High calcium lime source in NY

Anyone out there know where to get high calcium lime in upstate NY? Everywhere I look only seems to have dolomite. My soil has enough magnesium. I've tried crushing oyster shell sold for chickens but it didn't work out the way I wanted. Thanks!

Hi Dave, Welcome to Permies! I've added your thread to our Eastern US forum; maybe we can get some more local advice that way?
I'm assuming your soil is testing acidic pH? My soil is very acidic too - thin silty layer over basalt rock. I'm hoping to improve it by improving drainage and increasing biomass to encourage better soil organisms, since I have read that the right micro-organisms can help the plants absorb nutrients whatever the pH. I'd rather not buy in stuff if I can help it. Where I am, the transport costs of heavy additives make them more expensive too. I'm keeping bones and wood ash from our fire to selectively add to try and raise the pH, but I'm not really worrying about it too much. The other thing I'm doing is starting to create Landraces for some of my crops to make locally adapted strains that do better in my soil - early days yet though.

@Nancy Reading Cool. Thanks for the thread move. I'm on very silty soil as well with a CEC of 5 and pH of 5. The soil is well aggregated and has 8% organic matter which seems good but most everything I plant struggles (trees, perennials, and annual vegetables). The existing vegetation is mostly golden rod. For a number of years now I've tried let nature figure things out and relied on heavy wood chip mulch to breakdown and feed the soil. Over the past year I've decided to learn much more about soil and am trying multiple experiments.

I'm looking for lime to add calcium following strategies from the mineral balancing folks. In that realm they talk more about having the proper ratios of minerals and when minerals are balanced pH will be in the proper range. The dolomite lime everyone sells around me is too high in magnesium.

Several decades ago I lived in New Jersey where the soil was acidic and low in calcium. Because I had access to the ocean, I collected shells after a big storm. But that idea won’t help you out. But the my other source might. I also used waste bones. Gradually people in my area came to know that I used bones, so I slowly got on people’s list of how to get rid of waste bones. I got small amounts from hunters in the fall, but year around I had a small local slaughter house call me once or twice a week for pick up. We still had a small, independent  local butcher back then and he was a good source of bones each week, as was a local restaurant. I provided trashcans to put the bones into and picked up on an on-call basis.

I added the bones to a fire to burn them. When cool, they were easier to smash into small chunks. Depending on the bone, I could crush them using just my hands. By the way, I also burned the shells in order to make them easier to break up with a hammer. As I processed greater volumes of burnt bone, I placed them into a heavy duty bag and ran them over with my truck.

Right now, I use coral and bone. The bones I get by gathering them up out of the cattle pastures. When a cow dies on the big ranches here, the body is just left for the flies to process it. Takes 5 to 7 days. All that is left is the dried hide and bones. And after a couple weeks even the hide is gone due to insects. Then I come along and gather up the bones.

Hope these ideas help.

Both egg shells and oyster shells will add calcium. These will add both calcium and Magnesium (Mg).

Gypsum is calcium sulfate and is a good source of calcium for plants. Using Gypsum is a safe option.

Have you tried looking at places like Tractor Supply?

Other options are garden supply stores, and local feed, and seed stores.

As Anne mentioned, check other outlets.  Farm suppliers often will sell retail in addition to commercial farms. They don’t advertise that fact since small retail sales , and the questions from those types of buyers, are a nuisance to them. But they often will do those retail sales if approached. Try checking out places like Asgrow, Agway, and other farm suppliers.

@ Su Ba

Thanks for the ideas. I didn't consider using bones. I've tried purchased oyster shell (meant for chickens) but the chunks are too large. I can still see them in the soil a year later. I'm not sure what I thought would happen but clearly I need a finer grind so the microbes can get to work on it.  Your method of burning to make these amendments able to be crushed seems like a great idea. I'm wondering though if that would create a hydrated lime like result with the shells?

@Anne Miller

I've tried every possible store and all they have is dolomite. I can get oyster shell for chickens at tractor supply but they are really large chunks. I even attempted to make chain mill out of an angle grinder (diy gold prospector style) but I burnt out the motor and it didn't really work. I've also heard (somewhere I can't remember) that oyster shell doesn't break down in soil the way limestone does. Also, for the amount of calcium I'm looking to add, I'm worried that gypsum would add too much sulfur. I tried researching what the upper limits of sulfur could be in a balanced soil but wasn't able to find anything.

