Garrett's Garden - / Seedlings

Figured that I would make one of these posts as well, seeing as I am growing a bunch of different things this year. First post will have a few tomato seedling that I have going. Pretty much all wild ones for this one. Apolgies for the blurry photos, lighting in the room is bad and I am using a phone camera which has trouble focusing. Some of the leaves look a bit "diseased"(aren't really) etc, mostly from an earlier fungus gnat infestation that came in from one of my potting mixes that I left outside over the winter. Planting Peruvianum and habrochaites close together, seems to have been a bad idea due to habrochaites growing faster and shading out the smaller Peruvianums. Also have a few other tomatoes and wild types that I will add here in the future, maybe tomorrow? Planning on attempting crosses with habrochaites x domestics as well.

Good looking plants Garrett. Welcome to the world of hard green unpalatable tomato relatives!

I'm really hoping the G2 generation of the 1/4 wilds back crossed to Joseph's Big Hill will be tasty! Joseph got some nice ones in the F1/G1 and sent me some seed. I planted all the seed I grew as well.

Also including a photo of the best clump of pure Solanum penellii I've got growing this spring. Hoping it will donate pollen to a peruvianum.

Posting some tomato stuff, seedlings etc. Here is a list of what I'm mostly growing in flats: - Using 4 packs, two types of tomato per 4 pack mostly, seeing test as to what I like the best along with other traits.
2 Brandywine Pink Tomato - 2 Big Pink Hybrid(Not using for pollen or saving seed)
2 Costoluto Florentino - 2 Reisetomate
2 Cherokee Purple Tomato - Purple Russian
2 Vintage Wine Tomato - 2 Variegated Tomato
2 White Beauty - 2 Green Gage
2 Ananas Noir - 2 Wagner Blue Green
2 Black Cherry Tomato - 2 Black Vernissage
2 White Currant Tomato - 2 Hartman's Yellow Gooseberry
2 Chocolate Cherry Tomato(Not using for pollen or saving seed) - 2 Yellow Pear Tomato
2 Blondkopfchen Tomato
2 Cafe Blue Tomato - 2 Blue Cream Berries Tomato
2 Silvery Fir Tomato - 1 Unknown? - 1 Free Mixed Free
2 Pimps - 2 Kamatis Na Ligaw
2 Everglades Tomato - 2 Tess's Landrace Currant
2 Wild Currant Peru Tomato - 2 "Wild" Pink Cherry Humboldtii Tomato (Might not actually be wild, but had a trait of interest)
2 Galapagos Island Tomato 2 HR Solanum Peruvianum
2 Solanum Peruvianum woodland - 2 Solanum Villosum Golden Pearls ( Not a Lycopersicon but seems like a fun thing to grow)
4 Solanum Habrochaites woodland
2 HR Solanum Habrochaites - 2 Solanum Peruvianum Tomato Joseph-EFN
Also have a few more wilds starting to germinate, not listed here. Might make a table for these instead in the future? Seems cluttered here. Also might do close ups when I get a new phone or cameras, hard to get camera focused on my phone. Used my old IPad Mini for these photos.

Here are some other things near garden as well. The flowers are bordering my garden area to attract beneficial insects and things like that. Also planting more flowers in this area once I am sure all frosts are done. The area doesn't look too attractive, but that isn't its purpose. Might look nicer once flowers reseed next year and fill out spaces / weeds. Also strawberries in that area too, few different species and varieties. Posted some stuff from wooded area, because I will probably be getting berries and things like that from there.

Haven't updated in awhile. Decided to take a few pictures yesterday. Hoping my "Wild Tomato From Peru" (Place I bought it has no name except that for it, they don't know anything about it other than they received it from Peru, and that it matures later in season.) manages to get pollinated by habrochaites. Hoping to make some wilds mixed with each other. Have a little spot that I will be putting dropped tomatoes from currant types with pistils exposed, maybe a few other currants that will have self pollinating trait selected out. All of the photo I posted are from the same space. Habrochaites and my "Wild Tomato from Peru" ( Just going to call it WTFP to shorten it) are basically touching. WTFP has a good bit of flowers, but seems to have small stems that sprawl out in all directions, for the most part isn't shooting upwards. Small flower / leaves as well. Also no roots on any of WTFP's stem, rubbed fingers on branches - hardly any "hairs" as well. Seems odd for a Pimpinellifolium. Granted it is a unlisted accession and Peru has a wide selection of Pimpinellifoliums that are unknown or only exist in Peru or to researchers. Other tomatoes nearby are: Everglades tomato, Silvery Fir Tomato. Everglades will most likely pollinate WTFP. WTFP has an odd growth style for me, it does creep out from weeds so it isn't being shaded out. But the plant seems impossible to stake or cage, when I had it under lights it grew up straight. Eventually outside it stopped going upwards and started having growth in all directions. Technically more stems and flowers than the everglades, but the stems are much smaller - not thick at all, loaded with flowers as well. Volunteers from it should be fun to play around with. I do plan on messing around with it's growth style though. Wonder if these traits would be more compatible with wilds...

Anyway a bit cluttered there, I will post my squash and things eventually as well. I didn't weed the area the wild tomatoes are in too much, up until recently. Wanted to see how they did with weeds. They all did fine with weeds. Except for Wild Galapagos scented type tomato and Solanum Peruvianum. Both grew a bit too slow.

Garden is about done now. Still harvesting, but probably no new tomatoes, peppers etc. Took a photo of a few pimpinellifolium and habrochaites fruits a few days ago. Also took off a bract from the pimpinellifolium, the ones currently on the plant are quite long, the fruits get smaller as it grows - also seems to put off more shoots or stems from the flowering stems creating more flowering stems. Domestics don't seem to do this. Could probably get some fun crosses with this. Planted the exerted pimpinellifolium between two habrochaites, might get some crosses. Currently have a good bit of seeds from the pimpinellifolium germinating as I am testing for any crosses. If I notice any I will grow it inside and hand pollinate it with another seedling or one of the parents. Not expecting too much, but an F2 would be nice. The pimpinellifolium could benefit from somewhat larger flowers and fruit. Can't even really cut up or use them currently.

Few images of a volunteer growing in weedy area of garden. Corn was too wet and didn't come up in this corner. Sort of just let it go for some reason... Not sure what species these are, tossed a bunch of seeds collected from pods last year, already collected enough for replanting - they came up months ago. Grew arugula, radishes, komatsuna, tatsoi, turnips last year, allowed winter cress to grow in the area as well for flowers and greens. Garlic mustard was present but I removed it before it went to seed and used the greens chopped up on fish.
Edit: Seems to be black spanish radish - leaves aren't too rough though - granted its flowering. The flower buds are unusually "spiky". I found another flowering radish nearby with white flowers and smooth buds. Maybe different varieties.

