Perennial Wheat ???

Hi everyone!

Just joined. Been lurking for a few weeks. I can't stop thinking about permaculture and self-sufficiency. It's simply "the answer."

Anyway, I wanted to share a couple of links I came across. Apparently, perennial wheat exists, but its yields are really low. Perhaps in a few decades, we'll have perennial wheat that produces like modern wheat. Links below:

National Geographic

Discover Magazine

Hi, Ian, and welcome to Permies!

I'm sorry to say I don't know much about perennial wheat, but we have a thread here that's got a lot of discussion of perennial grain in general:

https://permies.com/t/1316/plants/Sepp-Holzer-perennial-grain

Maybe you'll find something of interest there. I hope so!

Thanks!

There was some discussion of Perennial Wheat on the Homegrown Goodness forum some time ago. I think one line was developed by Tim Peters.

Now I see Tim Peters work was mentioned on the link you posted

I merged your stuff with the following thread. I hope that is okay by you.

Hey, i just read about this perennial wheat called Thinopyrum intermedium "intermediate wheatgrass" this is a huge and awesome thing! has anyone ever tried this?

See the Land Institute: https://landinstitute.org/our-work/perennial-crops/

There is a concentrated effort to perennialize wheat in the PNW. Here is some further reading about the attempt.

https://landinstitute.org/wp-content/uploads/2001/10/2001-Perennial-Wheat.pdf
https://magazine.wsu.edu/2009/08/27/full-circle/
http://www.agriculture.com/crops/wheat/production/potential-f-perennial-wheat_145-ar16924
http://smallgrains.wsu.edu/wp-content/uploads/2013/05/Wheat-Production-in-WA-Summary-Report.pdf
http://wsm.wsu.edu/discovery/index.php/tag/perennial-wheat/

Just ran across "Long Root Ale" at my local Brewpub. It was a collaboration between Patagonia and Hopworks done with the Land Institute's Kernza grain. Here is a video about it:

https://vimeo.com/184391007

I was reading about couchgrass and found this passage:

“If one lonely plant settles in a cultivated field it overcomes the field in a very short time and the more you cut it the more it grows. Observing this strong power of survival, Professor Tzitzin, being a young and ambitious scientist, decided to use this characteristic for the betterment of mankind and brilliantly gave new life to wheat by this hybrid omnipotent quality. In countries where agricultural production is critical this improvement deserves attention and consideration. This much-improved academic find adapts to any soil, good or bad; resists sickness and fungus parasites; resists frost, drought and wet periods. It is perennial and very self protected, giving much improved larger and nutritious grain.”

-Alma R Hutchins, Indian Herbology of North America

There is also a mention of Culpepper saying an acre of couch grass is worth ten acres of carrots—food for thought (but not for your stomach!)

I also grow a Mountaineer Perennial Rye. They didn’t make seeds last year—a few have died—but they’re still alive and flowering. It is their fourth year I believe.

Perennial Pantry offers whole grain Kernza. I am going to order a bag to see if it is viable. I mentioned this awhile back, but Perennial Pantry was out of stock.
Rodale started researching perennial wheat several decades ago and I believe that "Kernza" is what was developed with the start of that research.

A not-quite-perennial wheat culture is using the Marc Bonfils method for a heritage long straw variety.  I am hoping to plant a few grains of Banatka wheat into a bed of Ladino clover within the next couple of weeks (but after the summer solstice).  I top seeded the Ladino a few weeks ago to help it fill in a bit better, since I had some winter kill (or, at least, some bare spots in the clover which appeared in the spring).

The Bonfils method is an approach to growing winter wheat.  The wheat is sparsely planted (30-36 inch grid), and produces a lot of vegetative growth and deep root mass over the second half of the (astronomical) summer and into the fall.  It winters over, then comes back with a vengeance in the spring.  The subsequent crop is inter planted with the developing one, but the ground always has a cover crop of nitrogen fixing (and low slung) white clover.  Yields are allegedly very high, once the soil profile is well developed by the addition of the deep root mass.  Harvests of several thousand fold have been reported.

