or just make your own gold

The funny thing is that if some did figure out how to convert cheap materials into gold, gold would soon be valued at the price of the cheap materials and the cost of conversion. Gold only has its value due to scarcity, remove scarcity, remove the value.

Nah, gold is a great industrial metal, and there are so many places where if used, it would extend the life of almost everything from switches and contacts, to medical delivery systems.
Under an electron microscope, a thin layer actually flex's, it moves from up to down in the lattice, ensuring that contaminants won't bond to it.
Fabulous for heat reflection, mirrors, and other coatings too.
The value would change, but the inherent uses of it guarantee that it will still be valued.

Now, iridium , platinum, and palladium. They would drop significantly. But, again, the intrinsic value would be so high, that it would offset production.

Iridium is used for rocket nozzles, and will make almost wear-out proof bearings. Cheap platinum makes Ecat and Brillouin energy even more efficent. Pallidium is a spectacular catalyst for almost every chemical reaction, and would reduce waste products in almost every chemical manufacturing stream.

Indium can store sunlight directly as electricity. No solar panels and no other battery design required. ( tho using graphene/water batteries in parallel with them will give you supercapacitor charging capability).
Silver is the best at heat sink transfer, (tho graphene can now do it to an exterior surface, tunneling heat thru the quantum foam) and is also helpful as a surface biological contaminant coating.
Copper is even better at public health protection, and i can see every doorknob and handrail made of brass and silver.

The only people it will really effect is dictators, hoarders, and folks that have ransacked nations currencies , and are using it as stored wealth. Not people who are actually spending money, instead of folks who are living off of the interest.

The actual basis for money will become energy production. Those who use their homebuilt converters to make energy storage and energy production eqpt, will actually be "making" money.

A guy came up with the idea of the Kilowatt Dollar, but the future will belong to the Joule....

I should have been more clear, it would have removed the inflated value, not all value.

The funny thing with gold was at first the Incas were puzzled by the Spaniards why they were so excited by gold. After all, both the Incas and Mayans didn't use gold for money (they used a system of barter), like for the Spaniards.

I rather doubt that energy would become the basis for money, since it is so variable. No doubt it will become more expensive as time goes on, and will be traded - but as a currency, doubtful. That is because a scientific discovery could destroy all your wealth, pretty much, over night. Also, going to be hard to store it. Of course, it might deal with pickpockets (I jest).

Might be interesting to think what would make a good basis for money, besides [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fiat_money]fiat. Anything with a static supply doesn't increase with population (i.e. imagine trying to give gold to everyone in the world, instead of money, since the world's population was around 370 million back in 1350, and has been expanding ever since.

Unit of work is a challenge, because that keeps changing due to technology.

All in all, it is interesting speculation, but only speculation.

I beleive it will be come THE currency too.

each kilowatt hour will have a Bitcoin like serial number, and will be transferred electronically by your smartfone.

Will be tradeable worldwide, and will turn up on your backward feeding electric meter. Once you store up a certain amount on your elec meter, you just sell it to the grid, and get a serial number you can use anywhere.

So if you're off-grid you don't have any money?

Yup.
Do you make your own currency at home now?

You might have to go somewhere else to "work"

It will be electronic form of money, and has to be imprinted with a serial number.

Check out bitcoins

You can still have precious metals, you can even make your own !
trade for stamped coins, and get an app for a scale on your smart fone/wiki reader.
Is still useful for trading between countries now.

Morgan Morrigan wrote:
You might have to go somewhere else to "work"

That makes me sad. I work at home.

Once I get established on my land, I won't have the time to spend on 'making currency'. Most of my time will be devoted to steering my systems towards a point where they can sustainably produce the commodities that I need for day to day use. My needs for currency should diminish as time marches along.

While I don't believe that electricity (or other form of energy) will become a currency in the near future, it could certainly become a good barter item if you have a means of storing excess, and transporting your surplus to your trading partners.

My minimal use of electricity currently (no pun intended) does not warrant the money and effort to try to become independent from the power companies. I have bigger fish to fry. What it would cost me in infrastructure to reach independence far outweigh what I will spend on electric bills in my lifetime. For my heirs, it would be a nice thing, but I feel that future technologies will make it more practical to accomplish this at some future time, not now.

Yes, I do plan to implement systems that will cover my needs during periods of brown-outs/black-outs, but nothing elaborate. My largest concern will be water, not electricity. It is relatively easy to generate electricity. Water is an entirely different matter, and much more vital to all forms of life.

Honestly, I prefer they don't turn energy into coin, after all I have yet to see governments not tax currency. I like that the food I grow in the garden, isn't tax, the animals that I grow for food, are not taxed, even the wood I grow for myself, is not taxed. I get taxed when I buy something - and I would hate to make my own electricity, and pay a tax on it too.

So MM, here is the question. Do you make gold at home? If not, why not?

Govts don't tax currency, they tax transactions.
They dilute currencies, by printing more fiat.
If they had to "create" an energy stream, to justify a new Joule, well that would be producing things, rather than just siphoning off the cream for their contractors.

Utilities get to bill you a fee for running your meter backwards, when you are selling power back to them, for infrastructure costs.

The fact is, if the country actually owns the banks, and gets the interest to use as working capital, there is no need for taxes for anyone that isn't just draining off resources.
Look up local banking, especially the North Dakota system.

You could easily cut ALL the hourly payroll taxes, sales taxes, and small business transaction taxes. You would only have to tax corporate salary's ,earnings and imports. All by the Treasury owning the banks, and using the interest on loans to fund the government. Just get rid of the Fed Reserve, and the corporate banks.
Maybe not if you spend a trillion on a failed jet every decade, but that is a different story.

As for making your own gold, i am working on making humus right now.
It is almost as difficult here in the desert. Is 103 out right now, hasn't rained since Feb, and the last time we had a storm it was nearly a foot of dry snow in april.
Am actually spending money on hand tools, and other prep stuff, just in case it goes Argentina on us.

This thread was originally posted in Farm Income tho...

And i still think it can work. If the Brillioun process works, this should also. It is in the same vertical column of the periodic table, so you should be able to force it with power pulses. I have some copper foil i have been using for snail and bug control. Maybe if i perforated it, and dropped it in some purified water , with some kind of ionic solution to make it conductive, (prob not my calcium hard water) and hook up the Battery Minder Plus to it, we might get something interesting.

Anyone know which reagent we could try ?
I know Aqua Regia is some bad axx stuff. But what are gold salts made of, if gold doesn't oxidize? https://secure.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/wiki/Gold_salts
Interesting the albumin connection. Is albumin avalilble in yeast/beer? (edit) and this controls precipitaion? hmm https://secure.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/wiki/Yeast_nutrient
Guess will have to work with ionic silver and copper foil for now.
Gonna need some .999 silver too.
Next month?

Closer and closer.

Just figure out your feedstock, and add pulsed electricity

http://news.newenergytimes.net/2012/12/06/mitsubishi-reports-toyota-replication/

and the link to the ramble in Alt Energy

https://permies.com/t/19563/energy/Brillouin-Energy-Alchemy-results#164289



just shows the missing nuetrons are going into transmuted elements

http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2012/06/120615104347.htm

Too much fun !!

and my chaotic interpetation of how this all works is over in Alt Energy

https://permies.com/t/19563/energy/Brillouin-Energy-Alchemy-results