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bear spray

 
paul wheaton
master steward
Posts: 20842
Location: missoula, montana (zone 4)
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We saw two bears yesterday. I've encountered a lot of bears out in the woods. All black bears. And they run away. So my view is of bear butts.

I'm told that there could be grizzlies here. Which always reminds me of this sign:



Last night my brother and his family stayed the night on TL. Apparently they looked around this morning and reported back that a bear had ripped up the tipi trying to get in. I went up to have a look. There was some mud on the side and a hole in the tipi about a quarter of inch long. I was thinking it could have been done by a dog. Either way, Tim and his wife were both packing guns - just to be safe.

I looked into it this morning and found that there is some debate about which is more effective: guns or bear spray. The arguments seem to slightly favor bear spray.

I thought "I better get several so that when folks visit the land they can feel safe". And then I saw that they were $38.42 each! And they were each good for one good spray. So I bought one for me and one for jocelyn and thought: other folks might wanna get their own.



Buy at amazon and I get a kickback
 
Renate Howard
pollinator
Posts: 755
Location: zone 6b
9
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Maybe get some pack goats. Load them up with lots of heavy bells. If the bells don't scare away the bears, they'll weigh the goats down enough that you can run faster than them. It's the slowest one that has the most to lose, right?

Just kidding! Hope you never have any bear-problems! We had *something* rip the wire off of our rabbit tractor and kill the rabbit. It was chicken wire held on with fencing staples, pretty sturdy. At the time I thought, "Wow, I didn't know coyotes were that strong" but my neighbor said there's a black bear that has a den behind her home.

I've heard putting pee on the perimeter will keep bears away. If you use some sort of composting toilet that catches it in a bucket you can just put "deposits" around the area.
 
kadence blevins
Posts: 597
Location: SE Ohio
32
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hahahahaha @ the sign!!! too funny.

are there laws about killing bears up there? I hadn't thought about it as we don't really have any here. but I know here its illegal to kill bears no matter what. although if one came at me I wouldn't think twice about shootin at it and I don't think anyone else would if put in the situation.

I don't like guns myself other then goin out to get a deer, etc but i'd be sure to be armed with something for certain!!!

Maybe get some pack goats. Load them up with lots of heavy bells. If the bells don't scare away the bears, they'll weigh the goats down enough that you can run faster than them.


you must not have ever seen a goat run then because you have to be a seriously good runner to outrun any goat I've seen. only way I catch the loose ones is outsmarting them and that aint nothing like runnin from a bear.
(though on a side note my milk goats are both trained to pack, though they're out of practice right now. I have two full pack sets though)

We had *something* rip the wire off of our rabbit tractor and kill the rabbit. It was chicken wire held on with fencing staples, pretty sturdy.


not to stray from the thread topic but I've seen dogs rip up chicken wire, no problem at all. but a bear i'd think would just as soon pull it off like a lid.
 
Rick Roman
pollinator
Posts: 442
Location: Pennsylvania Pocono Mt Neutral-Acidic Elv1024ft AYR41in Zone 5b
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Project Grizzly - Crazy, Fun and Informative Documentary - http://www.nfb.ca/film/project_grizzly/

In this feature-length documentary, Troy James Hurtubise goes face to face with Canada's most deadly land mammal, the grizzly bear. Troy is the creator of what he hopes is a grizzly-proof suit, and he repeatedly tests his armour – and courage – in stunts that are both hair-raising and hilarious. Directed by Peter Lynch, the film has become a cult classic in the United States and is rumoured to be a favourite of director Quentin Tarantino.
 
Judith Browning
Posts: 5655
Location: Arkansas Ozarks zone 7 alluvial,black,deep loam/clay with few rocks, wonderful creek bottom!
304
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The black bear poop we just found on our land contained a lot of fur that might have been mistaken for squirrel fur (as the sign above says) if not for the tooth and hoof of a fawn there also. We discovered the poop after finding a two hundred pound rock lifted and swiveled to the side (for grubs we assume) on the path we walk every day. We think, probably a juvenile male heading out in a straight line for new territory.
We rarely get to see the actual bear.
 
Mary James
Posts: 145
Location: NW MT Zones 4/5 Rollins Mt
4
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You know I have never owned bear spray. Guns yes wild life scare shot is great, basically sounds like a bottle rocket.Salt shells, Rubber slugs I have used on griz before.Fish and game supplied coloured paint shot as well.Three shades to mark the blacks so we would know how often they were coming in.Some days we would have more then 8 visits from blacks.

I lived and hiked in the Mission Mountains in heavy grizzly and pain in the rear black bear territory for over 30 years.My boys grew up running the creek bottom with the bear and yes they slept outside and never got snacked on..Awe yes and the husband had been a game warden and trapped hundreds of bears.