Figured since the garden is about done I would post some fruits near the garden area. And a plant that I am probably still keeping in for a little bit longer - just to see how long it will flower and grow. Some sort of physalis species. Grew Aunt Molly's ground cherry last year - this isn't it, wild type it was in this spot last year but I didn't really pay much attention to it. Maybe some sort of escaped tomatillo from somewhere? Don't really have many neighbors, the neighbors I do have don't seem to have gardens, one does but I can't imagine them growing ground cherry sized tomatillos. Fruit I picked up is still somewhat green but appears to be turning purple, sticky as well. Stems are pretty hairy too. Might as well save seed since I am planning on growing a few different species of physalis next year. Trying to find a good tasting type/species, too bad they don't really cross with each other (physalis heterophylla and physalis virginiana can apparently cross according to some reports). Habrochaites is putting on some buds again, flowers could attract bees again and hopefully some developing fruits could get hit by a frost at around a month, if they get that far - might effect the growth of seeds next year? I have a good bit of seedlings right now from earlier fruits, I might post some of them if I notice crosses or just any odd leaf types, which I have noticed some odd ridges that the pimpinellifolium I grew doesn't have, or ridges that are too far into the leaf. Foliage on the type I grew wasn't all that uniform, finding any actual crosses might be a bit annoying. Would rather not have a large amount of "off type" seedlings in pots everywhere looking for flowers/fruits...

Garden is still somewhat alive... Saw a bee visiting peruvianum and habrochaites flowers. It didn't bother with the small pimpinellifolium flowers though. Assuming that habrochaites is somewhat sensitive to daylight considering the flowers are now larger and way more flowers than there were previously. Also posting somes leaves. Also posting a single seedling from a bunch that I put in a pot. All of these seedlings are offspring from the pimpinellifolium, but they are already obviously crosses / look off type. And they smell sort of bad - have pretty long hairs on the stem. Some leaves are sort of "glossy". The pimpinellifolium had almost no hairs on the stems and leaves. Could have crossed with domestics that were farther away.

I have some habrochaites x pimpinellifolium seedlings growing inside now. No flowers yet, maybe in a few hopefully.
Garden is pretty much done. Habrochaites leaves were all black amd drooping / soggy this morning, I pulled the plants and took off semi-ripe fruit that came from larger fall flowers on the plants. The fruits are rather soggy due to the frost / cold. Pimpinellifolium is just dead, the habrochaites actually had new growth at the base.
Also harvested some unripe runner beans and some off type succotash beans that are supposed to be half runners. Some of them were half runners - normal type. Some grew up the metal pole alongside the runner beans, had markings on the pods and took longer to ripen - they are supposed to be dry beans. I grew the succotash beans last year among other beans, so they could have crossed I suppose. Waiting for the off type beans need to dry before I say anything for certain. But I probably won't see too much bean variation if its an F1. I tried Marvel Of Venice and Slippery Silks beans in the same spot. Planted these beans to try and get an ornamental / edible type of spot. No flowers matched, and no yellow or red pods. So those probably rotted. I grew these beans in a rocky area with a bit of soil on the top for germination. Yield wasn't a big goal. Good bit of flowers, most fell off even though bees were visiting them.
Grew Moldovanesti Buffalo runner beans this year as well. Also grew some runner beans originally from Migardener. Believe this is my third year growing them and saving seed. Unsure if they are still selling the same type as it was unnamed, purple and black colored. This type has some off-type beans this year. Could be due to harvesting them unripe. First year growing two different types of runner beans, so probably not a cross. Showing the off type succotash beans, runner beans. Pink beans could just be a lack of developed colors due to the stage I had to pull them at.
Don't really have an area inside to hand beans upside down and let them ripen indoors. Not enough pods to warrant attempting that either. Cold weather tends to damage beans that are full of water / unripe. Some still may be viable.

Some pimpinellifolium crosses. First two images are of plants I started inside. Third image is of off type plant showing same stems as the pimpinellifolium. The others are ones I brought indoors a good time ago. Threw pimpinellifolium and habrochaites fruit in a rocky area to see if they came up / did well next year. Some came up in a small group looking off type, so I brought them inside screened off from indoor plants - watched for any signs of blight. Some may be habrochaites x pimpinellifolium.
Bees could have went to other garden and brought pollen back so there could be domestic crosses as well. Plant in first image is putting of multiple stems / branches now. Looks like small buds are forming, will post flowers and such when that happens.

This is from plant in the first image from the last post. Two new points of growth. One has buds in the middle of it - still rather small at the moment. This one is definitely going to be "interesting" to grow indoors. Also posting an exposed root from a identical looking plant, which might be removed soon or once it fruits / flowers. Roots appear larger compared to domestics.
The larger roots are probably a trait from habrochaites. Roots went fairly deep underground on the habrochaites. I didn't water the habrochaites after first few weeks of planting. Assuming they are fairly drought tolerant.
I am watering these plants about 3 - 4 days a week. No signs of stress so far. I will start watering them more though due to buds starting to form.
Also adding beans from other post. Some of them aren't doing too well due to being harvested young. Runner beans in middle are off-color, might just be due to harvesting early.

Largest tomato cross so far. It fell over a couple of days ago, had to stake it - posting some images of top canopy and main stem. Will need to trim upper growth due to this. The stems are rather firm, was careful not to snap it - also the stems don't feel completely "round" like the pimpinellifolium or domestic. More leaves per stem than the pimpinellifolium or standard domestic types - stems are longer as well. The stem's width are staying small like the pimp and habrochaites, which could mean that this is a cross between the two. Won't be able to tell entirely until fruits form.
 
Some of the flower buds are starting to become fully developed on the plant. The buds and bract themselves seem to be quite small though. This would probably mean that they will make the same size of fruits as the pimp. I will post a close up of one of the buds, thumb visible as a scale.
I will post the fruits and flowers when they get to those stages. If the flowers end up being exerted due to fruit/flower size combined with habrochaites extended stigmas I may post them in the "Promiscuous auto-hybridizing tomatoes" thread instead. The pimp was slightly exerted to begin with, but this could be due to the small flower size.

I am also growing a few chilense, hairy habrochaites, peruvianum seedlings right now. One of the chilense is on the 4th set of leaves and is a decent size. Which is quite nice considering this is my first attempt at growing the species. The 2nd chilense I am growing has about the same number of leaves, but the plant is  much smaller and the leaves are a bit more curled. I am keeping all of my plants under 12 hours of light to help with flowering with the crosses and such - seems to work well for short day and long day plants I experimented with in the past. I can probably adjust the times back an hour forward or backwards with almost no issues as well.
Also posting some leaves from other off type plants.

