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Fruit trees in North Florida

 
Posts: 178
Location: 9A Marion County Fl
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Id like to hear from anyone that is having good results from their trees and the varieties.

I have property in Marion County ( Ocala area ) I am working on getting re- established with trees. I like fruit trees and Id like to know what I can safely grow and then what I can maybe/hopefully successfully grow and then Id have to be nuts to even try to grow

Id also like to hear what people do to protect their trees, admittedly I know almost zero about protecting plants from the cold, Ive always lived in areas that we really didnt have to worry about such things, Im picking up what I can on U-tube.

Thanks for sharing your experiences.

Edit: Can someone tell me if this guy is still around https://permies.com/t/14510/Food-Forest-plant-list-USDA

Id like to talk with him, I am not great at this forum stuff but it dosent appear to me that he has posted in 8 years? Is this true?
 
pollinator
Posts: 3113
Location: Massachusetts, Zone:6/7, AHS:4, Rainfall:48in even Soil:SandyLoam pH6 Flat
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I would not recommend the following:
Cherry
Plum
Apricot
Peach
Nectarine
Apple
Regular Grape

Things you can try:
Muscadine Grape
Passion Fruit
Fuzzy Kiwi
Citrus
Asian Persimmon
Jujube
Mexican Avocado
Mango
Starfruit
Loquat
Pineapple Guava
Fig
Governors plum
Lychee
Macadamia Nut
Goji berry
Mulberry
Banana
Jaboticaba ( very productive)
Guava
Pomegranate
Tropical Raspberry and Blackberry
Tropical Blueberry
There are a number of fruits called sapote and they will all do well.
 
Jason Walter
Posts: 178
Location: 9A Marion County Fl
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S Bengi wrote:I would not recommend the following:
Cherry
Plum
Apricot
Peach
Nectarine
Apple
Regular Grape

Things you can try:
Muscadine Grape
Passion Fruit
Fuzzy Kiwi
Citrus
Asian Persimmon
Jujube
Mexican Avocado
Mango
Starfruit
Loquat
Pineapple Guava
Fig
Governors plum
Lychee
Macadamia Nut
Goji berry
Mulberry
Banana
Jaboticaba ( very productive)
Guava
Pomegranate
Tropical Raspberry and Blackberry
Tropical Blueberry
There are a number of fruits called sapote and they will all do well.



Thank you Bengi, can you explain how frost directly damages a plant? To keep it simple........Ok it gets cold outside, the moisture in the air attaches itself to leaves and freezes them.....is it most important to protect the crown of the plant or does this protection have to include the entire circumference of the plant?

Why do people not prune their fruit trees to maintain a manageable height.....Im sure many do but Im guessing that hurts fruit production? I guess I can attest to that in that I trimmed a barbados cherry I have a few years ago ( and when I say pruned I guess I should say scalped ) and its never produced the same. Should be a list somewhere of what can be pruned ( as far as fruit trees ) and what wont handle it.

Another thing Im learning is that evidently the tags that the vendors put on their trees may be misleading, they state good down to suchnsuch but looking online I cant find a single entry of a Catalina Avocado tree being grown in N central Fl.

You live in Mass ( I used to attend Dean Junior College BTW........not as a student but more as eye candy ( 3o + years ago )  ( when I was buff versus not so buff )  for a female student. Grew up in CT

Thanks again
 
S Bengi
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Posts: 3113
Location: Massachusetts, Zone:6/7, AHS:4, Rainfall:48in even Soil:SandyLoam pH6 Flat
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You have probably put a glass soda bottle in the freezer in the past and then found out that was covered in juice and that the soda bottle opened by itself. This is because frozen water expanse and destroy its container. Or you might have heard founds say that the meat in their freezer has freezer burns and the quality just isn't the same anymore.

Well the same thing happens to the cells in tropical trees, the water expanse and then cells gets damage, it happens to humans too, we call it frost bite. So trees have some type of anti-freeze like chemical in their sap/cells and they can survive the cold even if it is 15F, other get damaged at 35F.

Catalina is for frost free areas, so Zone 10A, will not work, it needs to be at least Zone 10b. So Fort Myers would still be a no, maybe Naples 1,000ft from the beach will work. Another thing is that a plant might survive if it is 15yrs old but a 3year plant will get damage, and depending if fertilizers were used that stopped it from 'hardening off'. There are also hot spots and cold spots even on a single plot of land so if you had the plant by a south facing wall in front of a pond it might survive when anywhere else might mean death. The biggest difference is where are not the temp of say 29F is just for a 2hours, on just 1 night of the year. Or if it get to that cold temperature every night for two weeks straight.

Ahh, you are from new england. I have a plot of land in southwest florida too. I went down there in Feb/March. But now with covid, I dont know when the next time will be.