You learn to live with them in the surroundings.Once one learns how to handle their garbage and foods it gets easier.Our kids learned this one year when they left some crackers in the tee pee when we ran to town..Came home to find the teepee wall ripped open.They never left food in their sleeping areas outside again. Awe and this was at our house which is on a creek that is considered the most travelled grizzly bear trail in the mission mountains as it leads down to the Kicking Horse and Ninepipes feeding areas.

Grizzlies stink, I mean really stink, you guys think your bone sauce smells bad,, You can smell them before you see them in brushy areas.In our years of living in their natural areas our family only had a few run ins with the griz,one a large male after a snack food baby bear that tried to hide on our back staircase.The niece ran over a cub being chased by a big male on the road in the fall. The other the usual after garbage during the fall feeding frenzy.Awe fall feeding frenzy key words here this is when the bears are aggressive.The neighbour had one trying to get into their home they put up a prison fence and electric barb wire .Griz males will kill females and cubs during this time as well oh and they have no problem stealing deer as my son found out after shooting one for dry meat or taking out people (hunters in the post creek area).Singing works much better then bells,,LOL the more off key the better.The surprise factor is what makes them more aggressive.
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You will come to find black bears are a huge pain in the rear once they find food or garbage.I found some of them far more aggressive then the griz.Best thing to do right off is build a nice well anchored large container to store garbage if your not going to be able to haul it off daily.oh yea make sure the door is a good one as well.The kids tried to use their porch a few years ago and ended up with a black bear stuck in there after pushing the screen door inside making it non open-able.Yea yea they have those fancy smaancy bear proof garbage cans hahaha unless they are enclosed in an electric fence you will find yourself wondering around the area searching the damn things down since they will drag them off. They also will occasionally steal a barbecue small table top ones not cleaned they love..But hey we once had a large male take one of the big grills down a steep embankment.Hanging meat in trees is always a gamble as well..They love brain hide tanning stench and will steal the entire stretched hide in frame work.Open doors or windows in the house they will walk in especially when cooking stinkin menudo.Outside canning same thing..The kids have a door frame that has been ripped by a bear trying to get into their house.
Then we move into other areas, Say composting,we used the bears to turn ours, if they were going to be in it they may as well flip it. Bone sauce is not a deterrent for bears as they love most bad smelling things you may want to test it and make sure it will not draw them in..Bone meal and blood meal used as a fertilizer may be dug up and the soil licked or ate that has the smells.Ummm bio-dynamic fertilizers will be tipped over bathed in and drank..Fish fertilizer is a tasty snack treat they just bite open the bottles and rip the seedlings apart looking for the smell.Out in the gardens mulch that gives off any stink like grass, straw etc as it breaks down another thing they will dig in.Animal feeds, and animals, we lost 7 chickens to 2 bears last year up here on the lake.Fish ponds are an open bathing area that provides snack food, pending on the liner if you have a visit you may need to watch for repairs, and yes this includes clay based..They are scavengers anything that smells will bring them in...I guess you get the point...
Some things that can help the human pee supposedly helps by marking out ones territory,Never saw results even though I had every man and boy at the house doing it...Around camps and such you can string lines with cans or big bells what ever that makes noises, it will work the first couple of times.Like deer they get used to noises and smells very quickly.I found that the wildlife scare shot was my favourite thing or fireworks, they did not like firecrackers tossed into water buckets nor the bottle rockets..Once you have your garbage situation figured out, food stores , the kitchen and animal feeds you really should be fine..The best thing really is like the deer get a nice big old Newfoundland or a nasty mean donkey, to take care of the perimeter..We had miniature weenie dogs that would tree bears and mountain lions just as well as the big hounds did.The bears would still show up with the dogs but would not hang around as long doing damage..Awe and a side note bear that has been eating garbage taste like garbage...


 
R Scott
Posts: 3316
Location: Kansas Zone 6a
32
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If you are going to buy it, CARRY IT!!! ALWAYS, EVERYDAY, EVERYWHERE, NO MATTER WHAT. If you are going skinny dipping, still wear it. Seriously. NEVER outside of arm's length. Tobasco or lead, you have to have it when you need it and the bear decides when you need it.

Don't let them become nuisances or accustomed to you. Electric fence is GOOD. They really don't like it and even if they do break it, it is easy to repair. Put hot wire up on all the buildings, too. Keeps them from poking their noses in windows or doors or using the porch post as a scratching post.
 
2017 Permaculture Design Course at Wheaton Labs
http://richsoil.com/pdc
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