Some flowers are starting to fall off. Hoping they pollinated successfully. Flowers are looking nice as well.

Fruits are starting to develop, seems to have hairs? The pimpinellifolium had no noticeable hairs on the fruit. The hairs on habrochaites can probably help with deterring fruit flies in places like Australia where they can spoil fruit. Fruit flies aren't a problem in my climate.
Flowers seem fairly close together at the ends, and larger than pimpinellifolium - probably habrochaites traits.
Hopefully seeds will be small, might help with embryo size in further crosses. Will update when fruits are a larger size or become ripe.

Two different generic runner beans seedlings. One of the parents was "off type" in its growth style.
As such I planted out a seed from the plant indoors. I also planted an older saved seed as a comparison.

The first leaves of the off type offspring has large leaves and grew up rather high from the base - cotyledon was ground level. The normal type stayed more towards the ground - also ground level cotyledon. The leaves seem a bit different as well - stems are different in color as well, with the off-type having red vines.

I marked the normal type in red, boxed in the leaves to differentiate between the off type plant.


I also neglected watering these for awhile so they are a bit sad looking. Oh yeah and they were under a grow light and got scorched after going into the bulb so I moved them.

Plants collected outside have hairy leaves, so probably a cross as well.
Posting some images of the outdoor plant's stems along with a few other things. The outdoor plants are showing habrochaites branching habits. Multi branching main stems / new stems.
Outdoor plants have larger leaves as well.

Second image is an example of the "multi-branching" I mentioned. Would probably do better if it were sprawling outside, but I am trying to get F2 seed. Just now getting flower buds on this plant. Heavily pruning suckers, unsure if they branch off in the v shape as well, or if only the main branch does this.
Outdoor plants are leggy, so the V shape probably would have been further down the plant if I had given it proper lighting to start with. Other cross is doing this to a lesser extent, this plant seems more vigorous.  

Was looking through my posts and realized I don't have updated images of my indoor cross's fruit on here.
First fruit image is the first one that started developing on 11-29 after the flower dropped. Other fruit image is smaller fruit with hairs more visible.

Inside of a possibly ripe cross. Seems to be turning white rather than yellow. In between habrochaites fruit size and the pimpinellifolium size. The hairs rubbed off easily, some came off before it was fully ripe. One fruit I tasted from the plant had no taste - this one was a bit sour.

Seeds from the cross finished drying this morning. Figured I would do a side by side comparison with the parents.
Top is the parents - pimpinellifolium and habrochaites, bottom is the child.

Seed from the F1 seems a bit of a brownish color I suppose, not quite like habrochaites. Seed size is slightly smaller than the pimpinellifolium, but not much of a difference.
Only put a few seeds from each out for display, they are annoying to put back into the air tight containers I have them in.

Top seeds look a bit odd because I actually fermented both parents together, probably bits of paper stuck as well.

Here are some more tomato images. One of the plant from the outdoor plants - along with some possible pimp x habro.

Another fruit ripened - sort of orange as before. I picked the other ones when they turned sort of "squishy" before. Seems they go from that stage to orange within a matter of days. So my seed should still be viable from those harvests.
Small hairs are somewhat visible I suppose - habrochaites hairs were nicer / more noticeable. The fruit will probably just fall off if I leave it on too long. The fruit that I harvested today fell into my hands when I went to touch it. Suppose both parents had that trait.

The habrochaites I grew seemed to ripen to a white color, maybe a bit of green towards the top even after sitting on the ground for awhile. The pimp was red. Using this mostly to try and gather a favorable disease resistant - early - wild root systems etc into a single base. I can then move to a larger domestic type. Hopefully this works out well enough. Both parents had some exerted flowers, small seed - which will be nice when trying to obtain other crosses.

Well snow is gone for now, I went outside to check to see what overwintered. I killed things that didn't look interesting / didn't want to overwinter. Also looks like a rabbit killed / possibly killed something that looked interesting.

Brought the bulb/storage root inside. Since its winter, most of the energy and focus should be in the storage tuber, but I brought it inside for some extra care. Unsure if its a turnip or a radish. The only radishes that I ever really plant are black spanish - sometimes white icicle. Suppose there is a chance its a cross of the two. But I wouldn't think that the offspring would be white with a green tint.

I'm posting two image of its eaten brother as well - took this image in late fall. Found its leaves and no bulb, unless it rotted recently? The leaves resembled a turnips. Also has the same white / greenish root. I didn't plant any turnips green - or white. Possibility of an interspecific brassica I suppose, especially considering the huge amount of leaves and small
storage root.

Also possible that these are two different crosses...


Throwing in an image of some seeds that I'm planting in the same pot as the turnip(?). They are some seeds of habro x pimp that just finished drying. I already have a bunch of seed for it, still a few weeks before I start my main tomatoes. Figured I might as well get a sneak peak on possible leaf patterns with this being the F2.
Started some long season wilds with my peppers already. No sprouts on those yet, except for a few peruvianum/corneliomuelleri types which probably could have been planted later.

Some more older pictures from the fall. Unsure if these will come back.

Putting in my favored flowers here. The plants showing up in the area that I posted before this are descended from these fellows which I found had reseeded in the garden - these guys flowered in the spring / fall. I'm trying to make a few selections of beautiful-large flowered, unique leaved brassicas. Hybrids are welcome as well, I am expecting them considering I'm not separating anything and this is more for looks than anything else.

First image: All-pink, dark purple streaks towards center. Again odd for a radish flower. Usually they have a bit of white towards the center, not a full purple. Streaks are odd as well. Also bees pollinated the flowers, but many of them fell off... Possibility of a hybrid, but not getting my hopes up. I lost the seed that I managed to get off it - it didn't germinate.

Second image: Another plant that was nearby. Flower seems to be a purple instead of a pink. Same story of flower drop off. Also had a large bulb - black spanish! Maybe this is a regular coloration for the variety? Either way its something that I want to breed into other types.

Third image: White flowers with hints of pink! Smooth buds. The purple portions make me say its a radish?

This is a side project, I am assuming that my surviving plants will flower in the spring like they did last year.

Arugula, radishes, komatsuna, tatsoi, turnips are the possible parents of the flowers I had last year ( No photos of all those flowers sadly, only radish ).

But this year I will be growing even more Brassicaceae!

