• Post Reply Bookmark Topic Watch Topic
  • New Topic

Cutting the sidewall of tire and use for greenhouse walls  RSS feed

 
Nathan Lamphere
Posts: 3
1
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator
Hi. I am looking at building a greenhouse/aquaponics system - my first off the grid project. I have watched video after video of rammed earth tires and wonder, "Why not cut most of the sidewall off of one side of the tire and ram it with dirt?"

No more hand stuffing the sidewalls and swinging a sledge hammer at odd angles. It seems that the density can be achieved just as readily, that it actually fills the tire more completely, level it out more easily, and still provide as much integrity.

Am I missing something here? Probably, and that is why I am asking.
 
Jay C. White Cloud
Posts: 2413
46
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator
You may be missing a few things.

Tires are found to have some pretty noxious chemicals, they may be fine for a greenhouse but I would not want to live with them in general.

Cutting the sides is easier said than actually done, as that would be as much or more work than just using them as is.

If you do manage to get the tires cut with carbide cutting wheels or chainsaws you are going to change the structural integrative of the tire's normal geometry in such a way that it will not "pack" the same, nore provide as stable a wall/foundation assembly in general.

Hope that helps clarify things for you.
 
Bob Anders
Posts: 45
Location: Shenandoah Valley, VA
1
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator
You need to screw the tires together so they do shift. If there are no side walls what will keep in the packed dirt when the tires are offset from each other.
 
Bob Louis
Posts: 47
Location: S.W. Washington State
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator
Using a Sawzall type of recipro saw with a metal cutting blade, tires cut fairly well if the cut can be spread slightly behind the blade.
 
Jay C. White Cloud
Posts: 2413
46
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator
Bob Anders' advice is "spot on," and speaks to what I was saying about the maintenance of structural integrity of the wall system.

Bob Louis, advice will work but we found the chainsaw, or industrial shears are the fastest. With a sawzall, you can go through a lot of blades for an averaged size house project. Anyway you slice it, there is as much work in cutting up the tires as there would be in using them as is. It also does not address what Bob A. was getting at.
 
Nathan Lamphere
Posts: 3
1
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator
Thanks for the feedback. For clarification, since I left a lot out of my original post, here is some more:

The property is completely flat. The 5-6' tire wall would come up to ground level, and then have a cement pony wall on top of it to bring it to the height above grade that I want. The ground is entirely sand and rock - absolutely drains everything out of sight straight down. As far as we can tell, it is that way for over 400 feet.

The courses would be battered back 1.5" per course. This would let it act as a retaining wall against the outside materials.

Only one of the sidewalls would be cut out. The bottom one would be left in, and cardboard laid in it just like the standard rammed earth ones I have watched. See the pictures labeled Tire and Tire Cutaway

Rebar would be driven through the tires as shown in the courses attachment.

Also, I would screw them together as suggested.

Lastly, there is a tire recycler within a mile of me. I know some of the people there so might be able to get them to cut the sidewalls off for me for a reasonable rate or something. Otherwise I may be able to come up with something else to cut them, too.

Ok, with the drawings and description am I still off base here?
courses.jpg
[Thumbnail for courses.jpg]
Courses
Tire.jpg
[Thumbnail for Tire.jpg]
Tire look
tire-cutaway.jpg
[Thumbnail for tire-cutaway.jpg]
Tire cut away
 
Bob Louis
Posts: 47
Location: S.W. Washington State
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator
Looks good to me. And could not the removed sidewalls be tossed in with the fill?

I'm new to this. What is the cardboard for?

Just as a curiosity, the sidewall cutting I have done was to make homemade baskets for a disc golf course. I think disc golf is a great, low impact, way to integrate people into natural surroundings. We have a course that is in pasture lands, an alder grove, and mature second growth, mixed species, woods. In with this, I want to integrate a mushroom farm, greenhouses, and permaculture islands between the open field fairways.
 
Nathan Lamphere
Posts: 3
1
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator
The cardboard keeps the dirt from falling out of the bottom when doing the offset between courses. Here is a link to Youtube video that explains this. I am not associated with them, just one of the things I found for info. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cer3WKTOcy8

My reason for wanting to cut the tire is because it looks more labor intensive packing the tires, fighting the sidewall, then it does cutting the top sidewall (with the right tools) off. I think that I can get just as good of a pack, maybe even better, if I am not trying to kick the dirt in and then hit with a sledgehammer 50,000 times at varying angles. I am thinking a tractor with a tamper on a bucket bouncing the fill material down will work.

It should make it easier to level them out, too.

On your side note - I have seen flower pots made from the tires and decorated up they look quite wonderful. Sounds like you have ambitious plans!
 
Bob Louis
Posts: 47
Location: S.W. Washington State
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator
I watched that video and all I could think was, no country for old men. At 66, and having trouble keeping my weight to 140, I would look to my tractor too.
 
Jay C. White Cloud
Posts: 2413
46
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator
Wonderful schematics, and if you can get the side walls cut efficiently, your method looks like a viable option. Keep us posted with your progress.
 
david lund
Posts: 3
  • Likes 1
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator
I was actually watching youtube videos on making sandals with tire treads and I found this video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gE0GkBGyuZM which may be something fairly easy to construct, compared to other solutions...

Did you ever try your building plan plan by the way?

David
 
Burra Maluca
Mother Tree
Posts: 10003
Location: Portugal
923
bee bike books duck forest garden greening the desert solar trees wofati
  • Likes 1
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator
Thanks for sharing that David. I've embedded the video below.

 
david lund
Posts: 3
  • Likes 1
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator
And here are some pictures with a gent who built this type of wall: http://www.touchtheearthranch.com/goatshed.htm

and a link he published that points to a study that says they could work for residential construction: http://www.touchtheearthranch.com/Modified-Tire.Wall.Test2.2.pdf. While not official, it does lend some credence to their use.

David
 
Jay C. White Cloud
Posts: 2413
46
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator
Hi Nathan,

Would love an update on your progress. If you are doing a design in sketchup could you send me a "purple mooseage" found above. I would like to share some files with you and get a copy of your tire schematic. I have been doing some additional research per you questions and this post. I am going to reverse some of what I had previously said about chemicals (at least here in the US now...please anyone if you know of tire companies still using toxins in there manufacture let us all know) I actually found an old copy of the research that David L. referenced. If you are only cutting the top side wall you should be fine. You should read the research as you may find it informative. I am currently designing a timber frame that will sit on a tire foundation. Please keep us up to speed with your project.

Regards,
j
 
Patrick Roehrman
Posts: 53
Location: Ozarks of MO
5
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator
Burra Maluca wrote:Thanks for sharing that David. I've embedded the video below.


Pretty cool!
 
Too many men are afraid of being fools - Henry Ford. Foolish tiny ad:
This is an example of the new permies.com Thread Boost feature
https://permies.com/wiki/61482/Thread-Boost-feature
  • Post Reply Bookmark Topic Watch Topic
  • New Topic
Boost this thread!