Elaine Ingham vs David Johnson

I've seen this discussed elsewhere but not here on permies (unless I missed it!) Not to have them battle it out in a no holds barred battle pitching hot and cold compost at each other but... I tend to overthink things, and go back and forth on where to spend the time - turning compost or watching compost. I think there are advantages and disadvantages to both systems. I wonder if there's a happy medium? In my search, I came across Diego Footer's "Which compost system is the best?" where he describes his experiments on the Johnson-Su Bioreactor. And he's got a couple great playlist on both systems.



Wondering if anyone has tried these variations or variations of Ingham's system? Oh, and it might save our marriage! I want to try a Johnson-Su Bio-reactor, my wife wants to give Elaine's a go. Our challenge is getting enough brown material, so we're in a staredown amidst a piles of manure, cattle panels and landscape fabric.

Hello.
I didn't test it, but learned about them.

Ingham's method is more about what ingredients to use for what type of crops, how to achieve a mature and active compost and how to apply it to crops. The Johnson-Su bioreactor is a device that replaces the 'turning pile' method for composting, which, to my knowledge, was not invented by Ingham. So you can actually combine both phylosophies.

Which composting method is better? The pile has lots of work but it costs nothing. The bioreactor has little to no maintenance, but it needs some investment to set up, especially the irrigation system. About the quality I couldn't say.
In the pile, it achieves high temperatures which is perfect for killing seeds and potential pathogens, but it also risks overcooking. In the pile, any error leads to rotting microbes that are harmful to aerobic crops, the ones we like to eat.
The bioreactor has aireation pipes that prevent rotting, and it controls the speed of the composting by the water flow. However, I don't think the bioreactor achieves a similar temperature homogeneously. Probably it doesn't matter if it is enough to kill most pioneer seeds.
In a climate where rains are scarce, the Johnson-Su bioreactor has an advantage over the pile, since it is very easy to ruin a pile for not being able to water it in time.

With any composting method, you can improve the final products following these SFW advices:
- Use a high carbon ratio for most crops, and a very high carbon ratio for trees. That's what they call brown matter.
- Use black matter (manure, urine) as a temperature regulator, the more black, the hotter it gets.
- Take your inputs preferably from the same place where the compost is going to be applied, to increase local microbes. When your soil is dead, any compost will improve it, but when it is almost in good shape, using a compost made from who knows where is probably harmful. Thay may lead to a rise in microbes not adapted to the local conditions to the local ones loss.
- Wait until the compost is complety mature (no heating) but apply it quick, when microbes are still very active. The point about applying compost is to inocculate microbes, not feeding the soil.
- It can be applied using compost teas and compost extracts, that increases massively the area that can be inocculated.
- It can be further improved by feeding the mature compost to red worms, and applied as worm castings.
- Since we are adding living material to the soil, it is worth to take a few steps for making the soil well receiving: irrigating the soil first, avoiding harsh sun and temperatures, mulching (preferably living mulch), etc.

To me, it is not about which is best.

It is all about learning how to do it and what method works best for someone.

I highly value the work of Elaine Ingham.

The Johnson-Su Bioreactor is just another method of the many that folks have figured out.

I like the trash can method of composting where someone fills a trash can with ingredients and periodically rolls the trash can around to "tumble" the ingredient.

More important than whether someone uses a trash can or the Johnson -Su Bioreactor is what is put inside ... the ingredient to make compost.

That is what is best to me.

Anne Miller wrote:To me, it is not about which is best.

It is all about learning how to do it and what method works best for someone.

I highly value the work of Elaine Ingham.

The Johnson-Su Bioreactor is just another method of the many that folks have figured out.

I like the trash can method of composting where someone fills a trash can with ingredients and periodically rolls the trash can around to "tumble" the ingredient.

More important than whether someone uses a trash can or the Johnson -Su Bioreactor is what is put inside ... the ingredient to make compost.

That is what is best to me.

Hello - just getting the hang of quotes, or not, in my comments.

So agree with what is best for someone.
All effort and learning is appreciable and is the particular relevant in your context?
I like to pick bits from here and there without being prescriptive.

Having introduced certain methodologies, realized, ooops, it’s rodent heaven!!
They loved the straw mulch, moved in to have a cool well stocked larder.
They have sort of hung around since in spite of various friendly snakes.
So ok it’s not a direct reference to compost, it’s to do with being just so.
There will soon be a bathtub compost container, drainage system for the juice, and the rest, some sort of shunting from one end to the other, with a cover over the top.

Thank you for your attention AND thank you Anne for regularly reminding me of Stephen Buhner, a person I greatly admire
wherever he may have passed to and whose presentations will remain on my playlist.

Blessings from still very hot to threat of 20C temperature drop over the weekend with RAIN. Hmmm, possibly storms meteorological mayhem.