Current numbers for wofati?

Is there a thread that gives real-world number for a wofati?  I'm looking for things like "the lowest temperature occurred on xxxx (date) and it was X", "average temperature year round was X, with highest temp being x and lowest being x" or something to that effect.

Do these numbers exist in some form yet?

real-world number

This is not a clear question, can you explain it better?

Trace said, "Do these numbers exist in some form yet?

I really doubt that there is such a thing.

To me, it would be hard to estimate how many wofati's that have been built.

And even harder to estimate what the temperatures are.

I would believe what I read as a general assumption because there could be lots of variables due to where the wofati was built, how deep down it was dug, how thick the dirt is on the top, etc.

This is a great question, I just don't think there is an answer.

I am looking forward to hearing some other answers as I could be wrong.

Anne Miller wrote:

Trace said, "Do these numbers exist in some form yet?

I really doubt that there is such a thing.

To me, it would be hard to estimate how many wofati's that have been built.

And even harder to estimate what the temperatures are.

I would believe what I read as a general assumption because there could be lots of variables due to where the wofati was built, how deep down it was dug, how thick the dirt is on the top, etc.

This is a great question, I just don't think there is an answer.

I am looking forward to hearing some other answers as I could be wrong.

Fully agree Anne, I was just hoping someone at Paul's place would be tracking this.  It would be much easier to persuade people to try it if someone could say "We built the first wofati in xxxx.  The first year temperatures were xxx, subsequent years the numbers were xxx, xxx", etc.  I remember reading that the first winter in the wofati was pretty cold, and I expect they get better each year as the surrounding earth gets "charged" for lack of a better term.  I'm fascinated by underground structures since reading Mike's book way back when.  I could justify (to myself) taking time to a wofati if I knew they work as hoped.

This:
https://permies.com/t/142933/permaculture-projects/Greenhouse-Kickstarter-Data-Collection-Stretch

What I find truly amazing is this:

Wofati is a type of natural earth-sheltered building developed by Mike Oehler and expanded upon by Paul Wheaton. Wheaton coined the acronym, which means Woodland Oehler Freaky-cheap Annualized Thermal Inertia. "Woodland" because it is the optimal location for such a building; "Oehler" after the pioneer, "Freaky-cheap," due to the Fairly-cost effective or frugal materials; and Annualized Thermal Inertia from a book by John Hait called "Passive Annual Heat Storage" which inspired much of the reasoning behind the Wofati design.

https://www.appropedia.org/Wofati_eco_building

Here are some links folks might find interesting:

https://paulwheaton12.wordpress.com/2014/11/20/wofati/

https://richsoil.com/wofati.jsp

Some evidence might be found here:

Do you have any temperature logs from the November until now?

Yes, we have been carefully gathering all of that data to make "part 3" of the greenhouse movie.

https://permies.com/t/180/141902/permaculture-projects/wofati-greenhouse-design#1381826

https://permies.com/t/169882/permaculture-projects/Winter-ATI-test-Allerton-Abbey

John C Daley wrote:

real-world number

This is not a clear question, can you explain it better?

Sure.  The actual temperatures, not an estimate of numbers people think they can achieve.  For instance, in Dec 2021, the lowest recorded temperature inside the wofati was x.  In Aug, the highest recorded temperature was Y.  Yearly average was Z.

Anne Miller wrote:

https://permies.com/t/169882/permaculture-projects/Winter-ATI-test-Allerton-Abbey

This is exactly what I was looking for.  Thank you!

I am glad that one was what you were looking for.  

I am sure that I had read the whole thread at some point in time.  

I just didn't remember that it had what you were looking for.

The numbers are about what I would expect, and what Mike was getting in Idaho, and while different in design, what I am getting here in my home in New England.

It seems the temperature swings are stable inside the home, but it temperates out to constant ground temperature which where I live is 57 degrees. That is a very good thing as it takes so little heat to go from 57 degrees to 70 degrees versus other house designs, This is what Mike noted as well...

It's all good, except some supplemental heat is needed. I think that has to do with the very narrow window in which a human is comfortable. Not only is it something like 66 to 70 degrees, but the relative humidity also has to match as well, or a human does not feel comfortable either. The upper limit seems to be the issue; it would take so much heat to rise the thermal mass to achieve a constant temperature of 66-70 degrees in the winter, that it would be unbearable for living to get to that temperature.

But that just means if the space is unable to be lived in at such elevated temperatures, then achieving those temps elsewhere and imparting it to the buildings mass would be needed. That could be as simple as a solar set-up just away from the building, heating up a stone floor. Or wind heat heating up the same floor.

I put 400 tons of rock under my house for thermal mass, and I was able to achieve above 44 degrees or more, unlived in and unheated in New England all one winter. That 44 degrees (f) was registered when it was also -7 degrees below zero (F) in January. Not comfortable enough to live in, but a very small heat differential to overcome.

No dout about it; these are very efficient buildings.