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forest garden

New Video on Youtube. Interested in feedback.

Sergio Santoro

Posts: 259

Location: Nicoya, Costa Rica

posted 6 years ago

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OK, check out this video. Gonna make some pop corn while waiting for the comments.

Writing from Madhuvan, a yoga retreat/organic farm on the West Coast of Costa Rica.

wayne fajkus

gardener

Posts: 3073

Location: Central Texas zone 8a

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posted 6 years ago

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His myths are only a myth because he assumes they should be applied anywhere. If we apply that standard to big ag, we would myth not to apply lime prior to seeding cause some areas don't need it. "Observing" is ommitted and thats a critical mistake.

Comparing big ag to permaculture. I dont think Pauls vision is 5000 acre permie farms, but smaller farms feeding smaller amounts of people. Without this distinction, his views may be rock solid but come from a narrow scope.

Perrenial systems cant feed the masses. The wheat industry could give way to a chestnut or pecan flour industry. It seems logical to me. Think about the impact that would have just on the yearly tillage, herbicides, and petroleum use from annual cropping.

Sometimes the answer is nothing

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Chris Kott

pollinator

Posts: 3847

Location: Marmora, Ontario

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posted 6 years ago

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Hi Sergio.

I think I agree with many of the points made, essentially where he describes situations where people are choosing the wrong permacultural tool for their specific situations.

I think, though, that he's got a serious agriculture first problem that's keeping him from thinking outside the box on some of the issues he's seeing as problems.

The whole monocropping thing bothers me. They're using a machine about 18" wide, and so the block-planted rows are that width. There's nothing keeping them from alternating parallel block rows with one another, such that block rows of onions are alternated with crops whose pest species can't tolerate onion. You can do polyculture with block row plantings.

I think I am turned off a bit by the confrontational, judgemental language, which only peripherally connects with the message.

I also think that this guy and some like him might like to sit a while with our Dr. Redhawk.

-CK

A human being should be able to change a diaper, plan an invasion, butcher a hog, conn a ship, design a building, write a sonnet, balance accounts, build a wall, set a bone, comfort the dying, take orders, give orders, cooperate, act alone, solve equations, analyze a new problem, pitch manure, program a computer, cook a tasty meal, fight efficiently, die gallantly. Specialization is for insects.
-Robert A. Heinlein

duane hennon

gardener

Posts: 843

Location: western pennsylvania zone 5/a

posted 6 years ago

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some may not be happy about this...

My response to Curtis Stones' "What Permaculture Got Wrong... Dispelling Five Common Myths"

Chris Kott

pollinator

Posts: 3847

Location: Marmora, Ontario

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posted 6 years ago

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I loved the video. Spot on, for my money.

I think that I have to look in again on swale systems versus keyline plowing, but a lot of what is said makes sense, and much of what is covered looks a lot like how I am planning to approach matters.

I have no issues with reimagining hydrology and creating microclimate-changing earthworks, but I agree wholeheartedly with some of the conclusions arrived at, about making great market garden systems resilient and focusing on soil building and health being a crucial step forward.

I liked the line about there being no vegan ecosystems out there, not as a crass reason to exploit animals in the worst way possible, but just to stress that there are concrete benefits to integrating animals even if there's little to no cash flow derived from their presence, if they're not being harvested in any way.

I think that I need to do more practicum vis a vis market gardening.

-CK

You have to be odd to be #1 - Seuss. An odd little ad:

turnkey permaculture paradise for zero monies

https://permies.com/t/267198/turnkey-permaculture-paradise-monies