Lepidium:
Maca Lepidium meyenii
Purple Maca Lepidium peruvianum
Kandahar Giant Cress Lepidium spp
Pepper Cress Lepidium sativum
Dutch Broadleaf Cress Lepidium sativum

Diplotaxis:
Diplotaxis tenuifolia
Diplotaxis erucoides

Some other things as well!

Bunias orientalis
Purple Stemmed Arugula Eruca vesicaria
Sinapis alba
Camelina sativa
Variegated Wintercress Barbarea vulgaris
Rattail Radish(Long purple pods!) - other radishes as well.

Brassica - mostly just putting species to shorten the list, will mention them after planting, notable plants will have special mention:
Brassica juncea
Brassica rapa
Brassica olerace
Brassica carinata

Some notable Brassica varieties - what I want from them for the Beautiful Brassicaceae project - or whatever I am planning on calling it.

Willem's Blauwe Groninger Kale - Appears to be a perennial, nice leaves, images showed purple flowering stems as well.
Bear Necessities Kale - Interesting leaves, apparently cold hardy / perennialish. Seems to be a napus x rapa which fares well for disease resistance and crossing to other things. Unsure of how the flowers look though.
Purple Peacock Broccoli - Very nice looking! Seems to be a oleracea x napus - again more flower variation and potential of crossing with other brassicas for nicer flowers.


Another goal of this would to have plants from a separate genus to hybridize - which I could turn into a sub-project. Quite a low chance of any hybrids like that though.
Of course I will search for things like black rot, immediately kill anything bad. Heat treating all of these guys.

The bulb has a chance of surviving. Noticed two small green sprouts on it.

I put hydrogen peroxide on the softer, somewhat rotting layer - it was quite soft. Unsure if it helped at all, but I was unsure of how long the bulb was left exposed and open to the elements. Went from freezing to 40F+ within a day, wasn't sure if another freeze would just take it out being already damaged. Started snowing today, so I am glad that I did this.

Image of the radish - but with leaves. Looks odd, unsure of what crossed with it at this point. Hopefully it doesn't try going to seed indoors...

Second image is a small grow out of Joseph's Peruvianum. I culled the common leaf types in this group, only the odd types survived - just to ensure these have diversity. I will do a wider mix in a pot soon, few more in cells too. Should get white / purple fruits from most of these.

Third image is J&L Gardens Corneliomulleri / Peruvianum strain. Small grow out for this one as well, will do larger grow out in a pot, or do a few more cells. Fruits will probably be small / green on this one, but diversity is nice.

Growing a white fruited Peruvianum, two other types as well.

Also growing out my Pimp x Habrochaites F2, along with Reisetomate x Habrochaites F2. Should be interesting.

I have some of Joseph's promiscuous lines in a pot, will do another one eventually. Next year I should have enough to seed an entire tray with clumps.



Also have some Jaltomata herrerae along with Lycium exsertum, Lycium ruthenicum. Solanum abutiloides sprouted as well.


My Arcanum and most of the Chilense seem to have died off. Probably due to the cold temperature. Some habrochaites and peruvianum seedlings had red veins / underside of leaves when this was happening. Disappointing, next time I will start them separately in a warmer room.

Some fun seedlings I have growing.

First image has some Kangaroo apples. Solanum aviculare is on the left Solanum lanceolatum is on the right. There is a hybrid of these online somewhere. I'm just growing these as oddities / ornamentals.

Second image has some Jaltomata species: Jaltomata herrerae is on the top, Unsure of the bottom one - got it as free "jaltomata" seed. Jaltomata procumbens is the most common type that I have seen sold online, so highly probable that is what I received.

Third image has some Lycium species. Top right is Lycium exsertum, Bottom right is Lycium ruthenicum, Bottom left is Lycium barbarum.

A single Capsicum flexuosum seedling germinated recently as well. Cap 1141 germinated pretty quickly, growing nicely. It was too cold for most of my peppers to germinate, past years were warm enough that I didn't need a heat mat. Murasaki, Chinese Five Color, Bleeding Borg 9 - the only other peppers that germinated so far. Planted them on February 22nd. Even if the others don't germinate, I will still keep them as they might germinate later on. If nothing else I get more seed.

Tubocapsicum anomalum is also starting to germinate.

Solanum abutiloides has a single sprout so far.

Litchi tomato just has its first sprout two days ago.

Most of the plants listed here are just oddities - can probably use some of them for breeding projects.

Lycium species won't do much in terms of production for a few years.

Capsicum flexuosum and Cap 1141 will probably be used for breeding different flowers and tolerances to things like Bleeding Borg 9, Murasaki.

Litchi tomato could be fun to attempt hybrids with tomatoes, but I would need a small lab setup at the very least.


I will post tomato seedlings here in a few weeks, maybe earlier since I started some of them early.

Went out and dug up some wild alliums. Unsure of what species I got. Just dug out pieces of clumps. The ones that I dug up usually get mowed over, so they never flower.

One of them wasn't with the bunching groups - has larger bulb, more grass-like. I didn't smell it, the other ones already made my hands and everything else smell like onion-garlic.

I moved them to an area where I am letting some native plants grow, along with some chives / garlic chives that I recently moved outside.


Fun image of nettles near the garden as well. The ornamental types and the natural types are competing all throughout the yard. Unsure of which type arrived here first - I think it was the ornamental type.

It has been quite some time since I posted here.

Heat wave killed quite a few of my plants earlier on in the season.

Anyways, here are some pimpinellifolium x habrochaites F2 plants / seedlings. Along with the first flower from one of the plants.

I will post the exserted plants in the Promiscuous page once their buds open.

My squash plants are starting to flower, as are the beans.

I have been looking into self seeding medicinal plants, cold hardy plants, uncommon self seeding flowers.

Eventually, I plan on adding a controlled area for these things. Honeybees seem to prefer the non-native flowers, some insects enjoy some of the uncommon plants. A medicinal - insect garden type of approach.

No idea what this first flower is. Second image has a nearby seedlings foliage - flowering plant has sickly foliage.

Could be a Cyanus - Centaurea species of some sort?

I thought it could be Crepis rubra - flower buds and leaves don't fit.

Could be a Silene species as well.


Next up on the list is Silene vulgaris. Found some plants by the house - garden. Also found some in the woods. I went and collected seeds earlier. I will research / experiment with the best time to plant this species. The flowers look pretty interesting to me as well. Posting seed pods - plant / flowers.

And lastly - an unknown Silene species, found two plants of it growing next to Silene vulgaris at the edge of the woods.

Pretty sure that it is a different Silene species due to the much larger "bladder" and flower. Oh yeah, opened up a bladder that was turning brown (going to seed) and I found this large/hard - green thing in the middle. Different from the other species seed cavity. The leaves on this species are also larger - both plants have sickly leaves - maybe they prefer full sun? This could be a hybrid - I don't know - it highly resembles the other species, found it near that species as well.