 
Jason Walter
Posts: 178
Location: 9A Marion County Fl
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S Bengi wrote:You have probably put a glass soda bottle in the freezer in the past and then found out that was covered in juice and that the soda bottle opened by itself. This is because frozen water expanse and destroy its container. Or you might have heard founds say that the meat in their freezer has freezer burns and the quality just isn't the same anymore.

Well the same thing happens to the cells in tropical trees, the water expanse and then cells gets damage, it happens to humans too, we call it frost bite. So trees have some type of anti-freeze like chemical in their sap/cells and they can survive the cold even if it is 15F, other get damaged at 35F.

Catalina is for frost free areas, so Zone 10A, will not work, it needs to be at least Zone 10b. So Fort Myers would still be a no, maybe Naples 1,000ft from the beach will work. Another thing is that a plant might survive if it is 15yrs old but a 3year plant will get damage, and depending if fertilizers were used that stopped it from 'hardening off'. There are also hot spots and cold spots even on a single plot of land so if you had the plant by a south facing wall in front of a pond it might survive when anywhere else might mean death. The biggest difference is where are not the temp of say 29F is just for a 2hours, on just 1 night of the year. Or if it get to that cold temperature every night for two weeks straight.

Ahh, you are from new england. I have a plot of land in southwest florida too. I went down there in Feb/March. But now with covid, I dont know when the next time will be.






Good explanation, thanks. Ill show my ignorance by saying that Im not sure why then they would sell this avocado so far north? Maybe they think people will keep it in the pot?
Anyway its in the ground now and Im not gonna give up on it. Lets see what happens, maybe by the time winter comes I will have discovered or invented a fix for the cold weather that infiltrates my property.
 
pollinator
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No protection
Apples, anna, dorsett golden, tropic sweet, eine sheimer
Plums, chickasaw, guthrie and odom, gulf series
Native black cherry
Mulberries, common figs, che
Asian and american persimmons
Rabbiteye blueberries, southern highbush blueberries
Mysore raspberry, most blackberries
Peaches, florida king/prince, tropic series, Sam Houston
Avocadoes del Rio, gainesville, opal, lila, mexicola grande
Pecan, dunstan chestnut
Feijoa
Orinoco, ice cream banana
Kumquats, loquats, calamondin, Satsuma mandarin, dancy tangerine
Ugni
Green tea, yaupon holly for caffeine
Paw paw
Pomegranate, hardy kiwi, fuzzy kiwi vincent and tomuri
Jelly palm
Koroneiki and arbequina olives
And more

Marginal without protection, will require protection for the random arctic blast, most years would be fine with maybe slight damage to mature trees
Lychee, longan, jaboticaba, macadamia, pineapple, surinam cherry, papaya, ambarella, white sapote, oranges, lemons, cattley guava, passionfruit, mango

However with hardiness zones shifting north, by the time these trees are mature they might not need any protection other than the rare freak cold event. Also, canopy counts for protection. Live oak and cabbage palm canopy can give a few degrees up to 10 degrees of warmer temps on a cold night, depending on whether its radiational or adjective cooling. Kind of a living greenhouse. Even a lone cabbage palm will be warmer directly under the fronds on the south side of the trunk on a radiational cooling night.
 
Dan Allen
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Also flordahome pear would do good
 
Jason Walter
Posts: 178
Location: 9A Marion County Fl
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Dan Allen wrote:No protection
Apples, anna, dorsett golden, tropic sweet, eine sheimer
Plums, chickasaw, guthrie and odom, gulf series
Native black cherry
Mulberries, common figs, che
Asian and american persimmons
Rabbiteye blueberries, southern highbush blueberries
Mysore raspberry, most blackberries
Peaches, florida king/prince, tropic series, Sam Houston
Avocadoes del Rio, gainesville, opal, lila, mexicola grande
Pecan, dunstan chestnut
Feijoa
Orinoco, ice cream banana
Kumquats, loquats, calamondin, Satsuma mandarin, dancy tangerine
Ugni
Green tea, yaupon holly for caffeine
Paw paw
Pomegranate, hardy kiwi, fuzzy kiwi vincent and tomuri
Jelly palm
Koroneiki and arbequina olives
And more

Marginal without protection, will require protection for the random arctic blast, most years would be fine with maybe slight damage to mature trees
Lychee, longan, jaboticaba, macadamia, pineapple, surinam cherry, papaya, ambarella, white sapote, oranges, lemons, cattley guava, passionfruit, mango

However with hardiness zones shifting north, by the time these trees are mature they might not need any protection other than the rare freak cold event. Also, canopy counts for protection. Live oak and cabbage palm canopy can give a few degrees up to 10 degrees of warmer temps on a cold night, depending on whether its radiational or adjective cooling. Kind of a living greenhouse. Even a lone cabbage palm will be warmer directly under the fronds on the south side of the trunk on a radiational cooling night.



