Seeding a back yard with a west slope

I could use some input.

Ever since I moved into my current home almost 18 years ago I struggled with getting a lawn in.  The front yard, out in the East of the house wasn’t too bad but we had a couple of drought years that really took the oomph out of the early grass seed.  I eventually got the front yard looking pretty good, but the backyard is different.  The backyard has a pretty steep slope away towards the west, absolutely baking the backyard in afternoon heat.  Worse, the edge of the yard is bordered by tall, mature oaks and hickories that cast shade which should be a good thing for the heat but leave an insufficient amount of light for heat tolerant grass seed and too much heat for shade grass.

As if this were not enough, I live in the transition zone.  A little further north and bluegrass would rule.  Further south and other, southern grasses dominate.  Tall fescue is the predominate grass in lawns around here (and due to circumstances, I am going to need grass), but really that is a northern grass.

I do have some areas of decent grass with large spots (20’ diameter) of mostly broadleaves.  Earlier this spring during our wet season I hammered those spots with a combination of a local turf grass fescue mix and ryegrass and when I mowed this morning (1 month since spreading) I was pleased to see that fine grass blades were growing in nicely.  I know it will be important to keep this ground moist over summer but the broadleaf should act as a nurse crop.

With all that said, I am thinking of reseeding this fall with a heat tolerant bluegrass seed.  I can buy 50lbs for $200 and I might use this for a couple of years as I reconstitute the backyard.  I want a bluegrass for its ability to fill in bare spots—my backyard was at one point looking ok but then got spotty, then got large areas that were pretty rough looking.

Alternatively, I have heard good things about fescues that can spread by rhizomes, but I know less about these.  Heck, I would even be willing to mix the two.

But this all circles back to the backyard heat, western orientation and relatively little light.  The combination of high heat, low light and water that wants to simply run down the surface has vexed me in the past, but maybe using existing “weeds” as a cover crop will work for me.

So what do you all think?  I am totally up to suggestions.  Fire away!

Eric

I'm not knowledgeable about growing grass in your climate, but you seem to be nibbling at grasses that we grow here. So I'm going to state what I know.
Both fescues and Kentucky Bluegrass spread by rhizomes. Both will also cause "Red Dust" and "Red Thread" both fungal problems which you may not have a problem with if you don't have enough moisture in your lawn. But keeping the amounts of both of them low will prevent that. In this area we plant with about 70% perennial ryegrass which will prevent the fungal problems from showing. Also both the fescues and the Kentucky Bluegrass will require "dethatching". With a high ratio of perennial ryegrass that problem is also eliminated.

Some of the fescues will tolerate less sunlight, but since they aren't drought tolerant won't grow under massive trees. But a sprinkler system would eliminate that problem.

Fescues go to seed at a height lower than the 3" I cut at. Perennial Ryegrass seeds at about a foot; so the fescues will spread very well by seeds. I don't know what height the bluegrass seeds at.

When I seed grass I use a mix called Pennington Penn State mix, all of the grasses stay green all winter. My lawn also has some weeds in it. There's a lot of white clover, some dandelions, bent grass and even wild strawberries. And a wide range of other weeds. The result is that the lawn stays green all year. In the summer the bentgrass shows up as the predominate item in the lawn and is the reason it stays green all summer, even the areas that never get watered. I can buy bentgrass and tried it once, but it didn't germinate.

To summarize prepare the ground by raking. Possibly dragging a rake behind a riding mower, slowly so the rake doesn't bounce. Then apply the seed. I'd recommend 10 pounds per 1000 sq ft. I sow it by hand out of a big plastic bag. I cover newly sown grass with mushroom compost about an inch thick. This will help keep the seed from drying out, and will act as a semi permanent soil amendment. Don't seed after applying a weed preventer, at least 90 days.

If you want a nice lawn you're going to have to water. In this part of the country we don't have a water shortage. I have a well, 160 feet deep. Been here 17 years and it never went dry. Except for evaporation the water I apply to the lawn and the gardens goes back into the ground, so none is used. Agreed that some evaporates and the plants use a lot. What the plants use is what their requirements are. So it's a choice of supplying those needs or not having the plants. I'm saying this knowing that you have different water problems and apologize if I'm too blunt.

John, that’s very helpful, even if to confirm much of what I already knew.  I have put in lawns before, always during a drought year the 1st two years!  The slope is troublesome as it strangely gets too much shade and the sun it gets is too hot on ground that has long since shed it’s water.  Frustrating.  I forgot to mention that the soil is hard clay—good for holding moisture that sinks in but not so good for absorbing moisture in the first place, especially in quick, afternoon downpours that are common in summers.

A few years ago I experimented with spreading creeping red fescue, a fine, spreading grass that does well in shade and low moisture environments.  Today I do have some nice patches of creeping red fescue that are slowly forming a nice carpet under some of the shadier areas.