Kitazawa seed has some interesting "Specialty Greens" as well as other things.


Lotus corniculatus grows in the yard as well, might try moving it into this planned area as well. It attracts some interesting insects.

I might throw some parsnip seeds somewhere as well, insects overwinter on the plant - and in return they hunt harmful insects. These would probably have a special sectioned off portion in the controlled area. Could try planting Skirret for the same purpose.

Lactuca species could be tossed in as well.


Mostly, this is for medicinal / edible self seeding plants. I also want to attract different pollinators / predators. I am growing all sorts of new things, more pollinators  / predators would be nice.

Haven't updated this in quite some time, didn't post as much as I would have liked.

Posting plants that are still alive / along with fruits.

First three images feature: Solanum sisymbriifolium - Litchi Tomato 'Gigante'

Hoping to improve this species, sweeter fruit - earlier maturity - fruit size. I have grown a variety from Baker Creek before with smaller fruit, these aren't large - still somewhat bigger than normal varieties.

Fruits also aren't uniform, some will be larger / smaller than others.

Flowers are quite ornamental, spines / thorns - whatever they are, quite unpleasant. The fruits can be lightly shaken off when fully ripe, so the thorns are avoidable in most cases. I grew this at the edge of the garden to avoid bumping into it.


Also grew Solanum laciniatum, 4th and 5th images show flowers / fruit. Unsure if the fruits will ripen before the frosts come - should have viable seed anyway as they have been on the plants for a few months.

S. laciniatum has steroidal compounds, mostly growing this because I want to perform embryo rescue - other hybridization methods using it at some point in the future. Said to be cold hardy to USDA Zone 8, meaning it can take a few frosts. S. sisymbriifolium has begun to bow a bit due to high winds, S. laciniatum has very sturdy stems / branches - it hasn't fallen over at all. If I tried to bend the branches / stems, they would just snap. The Litchi tomato can be bent a bit.

Some recently harvested beans. These are all completely dry.

Slippery Silks, Marvel Of Venice, Succotash, Pakistan White Shooter Bean (The pods tend to burst - the beans are white, thus the name).

Also have some tepary beans from Joeseph's mix.

I didn't label all of my runner beans, one of them is most definitely Austrian Kaeferbohnen from The Seed Stead - very large beans. Also looks like one of them probably hybridized with Munting's Purple Runner?

Second image has Lohrey's Old Tasmanian, Autumn Zebra, two other varieties that I can't remember the names of. These all have some uncommon looks to them.

Autumn Zebra isn't being shown on BakerCreek anymore from the looks of it - same story with Marvel Of Venice. Autumn Zebra was a new variety to the catalog.

I've been wanting to gather a bunch of Fragaria species / accessions and the like in order to create hybrids - fertile ones.


But, that's not all!


I actually want Familial crosses.

There are Rubus x Fragaria hybrids out there. Very cool!


There's also Rosa x Fragaria hybrids in some literature.



I'm basically collecting a bunch of Rosaceae species and whatnot.


Port Huron Strawberry - a F. virginiana. Got it from Oikos awhile back, I'm unsure if it's still alive in my cluster of strawberries that moved with me to Mississippi. Pea sized berries.

I should have some white alpine strawberries, and maybe some other wild types - F. virginiana and vesca.

If I'm super lucky, my F. chiloensis from Native Foods Nursery survived too.


I moved my strawberries into a pot before the move.



I also brought "Geum canadense" from Pennsylvania. Back home there, it would die back and make slender silvery foliage in the woods.


There's also some Pennsylvania "Potentilla canadensis".


My rubus species all died shortly after the move, didn't water them enough. I really liked R. occidentalis's wild type canes. Had some very rare ones too. It happens I guess.



Now, I've gathered wild plants / specimens that I've noticed that are probably Rosaceae species.

Potentilla simplex, and a bunch of other things. All but the strawberries in the images are from Mississippi or Pennsylvania.


Geum canadense and Geum urbanum hybridize readily. One is from the Americas, the other is from Eurasia.


Sure, there's some sterility. But, they cross and I'm fairly sure they could be backcrossed together.



The large leaved plants, not the large bushy G. canadense that didn't die with the nonexistent winters here (It still looks nice with all the foliage, I'm unsure how the climate will effect its flowering though). Those, have flowers that are very similar to G. canadense - grow tall and upwards like the species does as well.

I'm aware that the species has a large distribution. It could be a local ecotype or a related species. Dunno.



There's also feral or naturalized mock strawberries all around here.


I'd like to try getting some Geum urbanum x canadense crosses and obtaining yellow flowers / fun genetics and then trying for other crosses, maybe even with Potentilla.



Prarie Moon Nursery sells a ton of Rosaceae species. I'll check those out in the future.



I'm going to be selecting for non white flowers in any Fragaria relatives crosses. This is for a simple reason. Yellow, red and other flowers crossed into white, easily mark a hybrid without a doubt. And, I would personally love to introduce some different flower colors into the species.


I'd also want to select for you know. Red fruits using mock strawberries at the very least.



The yellowing plant, I've seen plants with pink or yellow flowers. I got that one after it flowered. Some plants have the brown markings, others don't. They're always in the same position.



I grabbed the largest / healthiest specimens that I could find and moved them.


If anyone wants to ID these, they're welcome to do so.


I'll probably put the names on here as I find what they are.

One species is probably a Ranunculus. Still neat. Recurvatus.


Geum laciniatum is probably the large fuzzy leaved species.


Ideally, they will cross with each other - the geums.


If the one species is going to form green little robust things, I'd want it to stay that way. Fuzzy leaves are usually an adaptation for some climates and whatnot, so those would also be welcome.


G. urbanum has yellow flowers and is from Eurasia, seems to readily hybridize with G. canadense. So that's also on a list.


Marsh Cinquefoil should also grow well on the property due to the swamplands present here.


Pink Panda strawberries - those varieties. I'll probably seek them out as well.


Not to mention Musk strawberries.

I'm starting up a pollinator and bird food, whatever you wanna call it, sort of garden.

1 Cardinal Flower

2 Candy Corn Vine

1 Salvia splendens x darcyi - Roman red (Didn't realize this was a single variety hybrid sorta thing. Pretty neat.)

1 Salvia elegans - Pineapple Sage

1 Asclepias perennis -  White Milkweed

1 Helianthus salicfolius - First Light

1 Blue Fortune Mexican Hyssop / Agastache - hybrid between A. rugosa and A. foeniculum. So, that is neat. Didn't know that till after I bought it.