Hello Dan, do you live in 9A?

Are these trees that you have planted and had success with yourself?

How do I find these specific varieties....for instance I would love to have the plum tree. You mention chickasaw, guthrie and odom, gulf series, Im guessing these are the varieties that you know work?

I call local nurseries ect and have asked for specific varieties of plants but I have yet  to find a nursery that knows or seems to care what its selling, they seem to have nice plants and they are well established nurseries but they just simply do not know and sometimes seem as if they dont care either way. Any suggestions?

I type Florida native black cherry and I get zero results, can you further identify?

I already have 3 loquats, you say no protection? I believe my property can get down into the mid or low twenties every now and again. Not sure what the loquats will handle, has your experience shown no protection needed for this tree?

You have a list for marginal, Ill save my comments until I understand better your experience with these trees mentioned above. Thanks very much
 
Dan Allen
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Jason Walter wrote:

Dan Allen wrote:No protection
Apples, anna, dorsett golden, tropic sweet, eine sheimer
Plums, chickasaw, guthrie and odom, gulf series
Native black cherry
Mulberries, common figs, che
Asian and american persimmons
Rabbiteye blueberries, southern highbush blueberries
Mysore raspberry, most blackberries
Peaches, florida king/prince, tropic series, Sam Houston
Avocadoes del Rio, gainesville, opal, lila, mexicola grande
Pecan, dunstan chestnut
Feijoa
Orinoco, ice cream banana
Kumquats, loquats, calamondin, Satsuma mandarin, dancy tangerine
Ugni
Green tea, yaupon holly for caffeine
Paw paw
Pomegranate, hardy kiwi, fuzzy kiwi vincent and tomuri
Jelly palm
Koroneiki and arbequina olives
And more

Marginal without protection, will require protection for the random arctic blast, most years would be fine with maybe slight damage to mature trees
Lychee, longan, jaboticaba, macadamia, pineapple, surinam cherry, papaya, ambarella, white sapote, oranges, lemons, cattley guava, passionfruit, mango

However with hardiness zones shifting north, by the time these trees are mature they might not need any protection other than the rare freak cold event. Also, canopy counts for protection. Live oak and cabbage palm canopy can give a few degrees up to 10 degrees of warmer temps on a cold night, depending on whether its radiational or adjective cooling. Kind of a living greenhouse. Even a lone cabbage palm will be warmer directly under the fronds on the south side of the trunk on a radiational cooling night.



Hello Dan, do you live in 9A?

Are these trees that you have planted and had success with yourself?

How do I find these specific varieties....for instance I would love to have the plum tree. You mention chickasaw, guthrie and odom, gulf series, Im guessing these are the varieties that you know work?

I call local nurseries ect and have asked for specific varieties of plants but I have yet  to find a nursery that knows or seems to care what its selling, they seem to have nice plants and they are well established nurseries but they just simply do not know and sometimes seem as if they dont care either way. Any suggestions?

I type Florida native black cherry and I get zero results, can you further identify?

I already have 3 loquats, you say no protection? I believe my property can get down into the mid or low twenties every now and again. Not sure what the loquats will handle, has your experience shown no protection needed for this tree?

You have a list for marginal, Ill save my comments until I understand better your experience with these trees mentioned above. Thanks very much



I do have all the trees with the exception of che, asian persimmon, mysore raspberry, dunstan chestnut, ugni, yaupon holly, jelly palm and koroneiki olive, flordahome pear, einsheimer apple, tropic sweet apple. I have the florida king peach and the sam houston and many seedling peaches. The florida king peach and the chickasw plum had ripe fruit for me in early April, and the two apples flowered but did not fruit yet. I am not in 9a, my property is at the border of 10a much farther south than Brandon but about 40 miles inland. I also have many more like coffee, jackfruit, sapodilla, mamey, sugar apple, acerola, grumichama, lilly pilly, cherry of the rio grande, coconut etc. Loquats are not tropical they can handle down to the low teens. The guthrie and odom are selected varieties of chikasaw plums that pollinate with each other. Mail order natives carries them. The dunstan chestnut you can get from chestnut Hill tree farm, and the olives can be purchased from A natural farm in howey in the hills. The native black cherry is prunus serotina and grows down through Central Florida in hammocks. The chikasaw plum grows native all the way down the ridge. I have a similar project going on but in a remote, wild area, same beach sand soil, but more like the edge of the everglades than high and dry. A good source for low temp tolerance of fruit trees in florida is growables.com.
 
S Bengi
pollinator
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Location: Massachusetts, Zone:6/7, AHS:4, Rainfall:48in even Soil:SandyLoam pH6 Flat
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@Dan the native plum that you mentioned is a great addition. I have noticed that while apples, apricots, cherries, peaches, nectarines, and family will survive every winter, they seem to have a lot of pest and deceases, and require 10x more spraying/etc. While with others they are more like blackberry, just giving me a harvest with minimal effort on my end.