But in general I agree with you and I thank you for your advice.

Eric

Could you keyline plow the slope? Especially near the top, to capture/slow the runoff so that it could absorb?
Or maybe trench out some clay on contour and replace with a sandier soil? Like a swale, but filled back in even with the original grade.
Both might be unnoticeable, just looking, it would appear "flat", but water would "see" a different reality.

I don't have Mark Shepard's new book "Water for Every Farm" but maybe that's got something useful? "Restoration Agriculture" has a section on keyline design.

Kenneth,

That’s not a bad idea if I were doing this for the first time.  Somehow I don’t think my wife would like me keyline plowing the backyard, but as I am approaching this as part of a longer term project, I am not certain that the keyline plow would work, though I like your lateral thinking.

As it is , the backyard is a rough rectangle that runs approximately north-south while sloping west, particularly at the southernmost side.  I the past I have tried to tackle the whole backyard only to fail at the whole project,  this time I am taking bite-sized pieces, hoping to restore highly degraded parts this year, then move on to other , less-degraded areas next year.

I am also tinkering with a more “Permie” approach to yard improvement.  For starters, long-gone are the days of spraying ’cides to make way for grass—a technique that was not only dangerous but also counterproductive.  This time around I am deliberately leaving existing vegetation in place—it all appears to be broadleaf weeds anyway.  I am going to let those weeds act as a nurse crop and hold the seed in place and shade the ground from beating sunlight that dries out the surface of the ground.

I know how important it is for fine grass seed to stay watered early on, and my conclusion is that is because just after germination, the fine roots dry out easily before drilling themselves into earth looking for a better supply of moisture.  Regular, daily watering does keep the grass alive but at a cost—the roots don’t root deeply, at least not for some time.  The young grass gets sorta addicted to watering.  By using the existing “weeds” I hope to nurse the little seeds along and encourage their roots to grow deep.  My grass crop is looking good so far and the surface has stayed moist.  Hopefully the roots will grow deep before the clay dries out, but fortunately more rain is in the forecast,

Ultimately I hope to bring the broadleaf weeds under control simply by mowing and that will be a gradual process.  Also, I am HOPING that a heat tolerant bluegrass will thicken up the lawn, add more soft, finer grass blades and eventually choke out the weeds.  I did use a heat tolerant bluegrass mixed in with fescue for some sections of my front yard and it is looking pretty good.  I am hoping to achieve similar results in the back.

And again, as I stated before, I am tackling chunks—going after the worst patches this year and hoping to move on to other sections next year.  I did a spring sowing when fall seeding is generally recommended, but I get so little time in fall that I decided to just do it!  However, the bluegrass will go in this fall.

So there is my extremely long-winded response.  I am totally up to suggestions and I appreciate everything one, even if I can’t use it.

Thoughts and/or comments are always welcome.

Eric

Sounds like your clay needs amending. You might consider aerating the lawn areas. Front and back. There are aerators that the golf industry uses that will drill 8-10 inches deep. The tow behind a riding mower models only pull a plug about 2 inches if you have enough weight on it. The golf industry models drive a rod and don't pull a plug. Then if you apply an inch of mushroom compost, MC, some of that will go deep into the clay. Help with getting more of the surface water to go into the soil instead of running off. From my experience the grass will grow thru the MC, new or existing grasses. But I don't have the experience with your water shortages. so I don't know how much vigorous growth is required to get the grass to grow thru the MC

John,

I wish I had all this advice and input when I first put the yard in back in 2005.  Not only was the ground clay, but having just freshly been disked after being torn up from construction, the ground just had no structure to it.  Making matters worse, the ground that made up my yard was a far cry from being topsoil.  Instead it was all the excavated ground from the basement foundation making fertility pretty minimal.

Today is a different matter.  Though still clay, the ground at least has had years worth of plant roots growing in it, slowly but surely turning the ground to topsoil.  The grass and broadleaf (but essentially the finer grass) do a good job of stopping/slowing water downhill and the roots help water infiltration.  I guess that growing grass on a slope is just a patience-challenging experience.  And the intense heat of a Western facing slope is that much worse.  At this stage I am lucky that spring rains have been consistent throughout germination, I just hope the ground stays moist as the heat comes, which should hit this week.

John, thanks for the input, I may try a compost tea spray to see if that helps the newly seeded grass and/or ground.

Eric

Hi, Eric

I have a suggestion that might work for your slope.

I put in a half-acre of lawn using this method.

Take the existing grass that you have that makes runners or I feel rhizomes might also work. Put them in a container of water to root.

It will take them several days to get roots so on the weekend or when you have some spare time, find a blank spot that needs some grass and plant the runners or rhizomes that have roots.

This way you don't have to buy seeds or worry that the seeds will get washed away.

Happy planting.