1 Monarda didyma - Bee You, Bee Free

1 Salvia farinacea- Mealycup Sage Sallyfun Snow White.




I will be attempting to cross Pineapple Sage into Salvia splendens x darcyi. An herb, with multiple species bred into it. Frankly, the hybrid has a related species from a mountain crossed into it. It's probably going to give me a hardier pineapple sage.

There's also Salvia lyrata that grows around here.


A large Salvia hybridization project is a future goal. I planted a bunch of Salvias, but pests ate them or dug under the seedlings.



Now, there's also Sabal minor growing around here, American Beautyberry, Purple passionflowers, elderberries, Mitchella repens. Plus some blueberries and Hackberry trees / shrubs.


The one large flower spike that I'm posting with a Sabal minor flower, has three of four bees in that photo. Bumblebees.


I wasn't overly familiar with these species till I moved here. I'm probably going to try some breeding work with them.



I ordered elderberry breeding mix from the Experimental Farm Network along with a Ukrainian elderberry and Dwarf Palmetto. I didn't order any Beautyberry seeds from them, budget you know

I did get some red elderberry seeds from Prarie Moon Nursery (Yellow fruited Mutants or hybrids - whatever they were, didn't make the move as they simply died off), I also got some other neat stuff from them. Didn't get flat out elderberries.


I also got blueberry or gray / blue colored elderberries from Raindanceseeds. They're marked as "Sambucus negra". I doubt they're S. nigra.


I consider S. canadensis and other elderberries from North America and elsewhere to be different species than the European species.


It's likely Sambucus cerulea in my opinion.



I personally love the flowers of Sambucus racemosa and consider S. canadensis flowers to be inferior in terms of looks. Just my opinion.


Anyways, yeah. Edible pollinator garden that also has berries and things for birds or myself if I'm hungry.


I'll cycle plants and things out with hybrids that are produced as time goes on, probably.



Elderberries having varieties pop up is wonderful. Especially with breeding mixes.

I'll also note that it's supposedly impossible to make syrups and some other products using American elders. You need to use European ones.


All the more reason to try crossing over European species into North American ones.


I've also noticed that the Experimental Farm Networks seeds or whatever that they selected out for a breeding mix, don't seem to list southern populations of elders.

I'm likely going to be growing some plants from over here next to seed that I grow out from them.


Same story with their Dwarf Palmetto that's cold hardy.



Ideally, a bunch of the things that I've mentioned will cross readily. As time goes on, I will obtain more ecotypes related species of things and whatnot.


I'd have ordered some Passiflora species from Raindanceseeds, like the catelope sized ones if I was further along and prepared to grow things in a garage or really baby some plants and whatnot.


I'll also make another post mentioning some other neat stuff.


I did lose my perennial PA physalis species. Sadly.



I haven't posted here in a time.


Figured some people may think this is neat / cool.


Cultivating native edible plants into crops or breeding them into crops. I honestly think that growing non temperature species or plants far outside of their comfort zone will always stress them out and lead to issues at some point.

Corn, is fine as are cucamelons and some other species. Things from Japan can do well here too.

Some European species are iffy.



Tomatoes are on a list for me of, "needs a lot of interspecific work to make groups that are fine being temperate plants". Same with peppers.

People do focus on disease resistances and whatnot but usually ignore the core issues like maybe fuzzy leaves or other traits that make them better or worse suited to some climates.


Varieties themselves being grown in large masses in places that they dislike growing in. Varieties are a bit better than clones.

But yeah. Shove in disease resistant traits over and over until they run out of resistant traits, because introduced diseases and pests mixed with growing plants in unsuitable climates where they suffer or are more prone to certain things. That will eventually kill off tomatoes.


Joseph's work of making varieties that are interspecific hybrids, cold hardier and the like are pretty cool. I believe my thoughts of reworking entire leaf and other structures are similar to some of his thoughts.


Not to mention the things have a low amount of genetic diversity.



Anyways. I just figured I'd post and mention what's going on. Also, I mentioned where I got things for reference or so that others know what ecotypes I have.

This is a rather fun post.


First of all, I wanna say that these are likely hybrid beans.


I was growing some Alma's PA Dutch (Phaseolus lunatus), Marvel Of Venice (Black seed), Succotash beans and some others up a trellis.

We had a very bad year for mildew on the squash and beans.


I got some yellow flowers from one bean, and moldy pods with mildew before I could get ripe beans.

The Succotash beans gave me plenty of seed though and did the best.



The following year, I didn't keep up with the garden. I planted some Succotash beans eventually because I had so many.

I even planted some some near a hummingbird feeder pole.


The ones in the garden were, ah. How did another user word this. "Pulled out by a well intended relative" or however they worded it.


Anyways, I ended checking on some flowers.

I noticed that the Succotash beans outpaced the runner beans going up the trellis at first, then grew oddly.


Eventually I got some rough / indented pods that reminded me of runner beans.


The Succotash beans were larger than normal - green pods at least. I was simply checking the insides, because they had large thick pods. I mean they're larger than a lot of other beans to begin with, sure.

But, yeah. Big.



I thought "hey maybe these are runner x common beans, cool!"


Which, yeah. The runners and common beans did both grow in the same yard. The ones on the trellis the year before that never germinated - they rotted.


I eventually mixed the seeds up with some others from the year before and labeled some by themselves.


Seems that I placed them back into the seed packet and stored them in a plastic tote with labels.



It also came to my attention as I was searching what else I planted the year before, that Lima beans have thick indented pods.


None of the Succotash beans had any Runner Bean markings either. Granted that would've probably been an F1.



Either way, I remembered that they existed.

I did plant some on a trellis again, but I was aware that I was moving and didn't plant a ton of stuff.




I'm honestly not a bean expert and I rather dislike the taste of them. I've only had bushes baked beans.

Appearently, there's multiple types and ways of preparing beans. So yeah.



I'm also growing 4 or 5 "Dwarf runner beans" that I got from Germany using a small lots of seed a few years back now.


Most are from breeding programs. Hestia is the only one I know of here in the states.


I also planted Lohrey's Old Tasmanian, Sunset Runner beans, Marvel Of Venice on the corners of the raised bed.



There's also Red Swan bush beans on the one side.


Can barely call these rows. I moved out of a rental, now there's a property. Things stayed in cells for too long.


So I tried planting beans with the hope that the peppers will eventually make a comeback.





I also planted Jackson Wonder Limas recently. They're the beans with white veins on them.then.



I was a bit confused as to why people here don't know about runner beans despite all of the migratory hummingbird spots here and the fact that there's so many more than up north.