 
Dan Allen
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I personally don't believe in spraying, organic sprays or otherwise.  I have not had any significant problems with pests. Where my trees are there are deafening hordes of frogs and toads that come out at night and take care of the bugs. I grew beautiful unblemished peaches and plums. The biggest problem with insects I've had is fire ants, and I've found that the old trick of taking a shovel of ants from one hill and adding it to another takes care of them when they are where I dont want them. They fight until they wipe each other out. I have had aphids, but they seem to be more attracted to cowpeas than my trees, and when they showed up, the lady bugs followed. That said I wouldn't plant an orchard of just peaches or just apples, as that would create a buffet for the bugs that like them, I just mix them in to my food forest. I place all the temperate trees on the north side of the property to intercept the north wind, to help them get their chill.
 
Jason Walter
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Dan Allen wrote:

Jason Walter wrote:

Dan Allen wrote:No protection
Apples, anna, dorsett golden, tropic sweet, eine sheimer
Plums, chickasaw, guthrie and odom, gulf series
Native black cherry
Mulberries, common figs, che
Asian and american persimmons
Rabbiteye blueberries, southern highbush blueberries
Mysore raspberry, most blackberries
Peaches, florida king/prince, tropic series, Sam Houston
Avocadoes del Rio, gainesville, opal, lila, mexicola grande
Pecan, dunstan chestnut
Feijoa
Orinoco, ice cream banana
Kumquats, loquats, calamondin, Satsuma mandarin, dancy tangerine
Ugni
Green tea, yaupon holly for caffeine
Paw paw
Pomegranate, hardy kiwi, fuzzy kiwi vincent and tomuri
Jelly palm
Koroneiki and arbequina olives
And more

Marginal without protection, will require protection for the random arctic blast, most years would be fine with maybe slight damage to mature trees
Lychee, longan, jaboticaba, macadamia, pineapple, surinam cherry, papaya, ambarella, white sapote, oranges, lemons, cattley guava, passionfruit, mango

However with hardiness zones shifting north, by the time these trees are mature they might not need any protection other than the rare freak cold event. Also, canopy counts for protection. Live oak and cabbage palm canopy can give a few degrees up to 10 degrees of warmer temps on a cold night, depending on whether its radiational or adjective cooling. Kind of a living greenhouse. Even a lone cabbage palm will be warmer directly under the fronds on the south side of the trunk on a radiational cooling night.



Hello Dan, do you live in 9A?

Are these trees that you have planted and had success with yourself?

How do I find these specific varieties....for instance I would love to have the plum tree. You mention chickasaw, guthrie and odom, gulf series, Im guessing these are the varieties that you know work?

I call local nurseries ect and have asked for specific varieties of plants but I have yet  to find a nursery that knows or seems to care what its selling, they seem to have nice plants and they are well established nurseries but they just simply do not know and sometimes seem as if they dont care either way. Any suggestions?

I type Florida native black cherry and I get zero results, can you further identify?

I already have 3 loquats, you say no protection? I believe my property can get down into the mid or low twenties every now and again. Not sure what the loquats will handle, has your experience shown no protection needed for this tree?

You have a list for marginal, Ill save my comments until I understand better your experience with these trees mentioned above. Thanks very much



I do have all the trees with the exception of che, asian persimmon, mysore raspberry, dunstan chestnut, ugni, yaupon holly, jelly palm and koroneiki olive, flordahome pear, einsheimer apple, tropic sweet apple. I have the florida king peach and the sam houston and many seedling peaches. The florida king peach and the chickasw plum had ripe fruit for me in early April, and the two apples flowered but did not fruit yet. I am not in 9a, my property is at the border of 10a much farther south than Brandon but about 40 miles inland. I also have many more like coffee, jackfruit, sapodilla, mamey, sugar apple, acerola, grumichama, lilly pilly, cherry of the rio grande, coconut etc. Loquats are not tropical they can handle down to the low teens. The guthrie and odom are selected varieties of chikasaw plums that pollinate with each other. Mail order natives carries them. The dunstan chestnut you can get from chestnut Hill tree farm, and the olives can be purchased from A natural farm in howey in the hills. The native black cherry is prunus serotina and grows down through Central Florida in hammocks. The chikasaw plum grows native all the way down the ridge. I have a similar project going on but in a remote, wild area, same beach sand soil, but more like the edge of the everglades than high and dry. A good source for low temp tolerance of fruit trees in florida is growables.com.


Thanks, yes Im alot farther north, my home is in Brandon 9B, I working on establishing tree in 9A which is 2 hrs north of Brandon. I unfortunately prob will never be able to have a mango, almost surely papaya or jackfruit where my property is.

The papaya and jackfruit wont even make it the winter here in 9B if it gets the least bit of freeze.  
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