@ everyone
For a little more background, I'm trying to be as scientific as I can about learning the least involved ways of improving my soil. I've wasted a lot of time over the last decade doing random things I hear about and haven't set myself up to receive feedback of what worked or didn't. I'm looking to develop a program for new planting areas that could employ some preliminary mineral balancing (as per "The Ideal Soil" by Michael Astera). The mineral balancing is just one area I'm experimenting with. As far as what I grow, I have a 1/4 acre market garden with a deep compost mulch system, and multiple fruit and nut, trees and shrubs planted in various ways (hazel hedges, chestnuts on swales, mixed fruit patches). I spend way too much time taking care of struggling trees so I decided I'm not planting another tree until I feel satisfied I can build quality the soil.

Dave, when I hear gardeners tell me that their plants look to be struggling (assuming it’s a plant that should be growing in that spot),  I suggest three initial steps….
1- do a complete soil test. Yes, they are pricy compared to a simple pH, N, P, K test, but they are worth it in the long run.
2- make decent compost, lots of it. Apply and re-apply. Compost, compost, compost can fix many problems of not thriving plants. One application won’t do it. Using myself as an example, I apply compost at least every 3-4 months, normally between crops. On some crops I use the compost like a mulch. With others, it gets turned or scratched in so that it mixes with the top 2" to 6" of soil (depth depends upon the crop). On pick and come again crops, I apply liquid compost tea after each harvesting. I do this with my leaf lettuce and Asian greens harvesting. Thus they get a weak compost tea every week. When the plants are spent, I till compost into the soil before I reseed or replant.
3- check your soil for ideal water moisture content. Too wet or too dry will result in non-thriving plants.

There are many other things one could check, but those 3 are the main things I’d look at.

When I lived in the east coast, pulverized lime was readily available. I can get it here in Hawaii with no problem too. I use the finely pulverized form when I need quick corrections. I can get quicker results using a foliar spray form of calcium. For maintenance I use a granular form when I don’t have enough homemade chunky calcium sources. By the way, chunky is ok in my experience. The microbes can do their thing with the chunks. Chunks make for longer lasting, slower action, but the plants still benefit. I would not expect to see the chunks disappear quickly, in fact I would be concerned if they did. I’d like to think my soil was neutral enough for those chunks to last years. I purposely don’t pulverize my  homemade calcium sources.

Because I live downwind from an active volcano, I have to deal with acid rain and acidic volcanic dust. Thus I need keep an eye in my soil pH…….thus I need to use wood ashes and calcium sources to buffer the acidity.

You can buy this online at tractor supply:

https://www.tractorsupply.com/tsc/product/espoma-garden-lime-6-3-4-lb?cm_vc=-10005

Some threads for you or others:

https://permies.com/t/114649/Acidic-soil

https://permies.com/t/23173/lime-correct-pH

If you strike out on a reasonably priced garden / agriculture source might look for athletic field marker. Cheap and very unlikely to be dolomitic, since magnesium carbonate is more expensive than calcium carbonate. Look for something like "Promotes green growth" on the label. Work in the industry and shocking how many different products for various industries all come out of the same hole in the ground.  

@ Su Ba Thanks for the suggestions. Foliar feeding has saved my market garden this year actually. I do use a boatload of compost (60 yards in the past 3 years on a 1/4 acre) and it's essential for my garden and the only thing that seems to work for me. I'm hoping that my experiments will show me a way I can use compost more as a microbial innoculant than a growing media and nutrient supply. Essentially I want to grow more acreage and not have to rely on such heavy inputs.

@Anne Miller I was excited when I saw that Espoma lime until I realized it was dolomite. Fooled again!

@William Bagwell Excellent tip on the field marker. I didn't even know such a thing existed. I'm looking into it.

If I were in your situation I would do one of two things.

Buy what is available or make my own from what I have available, which would be egg shells or good old caliche dirt.