Runner beans appearently hate heat and high humidity.


I'm hoping that some of the dwarf runners can accept pollen from common beans or the sunset runner bean.

Or donate pollen to the sunset runner.


It's possible that they've been selected for closed flowers. Most have red flowers from what I've read, which is good - yeah.



I'm unsure if what I have are runner or common bean hybrids. I'm hoping Lima hybrids or something. To my knowledge, they're rarer and probably more sought after than Common x Runners.


I did move to Mississippi Zone 8b and probably need to update my profile.


Limas are tolerant towards heat and humidity.


Any Lima hybrid, would be wonderful here. Though, Alma's PA Dutch is meant for up North - I'm fairly sure that Lima beans can outcross a bit more than common beans.



I've noticed some oddities happening with some of these plants.


I can't be 100% certain that these are hybrids.


I also haven't seen much activity in the bean threads, I will move future posts there.



There's probably people here more well versed in Phaseolus than I am.

So. Yeah, anyone familiar with hybrids or who could say "I've grown hybrids of X and X and they don't look like this, then I'd appreciate it greatly.


Is any of this stuff unusual in beans or anything?


I'll post the flowers which should be pink / purple, I think, when they appear.

Noticed oddities: one plant made two tendrils immediately - they've shot upwards and began to climb each other. The front and back, rather than the points facing the first two leaves are putting on new growth for more shoots.

I'm also seeing another leaf that resembles a single cotyledon.


A plant next to that one, put out two cotyledons, and then formed a single large leaf - no leaflets. Then another one just like it formed across from it on the opposite end. Looks like another set of cotyledons.


That second set, each is putting out a shoot with the same three leaves as is standard.


Sure, they're below the first set of cotyledons. But he's obviously just trying to live his life out here.

No growth in between the first set of cotyledons, at least not yet.



I'll mention other oddities if I find them along with flower colors and whatnot.



Obviously, if I have a fertile Lima x Common bean, I need to make sure I'm crossing them into other limas and common beans.


Along with whatever runner x common backcrosses that I can possibly get using the dwarf stabilized hybrids.


But yeah. Bean experts are more than welcome to chime in.

I checked further up and I posted some of the beans way up there awhile back. I believe I mixed the possible F1s and F2s together. But yeah.

I've also purchased some other stuff since I got excited.

Strophostyles helvola - from The Experimental Farm Network. Woolly Bean Breeders Mix.

"These seeds all come from coastal areas from Brigantine, New Jersey south to Cape Charles, Virginia."




Strophostyles helvola - Hayefield, Bucks County PA Ecotype.


Strophostyles helvola - Trailing Wild Bean, Prarie Moon Nursery


Strophostyles leiosperma - Small Wild Bean, Prarie Moon Nursery



Alma's PA Dutch Purple Burgundy  Hayefield, same source as my original seed.



Phaseolus polystachios - Wild Kidney Bean, Prarie Moon Nursery. I call these Thicket Beans.



Peruvian Cow Print Lima, Phaseolus lunatus
Paul's Jungle Lima Bean, Phaseolus lunatus
Deep Maroon and White Lima (Possibly Christmas Bean or a related bean), Phaseolus lunatus.

The limas are from Brian Laufer / Raindanceseeds.



I'm simply putting site names for reference, as mentioned before.


I'm aware that the Experimental Farm Network and Oikos were selling some Phaseolus polystachios accessions at some point.



I'm also aware that P. polystachios and P. lunatus are closely related.


If I'm crossing Runners, Common beans and Limas - it's probable that I'm going to be selecting for open flowers. Well, open flowers / self incompatibility, large red bicolor flowers, heat tolerance, insect tolerance.

You know, stuff like that.


Anyways, it's probable that my chances of P. polystachios crossing with Limas would go up if I have Limas crossed into an open flowered hybrid between Common beans and Runners.


I'm well aware that Limas were domesticated multiple times in different areas. Just like some other Phaseolus species.

There are true annual limas as well as perennials that simply die in temperate locations, even Florida.

Limas are simply tropical, very tropical to the point that they won't tolerate some lows for extended periods of time.


Peruvian Cow Print Lima is probably a perennial type. It's from Amazonian markets. And according to the description, it can reach up to 50ft.




If I have an interspecific Lima, I would really like to get different accessions and whatnot.


More accessions means more of a chance of genes to mix with different species and hopefully give me more bizarre plants - possibly ones that can accept P. polystachios pollen.


I don't know if I can stress enough of how much I want P. polystachios hybrids.



We all grow beans from the tropics or from Mexico, legumes. Ones adapted for dry areas or tropics.


They've been worked on a lot. But, nature has also presented us with a variable species that's found all across the United States, from a temperate climate and different zones, other sorts of climates. And it has resistances to our climates and there's probably an ecotype in everyone's state or just about every state.

They're hard to find as they were wiped out in a lot of areas appearently due to deforestation. They're called Thicket Beans for a reason. And colonists weren't a fan of vines.



Regardless. Thicket Beans are very cool. On Oikos there's some mention that they think the beans are fine without hybridization.

Me? Who here wants to spend a few thousand years slowly selecting for larger beans (maybe decades or hundreds, but you get the point), disease resistances, cool seed coats and beans that are worth more in markets than common beans.

Actually, you could probably sell these beans for less in markets than regular beans if you crossed them and got domestic sized beans, just because they're less labor intensive with planting them, then letting them grow for three years and planting more afterwards. Selling for less means more people would probably buy your crop.



Runner Beans are perennials zones 7+.


I'd rather not have a perennial bean that has no adaptations for a temperate climate.

I mean its cool sure. But, it will be very short lived and probably unhealthy. Zone pushing Scarlet Runners - sure they're hardy to Zone 7 and I'm in Zone 8b. But, they don't like humidity nor high heat.

Common beans are always going to be inferior to limas here as well.



I feel like trying to make a common x runner hybrid that can handle things here and be a perennial would be a waste of time. Selecting for an annual type would be better and less likely to give me issues down the road. Just gives me a bad feeling that I'll end up with a disease vector that doesn't do well.




Phaseolus polystachios, is very hardy and well adapted to these climates. And it's already a perennial in these climates.


Root structures are nuanced towards certain temperate, mountain ranges, tropical, bogs - that sorta stuff.


When people think of root structures and perennial plants they usually just want something that will survive in certain zones. I've been researching a lot of different species root structures and they're effected by stuff above ground temperatures and other factors.

Some pests also prefer certain climates.  Where these things are normally perennial - those pests aren't prevalent. Just some examples.

Nematodes for example.


Just a lot of stuff that makes me think.



I'm not meaning to discount anyone trying to make common x runner beans with perennial roots here.