We'll see.

I also have some Sangaste rye with which to experiment, but haven't yet made a rabbit proof enclosure to protect it.  That can also be grown as "St. John's rye" (i.e. planted near the summer solstice, or the Feast of St. John the Baptist).  Supposedly, rye will continue to regrow, as long as it hasn't been allowed to put up seed heads, year after year - grazed off or mown or whatever to continue to build up the soil until such time as a harvest is wanted.

Neither of these is truly perennial, but they are as step in that direction, using existing agricultural technology.  I aim to find out if they'll work for me.

I hear stories of Spanish priest when they first came to California they would sow wheat seeds in natural moist areas. And now there are huge patches of wild wheat growing there every year. Not sure what type that was. It reminded me of that when I read this. Wheat is naturally hardy. This year I didn't plan on growing it, they sprouted up from all the straw I bought lol. You know what I noticed wheat seems to thrive in bundles or clumps of them together. I wonder if that's a grass thing.

I know ancient times they grew corn similar to this.

Seems counterintuitive since farmers always sow em in rows and space them out. The wild bundles I have growing all thorough out are really strong looking. All purely rainfed.

Rad Anthony wrote:I hear stories of Spanish priest when they first came to California they would sow wheat seeds in natural moist areas. And now there are huge patches of wild wheat growing there every year. Not sure what type that was. It reminded me of that when I read this. Wheat is naturally hardy. This year I didn't plan on growing it, they sprouted up from all the straw I bought lol. You know what I noticed wheat seems to thrive in bundles or clumps of them together. I wonder if that's a grass thing.

I know ancient times they grew corn similar to this.

Seems counterintuitive since farmers always sow em in rows and space them out. The wild bundles I have growing all thorough out are really strong looking. All purely rainfed.

I wasn't aware of the Spanish Fathers planting wheat (showing my ignorance, here), but I would presume that this wheat is self-seeding, rather than regrowing each season from the roots, since wheat is typically an annual (what the referenced perennial wheat efforts are trying to breed out - basically make a turf wheat).  Modern wheat (and, really, most any modern cereal grain) has been deliberately bred to not drop the seeds from the seed heads ("shatter" is the technical term for dropping seeds).  As an extreme example, think of teosinte, which readily drops its seeds from the seed heads when ripe, versus corn (maize) which needs a corn sheller of some sort to release the kernels from the cob.  That was a major success in selective breeding!  Especially since teosinte may (and this is far from certain) first have been grown agriculturally to make syrup from the stems (somewhat like sorghum or sugar cane), rather than as a cereal grain.  Some cereals (rye comes to mind) were traditionally harvested a bit before full ripeness, then hung in shocks to dry (or even stoved to hasten the drying) before threshing.  The book "Latvju Seta" (The Latvian Farmstead, more or less - https://www.amazon.com/-/es/Pauls-Kundzins/dp/B0000E7RVI ) has a fair bit of information on grain drying kilns and threshing barns in the Baltic (not that I understand Latvian, but there is a synopsis of each section in the appendix in English, and good pictures in the main text).  Traditionally, rye would have been grown in the cooler and wetter climates of northern Europe, and wheat in the warmer and sunnier south of Europe, the Middle East and North Africa.  But, whatever these priests planted in New Spain may have been an old enough variety of wheat that shatter resistance wasn't fully developed to modern levels, so self seeding is somewhat more successful.  If so, that's an interesting bit of information, and might provide a source of genetic diversity, in any case.  Do you know where these stands of wild wheat grow?

It is my understanding that wheat is self-fertile, so a solitary plant will make seeds.  Some other cereal grasses like rye are not self fertile, and must be planted in a stand or patch to make seeds.  Modern farmers may drill cereals as a matter of expediency, to facilitate mechanized culture, but in times past, grains were typically broadcast sown by hand.  Corn/maize being a notable exception, as you pointed out.

Wow that's interesting I didn't know that. I know einkorn is basically heirloom. I don't much about her characteristics as far as growing.

