discontinuing access for "veterans"

I mostly have everything committed to memory, except maybe all the comments, and i think my focus now will go back to Bill Mollisons videos and mp3s available online, maybe even buy the dvds.

but i did sort of look forward to having that class space as an ongoing resource, oh well, one door closes another opens

I suppose it's good not to hang on too long to apron strings so to speak

truth is ,, until he announced it was ending i hadn't been on the site for some time,, at least most of the access will still be there for 2014 class until april, i wonder if he will take down the forums and all as well., guess we'll find out shortly.

I think the 2013 class was so much of an experiment Geoff didn't even think about it and was just glad it was such a success.

After 2 years (and 2-3k "participants') I suspect they realized how much more of a logistical nightmare it becomes. Never mind the presence of a whole class of "teaching assistants" Geoff didn't hire who maybe are helping and maybe are not. I also saw a decent number of veterans who treated the new year's course as a direct line to Geoff. So in addition to the questions he was trying to field from students of the 2014 class (on topic or not) often he had more advanced or more off topic questions coming from veterans, usually starting with "hey I know this is complicated/off topic/I'm a veteran but Geoff I really need to know how my questions/this issue/the color of my barn impacts my...." and that can be problematic too.

I'm sure Geoff doesn't want anyone to feel ignored especially the new students and even the time it takes to weed through questions and decide which ones to answer takes time away from actually answering the questions and participating with the students.

I tend to agree about limiting the active participation, most of the vets participating were ok i think, but it was a bit distracting, and i don't think Geoff ever directly answered any of my questions, , like you said it has been a big experiment

I would've liked to see us have continued access, especially when he puts up new material, or maybe limited periods of access if servers are getting bogged down, off season so to speak where vets can continue to review or see new information

anyway, it is time to move on, Bills videos are generally more entertaining anyway, did you see the whale story?

Here's a thought, i could sell geoffs dvds and buy Bills"

I bought the Bill and Geoff PDC DVDs years ago. That whale story was a winner for sure, but I love all of Bill's stories.

Those DVDs were actually part of the reason I knew that the online course would work for me. After absorbing everything I could about permaculture free, I bought the 1983 PDC audio (Geoff's first PDC) and my wife bought me the DVD set (which I believe was Geoff's first PDC he ever helped teach) and if I wasn't hooked then I was definitely hook line and sinker after that. I had begun to despair too that I would have to wait a long time before I could find a semi local on-site PDC from someone I trusted and liked so I could get my certificate. When Geoff announced the online PDC that would let me get my cert from Geoff and the PRI without having to take a week off from work I was sold.

Everything else is history

good to hear that confirmation, anybody want to buy a set of geoffs dvds, 300$ i'll set it up as an item on ebay ,, that's the only way i can afford to buy Bills dvds

Hi all old students of Lawton's online PDC

Do you old students have access to the online PDC videos right now? I'm wondering because as he gives an extra bonus every year (first, earthworks, now reading the landscape), it would be nice for old students to be able to see the extra bonus as well.

all the best

greg

Reading the Landscape was the extra class for 2014. Not sure he will have one for 2015. I didn't notice that he advertised one. If you took the class in 2013, you had access to the new class for all of 2014. If you were in the 2014 class, you should have had access to both right away.

I'm kinda bummed that I can't get on the site anymore to interact with all the energy there. However, I get that with 1000+ students it's probably chaos to have the old students in there rambling around.

The 2014 students had access for almost a whole year. I believe Geoff only removed access for them just before launching the 2015 course, so the changes to alumni access would have gone through or appeared pretty much the same whether you were looking at it as a 2013 alumn or a 2014 alumn.

Right now the 2015 course does not include any reference to the Earthworks course or the Reading The Landscape course. I do see where Geoff and team have added links to the geofflawton.com videos within the course, and a few other things you can find out there free on the internet now (like the Greening the Desert videos, and Hope In a Changing Climate). Course material itself is unchanged, though all Q&A videos (including new 2015 responses as they come out) are still being shared.

I hope that helps, let me know if there are specific questions about the current content that I missed.

Interesting thread. I realize we all come at our PDC courses with different levels of prior study, but ...

I almost wish the prior students were still able to ask on-topic questions. I completely understand why they aren't allowed in still. If I'm painfully honest, I feel the 2015 class has a good deal of questions asked that I sort of shake my head at. I just wonder if some folks aren't listening and refuse to do a bit of digging on their own. Here's what I mean ... after climate section of the course, someone might ask, "tell me my climate based on my Lat/Long". I find I'm really skimming very quickly through the questions below each video hoping to find some deeper question and answer. Don't get me wrong, I'm very enthusiastic about the course and feel it's worth the costs, I'm just wishing there was a bit more experienced dialog in the forum/Q&A, which I think the former students would have added. Guess I'm spoiled with the great feedback and dialog I get here.

I'm thankful I am in the course and will have my certificate from a globally recognized source.

I also feel Geoff is investing less time in his Q&A this year. They are still super interesting, but did you listen to the ones about Methods? He said twice "all those questions have already been answered" probably meaning in the comments sections. That's something he did not do (so far) in 2013 or 2014. Actually I'm ok with that, if he considers that questions have been answered in the previous years, because I see all videos, but I don't read all comments. Anyway, as long as he keeps relaxed when answering questions, I'm fine.

By the way, the bonus courses earthworks and reading the landscape are also part of the 2015 course. And we will have access to the online content until December 31 2015.

I also wish old students could come and help people who have super specific questions about their piece of land.

Apart of that, great course! looking forward to learning more about earthworks

I think there is something important there Greg, and I think more folks this year are asking questions first and finishing the chapter (or the previous Q&As) later. When Geoff says "this has already been answered" he doesn't mean in the comments, though there is a lot of answering happening there he means in the course itself or already in the Q&A. I don't think there should be some kind of draconian requirement that a student demonstrate they have "finished" the chapter or something before they ask a question, but it certainly seems to me that the number of people asking questions immediately rather than waiting to see what the course will cover is higher than in previous years. I have lost count of the number of questions which show up and the next comment is from the same user saying "Oops, Geoff totally answered this in the next video".

I'm sure there are plenty of old students willing to answer super specific questions too, but one of the things I've seen over and over again is folks asking the wrong questions and worrying about the wrong things because they're only partway through the course. A whole army of former students answering questions in comments also doesn't change the most important lessons in the course: the super specific problem, or unique issue that "I'm sure you haven't considered" that drive so many of the questions is just false. Start at the beginning, follow the process, learn to trust what you see and leave the baggage behind and everything can be handled using these methods of planning, observation, and design. Getting folks to that point is very hard, and all too many of those "but on MY site" questions followed by a slew of details find their roots in that fallacy.

the reality for me about taking the course was that there were three main reasons to spend that 1000$

to get a well recognized certificate, people know i've had access to one of the great minds of permaculture and a really complete course
to make a general contribution to PRI and the aid work/ teaching being done around the world
to have access to the earthworks parts of the course which are somewhat difficult to find cohesively anywhere else

And now as i go back and listen to more of the free stuff from earlier courses, and other lectures, i'm starting to be able to put together a whole lot more of the permaculture world, origins, more precise meanings, etc.

I can actually start to put things into patterns and some of the mp3s make more sense now that i have been able to visualize the designs in the videos.

I guess truth be told, the Q&As start to become more like hand holding and reassurance (the medium is the message) so even though all the answers have been said a hundred different ways, some people just need reassurance, and i guess for someone like Geoff who has given the same message a million times, and recorded hundreds of hours, it seems like people just aren't being serious enough about their research