Need advice on where to start

I'm not sure this is the best forum for my post, as there are elements that for multiple forums on this site, also its my first post so I'm unsure of the flow here

I'm in  zone 5b-6a on the Canadian map and zone 6a-6b on the USDA map

I am trying to clear some land that was cleared in 2010 for animals but never used, (16 years ago) to plant mostly food trees now, but a few good looking non foods would be cool too to make it nice, I mostly want plants that come back year after year, I don't want to keep planting anuals every year, also native plants would be best but I can make exceptions (I'm in Ontario near Georgian bay)

I am in a lousy spot, I'll post a YouTube video later of what the spot looks like when there is light out, but right now I'll just describe it;

To the south is a small ridge about 5 or 8 feet high with a line of tall maple trees blocking my south light

To the east is forest, to the north is forest

To the west is a single tall maple tree, and the rest is open field

Its also ancient shore line of Georgian bay, so under the very thin top soil is all sand, its funny if you dig up a rock its usually rounded from water that was once there a long time ago

I'm also in a valley, I'm on 44 acres and in spots the water comes right to the surface like a swamp, its a little dryer in the spot I'm clearing, but it could possibly get wet, like after the snow melt

Right now growing in the spot I'm clearing I've seen maples, oak, ironwood, poplar, red elderberry, staghorn sumac AND BUCKTHORN 😅(the forest is LOADED with buckthorn, like impassible in spots, someone not far away on the same forest I seen with a ornamental buckthorn plant on thier front lawn, I made a joke on another site that its unhinged behaviour lol)

Claude LLM tells me the maples to the south make it a bad spot because they will block my best light, it said the forest to the east is not great, the forest to the north has no effect, and the clearing to the west is my only saving grace and my fruit trees should to on the west opening line

I just started yesterday, I cut down about a dozen very small trees, mostly maples, I know they will come back up but I'll deal with that when it happens

I started two scrap piles one with oak and maple, and one with sumac and ironwood, because I ran out of ai tokens lol I assumed the maple and oak are good mulch but I didn't know about iron wood and sumac, the buckthorn when I cut it will be put in its own pile farther away

I don't think I'll get very far this year before the snow arrives on November, so spring planting will be in the tall maple shadows most likely, what are some good low light plants i should get for there?

Also I need a cheap wood chipper for the trees i cut down, so far the biggest might be 5 or 6 inches at the base, a small corded chipper can handle that?

I'll make sure I clear some of the west side as well, cause I'm going to order a few apple trees to come in the spring, I'm thinking of starting with applecrabs, (about a hundred feet or 200 feet away maybe I have two trees already, one a yellow transparent apple and the other unknown, also in the forest is a unkown tree that is very lousey due to low light, but it still fruits a couple apples)

I asked Claude LLM if I could plant raspberries under the tall maples, it said I probably could but the yeild might be low, is that true?

Also I buried 120 black walnuts in two buckets last week, the squirells found one of them, I have no idea how many they got, im hoping just a few, but hopefully they germinate, I'm going to try and sell a bunch, but plant some too, I know they posion the ground with juglone so I'll have to be strategic where I plant them

That's all I can think of for now, any and all advice is appreciated even if its about something I didn't mention, as I'm completely new, I didn't even like plants before June or July she. The transparent apples fruited and I decided I wanted to star foraging lol

I'll make a new post with a video of the area in a few hours when the light is up, so there's a more solid idea of what I'm working with

My 65hp loader with a PTO chipper with hydraulic feed will barely eat 6" alder and cottonwood. I try to draw the line around 5" as it gets damned slow as it nears max practical capacity. I don't think it would do 6" oak period. So no, a corded chipper absolutely will not eat those sizes, not even close. You need a commercial sized unit with ideally something like an 80-100HP motor on it.

Unless I am trying to maximize the chip pile I would generally buck up wood down to 3-4", it's good firewood. Hugels are a good way to use branches up, chipping is time and diesel intensive.. take care to let the wood age long enough that you are not having it sprout and make more trees where you don't want them.


I would really suggest seeking out some books specific to your local environment. Ben Falk is in Vermont, his stuff might be a decent starting point; not sure about someone more local.

You have a large enough area, depending on the shape, that a clearing will get you some decent light despite the maples to the south..

Thanks, most of the wood is smaller, there was just one or two bigger ones, I think the bigger ones were ironwood, the oak and the maple were all smaller, but there was some big poplar in the distance I might need to either fire wood like you say or get a real chipper

This is the video I took this morning, I did a bunch more around the fallen maple branch with a machete

https://m.youtube.com/shorts/t4zJ7OUR7O8

I just remembered I have a packet of nannyberry seeds, and I think they will grow in the shade, they will just be less fruitful

Poplar is a great tree for hugelcultur use, as it decays into soil very quickly, and pretty poor firewood. The types we have here are very prone to suckering and making a whole bunch more cottonwood right where you don't want it if thet are buried even slightly alive, so definitely let it sit on the ground a good while before building a hugelcultur from it..

Black walnuts aren't going to kill everything. Here is a thread about plants that are tolerant of walnut. There's lots of food plants listed.

AI is handy for little factoids , but monodimensional, it can't work out a plan, what permaculture is about basicly.
If squirrels are a problem , try an airprunebed, i made one last year because the rats started stealing too many nutty seeds and i have 25 young walnut trees in them now. If you plant them like that, the squirrels won't bother them. Maybe something else, i don't know what keeps them in check over there.
It might be worth looking into propagating trees if you have a lot of land and learn to graft. If you take apples as an example. Nurseries will sell you whatever is easy for them , not what's good for your soiltype or you have 20 appletrees that are all ready at the same time and perishable, while later you find out you wanted to have apples all year.
As well look at layers, do not plant high trees in front of small ones, shading them out in the future.
Make a plan, observe, learn.
Don't plant the known terrible invasives, but some people are really purist about things that are reasonably well behaved and produce food we need . Canadian Permies will know what they are.
How is the water situation? Droughts? Springs/water retention?

Great to have you here.

Thanks for the link joylynn

Hugo ai is great for little factoids, it had me build leaf towers today out of chicken wire, I never heard if them before, and it told me to mulch the leaves in a barrel with a weed whacker before pouring them into my leaf tower, and to wet it before adding too many

Also water is near infinite, the area is within reach of a long hose and my well takes hours and hours to run dry, I'm basically on a swamp, it might actually be too wet when the snow melts I'm not sure, I'll find out in april

I got a garden shredder off of classifieds today for cheap, the blades were mangled idk what the previous guy tried to put through it lol, it wouldn't even eat a small twig, but new blades were only $20, it says it takes up to 1.5 inch sticks, but I find I have to keep them a bit smaller then that unless they are almost dowel round, even then the machine sounds like it didn't like them, but I got most of what I cut down chipped, except for want was too big, I guess I'll use it for fire wood, I'm jot a big fire guy though

Tomorrow is rain so I should plan out what I'll do next tomorrow

Ai tells me nanny berries and raspberries should grow well in the shade, but won't be as fruitful

Welcome Alex, golly you got a project going! Glad you are sharing your situation and getting some input.

With the water you have on the land, you could think about willow - willow wands can be a money crop... willows can stabilize the soggy areas...

If the oaks you are pulling down have viable bark around them, you could inoculate for some mushrooms - shiitake,  reishi, chicken of the woods, lion's mane - and take advantage of the shady areas.

If you have maples up on the ridge to the south, that suggests you have a shady north facing slope - maybe good location for gensing?

Are you living there through the winter?  Maybe onboard some ducks?