I don't know the variety I remember reading it in a book. Sorry. They used mustard seeds to mark trails they travel they would see the yellow flowers. I think it was in the Sonoran desert. San diego area. But basically all along the coast in California. Wheat is perfect for the desert monsoon that comes in.

Im guessing maybe it's similar whatever variety was grown at the time in Spain. It was the late 1700s.

My intuition says if you get the plant to seed faster it would want to put out the seeds to reproduce than grow and expand first. I dont know how the heat, light etc. would affect that. Like the whole winter summer wheat thing. I don't know much about.

Kevin Olson wrote:

Rad Anthony wrote:I hear stories of Spanish priest when they first came to California they would sow wheat seeds in natural moist areas. And now there are huge patches of wild wheat growing there every year. Not sure what type that was. It reminded me of that when I read this. Wheat is naturally hardy. This year I didn't plan on growing it, they sprouted up from all the straw I bought lol. You know what I noticed wheat seems to thrive in bundles or clumps of them together. I wonder if that's a grass thing.

I know ancient times they grew corn similar to this.

Seems counterintuitive since farmers always sow em in rows and space them out. The wild bundles I have growing all thorough out are really strong looking. All purely rainfed.

I wasn't aware of the Spanish Fathers planting wheat (showing my ignorance, here), but I would presume that this wheat is self-seeding, rather than regrowing each season from the roots, since wheat is typically an annual (what the referenced perennial wheat efforts are trying to breed out - basically make a turf wheat).  Modern wheat (and, really, most any modern cereal grain) has been deliberately bred to not drop the seeds from the seed heads ("shatter" is the technical term for dropping seeds).  As an extreme example, think of teosinte, which readily drops its seeds from the seed heads when ripe, versus corn (maize) which needs a corn sheller of some sort to release the kernels from the cob.  That was a major success in selective breeding!  Especially since teosinte may (and this is far from certain) first have been grown agriculturally to make syrup from the stems (somewhat like sorghum or sugar cane), rather than as a cereal grain.  Some cereals (rye comes to mind) were traditionally harvested a bit before full ripeness, then hung in shocks to dry (or even stoved to hasten the drying) before threshing.  The book "Latvju Seta" (The Latvian Farmstead, more or less - https://www.amazon.com/-/es/Pauls-Kundzins/dp/B0000E7RVI ) has a fair bit of information on grain drying kilns and threshing barns in the Baltic (not that I understand Latvian, but there is a synopsis of each section in the appendix in English, and good pictures in the main text).  Traditionally, rye would have been grown in the cooler and wetter climates of northern Europe, and wheat in the warmer and sunnier south of Europe, the Middle East and North Africa.  But, whatever these priests planted in New Spain may have been an old enough variety of wheat that shatter resistance wasn't fully developed to modern levels, so self seeding is somewhat more successful.  If so, that's an interesting bit of information, and might provide a source of genetic diversity, in any case.  Do you know where these stands of wild wheat grow?

It is my understanding that wheat is self-fertile, so a solitary plant will make seeds.  Some other cereal grasses like rye are not self fertile, and must be planted in a stand or patch to make seeds.  Modern farmers may drill cereals as a matter of expediency, to facilitate mechanized culture, but in times past, grains were typically broadcast sown by hand.  Corn/maize being a notable exception, as you pointed out.

I did some digging and I found this. Hope this helps identify the variety.

Here's an article about mustard, plants, the misson padres, etc. I grew up in California and had never known (until now) that the mustard that grew wild across the street came with the padres!

https://www.kcbx.org/central-coast-curious/2018-10-12/central-coast-curious-how-did-mustard-invade-our-coastmustard coming to california history

Jennie Little wrote:Here's an article about mustard, plants, the misson padres, etc. I grew up in California and had never known (until now) that the mustard that grew wild across the street came with the padres!

I was struck by the notion that the adobes are each a little time capsule.  I hadn't ever thought about that, I guess - what forensic value there would be in analyzing old adobes microscopically.

Perennial Kernza has been hard to source. I did finally get some today and I'll try a viability test to see if it sprouts. The grains are much smaller than I was expecting. I'd say 1/4 of what hard red wheat is.