, an observer might think that the problem might not be the people under the bus, but the person throwing them under the bus.  

Plus, what would you rather do with your time?  Throw people under the bus and yell "this fucker stole my $40 worth of stuff!" or go expand your garden five feet?  

I get people from across the world that say "send me a copy of your book and I will review it" - it costs a lot of money to ship something that far.  And then they don't review it.  

So when I send the books now I think "there is a 50% chance that they will do nothing."


If this is the only time something like this has ever happened to you, I can understand you being livid pissed.  And you will do as much as you can. And you will need to punish all future people because of this.  It's just part of this mess. When you get up to dozens or hundreds of attempts, you start to think of giving bonus candy to the lovely people instead of punishing the people that were unkind.

paul wheaton wrote:What is the point of throwing them under the bus?  That bus is gonna be a hundred feet off the ground and nobody else is gonna care anymore.   In fact, with so many bodies under the bus, an observer might think that the problem might not be the people under the bus, but the person throwing them under the bus.  

Plus, what would you rather do with your time?  Throw people under the bus and yell "this fucker stole my $40 worth of stuff!" or go expand your garden five feet?  

I get people from across the world that say "send me a copy of your book and I will review it" - it costs a lot of money to ship something that far.  And then they don't review it.  

So when I send the books now I think "there is a 50% chance that they will do nothing."


If this is the only time something like this has ever happened to you, I can understand you being livid pissed.  And you will do as much as you can. And you will need to punish all future people because of this.  It's just part of this mess. When you get up to dozens or hundreds of attempts, you start to think of giving bonus candy to the lovely people instead of punishing the people that were unkind.

I must have explained badly in my post.  I'm not angry at all.  I'm not even annoyed.  The only reason I posted at all was because I was thinking I may keep someone else from entering into a deal with that same person.  This experience isn't even enough to make me change my practice of sending people things before I get paid, let alone punish people that had no part in it.  I have sent people on permies plants for free far more often than I have for money.  As far as this person goes, a follow up email to him at his business telling him I never received funds is as far as I'm willing to bother with it.  If I gave the impression that I was even irritated, I chose my words badly.