It's also a fact that P. polystachios is perennial in lower zones and all across the U.S. which would be a lot nicer too.


I did a lot of research and figured that I could probably make a zone 7 hardy interspecific tomato. I'm also 90% sure that it would become weedy and be an unhealthy disease vector at some point because it's only adapted to be cold hardy. It may straighten out at some point or become weedy and die off completely.


Simply making things cold hardy isn't near enough. And I would rather not press things out that would become issues.





Strophostyles species are also very cool and closely related to Phaseolus. The Experimental Farm Network happens to have a Breeders Mix. Hayefield where I went to get another packet of Alma's PA Dutch had a PA Ecotype, The Experimental Farm Network was focusing on beach / coastal populations of the species.

Prairie Moon could have another non coastal type, they don't list where their seed is from.


So yeah. I also read that the other species that I bought from them doesn't seem to cross with S. helvola in the wild, at least the ones in their study didn't.



The P. polystachios and Strophostyles species both have temperate adaptations. One actually should get a film of sorts on the seed that helps prevent mold and fuzz on the beans.




Even if what I have is a Succotash x Runner, I would still be happy.


I'm likely to get a Lima x something at some point anyway.



I'm not forgetting about tepary beans either.

I may or may not purchase wild accessions from Native seed search next year.


Tepary beans are immune to a disease that they can infect other species with.

The disease only presents itself on other species when they're grown in certain climates.


I will select for that immunity if I'm able to here and if I'm able to screen for it / get tepary crosses.


Joseph has a nice diverse tepary mix that he helped make.


I'd also get wilds from Prarie Moon - there's an undomesticated subspecies.

One wild type is from the highlands, another is from the lowlands.


One is fine without water, the other can't handle droughts. One grows up like a tall pole, the other grows lower to the ground.


Because of the differences, they're both considered to be subspecies different from the cultivated type.



There are also other wild Phaseolus species.


If anyone has seed for the type that's supposedly ground up and has a coffee taste or whatever it was, I'd be interested in that.

It's closely related to tepary beans and that's what I remember of it.



Anyways, future posts may go elsewhere on permies, beans at least.

Correction: Runners like heat and humidity but uptake more water than other species.

So they will do somewhat well here, but there's a rainy season followed by a very dry one.

They do well in part of the south. Seems where I'm at isn't one of them.

Some beans snapped in some recent rains. Neighbors corn plants were also flattened.

Their beans look fine.


I'd say that pole beans may be best for the area because they have support.

Even my bush beans got knocked over, some snapped too.

Pole beans with support seem fine.


I'd like to mention that I started some Phaseolus varieties, mostly P. vulgaris near a Thicket, with fallen branches and tree limbs everywhere.


Those are just now coming up due to the rains.



I did these by a large "pole barn" - more of a garage, at the new place, weeks ago. We are just now starting to move in.


The watered beans came up and are doing better, probably obvious.



On the other side of the barn, I did some Vigna species and varieties. Almost nothing has come up but they may have been crushed or there were too many weeds.


I'm adding an image of some that came up.


These are probably either Sea Island "Peas" or Hokkaido Adzuki beans. The Sea Island Peas had lightly tan coats, smaller than the Holstein Cowpeas that I also tried planting in the area.


I tried planting some wild Curcurbita species but I'm not seeing anything.



These are mostly areas where I'm hoping to plant some carefree Vigna species.


The commercially available Adzuki beans are bush types. Their wild form or ancestors are usually black mottled climbers.


I'm hoping to somehow find the wild form at some point.


I've grown Vigna vexillata and gotten flowers before but I had pest issues that year.



I'd like to grow some other legumes, Vigna mungo, Psophocarpus tetragonolobus, Vigna radiata, Vigna unguiculata, Vigna aconitifolia, Vigna trilobata, Vigna umbellata and Vigna lanceolata.


Cowpeas have the fun "multiple domestications" thing going on like Phaseolus species.


I also feel like it's probably possible to cross a bunch of Vigna species. Some of them just aren't grown near each other. Others are from islands and whatnot.


I figure that if I grow a bunch of landraces from a bunch of Vigna species, that it'll probably result in me being able to get interspecifics at some point.


Eventually I'd try seeing what happens if I grow Phaseolus interspecifics near Vigna interspecifics.

Psophocarpus tetragonolobus would be a long shot. Maybe not, who knows.


I have noticed that Cowpeas will outcross, but not at a high rate.

Maybe they'd need to be a parent and don't have many barriers against outcrossing besides the initial mechanisms. Who knows.



Anyways, I'd prefer an out of the way area where these things can grow away from the garden and do whatever.


I've also noticed that if I only harvest legumes for seed, I'll usually end up finding hybrids when they're planted near other things.


I've gotten some tomato, and other hybrid this way - even from things that aren't noted as large outcrossers.


Things grown from seed to tend to be grown simply for that purpose at times. And so they're isolated or whatever a lot of the time.




I just figured that I'd post this. I've been jotting some stuff concerning hybrids and the like down.



Most beans and things give me enough seed that I don't especially need just to use as seed.


Planting off type or hybrid seeds in the mentioned areas are likely to give me interesting results as well.



While it's likely that the same bees would visit the various Vigna and Phaseolus species, I'm going to try to only plant hybrid or off type seed in their own actual areas.


The Phaseolus group will be replaced by outcrossing / red flowered types at some point.


And I can't have them growing there if I get far enough along that I have some hybrid types that I want.


The neighbors grow Kentucky Wonder, and I'm sure I'll get hybrids from those.

Can't really complain, but it's also possible that I will be able to give out semi stabilized seed at some point.

Lima hybrids with runners and things could eventually give me fully edible (limas aren't well liked by a lot of people), heat resistant beans with other nice traits.

It's possible that Lotus purpureus "Asparagus Pea" and Vigna angularis "Adzuki Beans" may be able to cross. I'm figuring this due to some certain reasonings.

I'd leave any forms of pollination up to the bees due to flower sizes.


Lotus corniculatus is another species that I'd grow.


Lotus berthelotii would also be fun to grow. This species seems to have some self incompatibility factors according to research. And it's endangered but grown in trade.

Plus the whole adaptation for hummingbirds, butterflies and things as pollinators.


I'm unsure if they'd cross over to related species very well and I haven't heard if they're edible themselves.


Still, I'd try growing the species out, just because why not.


I may or may not pick up some Psophocarpus tetragonolobus and Lotus seeds / species this year or at the beginning of the next because seed for these species are hard to source in the States.

I also need more Adzuki beans and I'd like to try sourcing some of the harder to find in the States Vignas.