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Average fruit tree production  RSS feed

 
Antonio Scotti
Posts: 30
Location: Spain
forest garden fungi urban
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Hi,
I know there are a lot of variables to consider but....where can I find out about the average productivity of different types of fruit trees, with different rootstocks in a good year, supposing they have the best conditions, and in warm/mediterranean climates?

I am not interested so much into t/A (or t/Ha) but that of individual trees: eg Kg of fruit/tree

I am interested both in existing publications/articles or personal experience.
The idea is to try figure out how many kg of apples, or peaches, or apricots or cherries, figs, mulberries, chestnuts, walnuts etc. one tree may produce in a season on average, in order to plan for how many trees I may need for self consumption and maybe a little surplus.
Regards
 
David Livingston
steward
Posts: 3090
Location: Anjou ,France
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I looked at this issue a while ago and then gave up as not only did each tree give different amounts but each tree gave different amounts each year .  For instance last year my pears and apples where not very good , my plums wonderfull ( 50kg from one tree! ) and my quince gave one fruit . The year before the plums were average the quince gave about 20kg and the apples and pears poor . This year judging by the flowers looks poor for plums but good for apples pears and quince  ( and my little fig trees are looking good for the first tilme )
If I just look at pears for instance some years one type does better than others next year its a different type .
My suggestion is to plant the widest range possible of every fruit you can. Learn to graft and get as many types as you can . The different amounts mean that you will eat differently each year welcome the change    
 
Antonio Scotti
Posts: 30
Location: Spain
forest garden fungi urban
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Hi David,
thanks for your input and advice. I am well aware of what you say.
I am just trying to find out what's the max I can hope to get when all variables "have the right values" so to speak.
For example the fact that your plum tree gave 50 Kg in one good year it's a very valuable info to me, because it tells me that that's the max I can expect from a plum tree (or may be 60 Kg?) so if I want to get 100 Kg I may have to plant 2 o 3 of them (or more) to make sure I get something (then I may have to deal with an excess of fruit if they all produce well that year....but that's  another story).
It most probably will never deliver 300 Kg even in the best year of all.
That´s the kind of information I am after....but might it be a wrong approach nevertheless?
Regards
 
David Livingston
steward
Posts: 3090
Location: Anjou ,France
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I would suggest there are two ways to go either you plant lots of trees and keep planting trees every year ( thats what I do ) or you intensively work a limited number of trees such as espaliers etc to get as much fruit as possible from the trees you have .
I started here with 50 trees that are quite old yet still productive - plum quince apple , pears , Walnut  . These are mostly l mature trees and yeild well but are erratic  .I could intensively prune , thin fruit etc etc to ensure a better average yield instead I have chosen to plant new trees I average about 15 a year . I graft, take cuttings find new types of tree . This year I have added one apple ( cost 3 euro in sales  ) looks like about five apples have grafted on to rootstock I grew , added another  two figs ( cuttings taken from neighbours tree ) grafted two medlars, grafted four plums ( not sure how many have worked yet ) grafted a walnut. This year I hope to plant about twenty plums for future grafting ( apricot and almond )  some more quince for grafting apples and maybe hawthorn for grafting pears . In ten years I hope to have over 200 trees . I will be 65 time to retire and maybe live on fruit . If I followed the first path I would still have 50 trees
 
Antonio Scotti
Posts: 30
Location: Spain
forest garden fungi urban
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Thanks David, I think yours is an interesting, more resilient approach,  for sure but you need land in order to plant many trees. Also I think you are probably geared towards producing quite a lot of fruit in order to sell it / share it (when you are 65 ) in case you have over production, from what you write.

By the way I've just found a reference table in the book Edible Forest Gardens (page 437, book 2) for quite a few species of fruits, nuts ad berries which can also be downloaded from their website http://edibleforestgardens.com/files/docs/REVTab7.9Yields1-07.pdf
Regards
 
David Livingston
steward
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Location: Anjou ,France
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I don't think it's possible to have over production eventually I may sell some but it's an issue and living in France it involves paperwork tax etc etc
By the tonne
So instead I preserve it ( dry it ,jams and chutney , freezing ) eat it or give it away to family and friends . Those friends who return the favours get first go next time round
Planting sensibly does not use that much room and you can get a lot of trees in if you mix them up and plant them together some can be quite decorative planting north south lines with veggies in-between can work well
 
Alder Burns
pollinator
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Location: northern California
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If you are in a warm enough part of Spain, citrus may be a possibility.  Yields from these are astonishing compared to many temperate fruits.  The average mature orange tree and the average mature apple tree are similar in size, but the average yield of oranges can be ten times as much! 
     For a single person or a couple, the yield of fruit from just about any kind of mature tree will be a lot, providing a surplus for preservation, wine, barter, or sale.  Dwarf trees and trees trained to small spaces by pruning, espalier, etc. may help with this.  Bear in mind too that many fruits require cross-pollination, such that you need two varieties of apples in order to get any fruit, provided there are no other nearby trees, including wild apples and crabapples.  Grafting a branch of another variety onto one tree can solve this.
 
Matthew Lewis
Posts: 52
Location: Canada
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Do you have land yet Antonio​?

I sort of lean towards planting more then you need and then figuring out what to do with the excess. Seems like a good problem to have. Could even use it to fatten livestock.
 
Antonio Scotti
Posts: 30
Location: Spain
forest garden fungi urban
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Hi, thanks for all your inputs
yes I am considering a specific piece of land where I want to plant those trees.
Good idea this of planting more..sounds like an approach similar to Mark Shepard's, but that specific terrace I am thinking about  is not very big plus I want to interplant N-fixers (some of them can also be fruit bearing).

And in the land I have at hand can't really plant citrus because they wouldn't survive winter, at least not in a open field, may be 1 or 2 near the house wall where they can have a favorable microclimate..maybe with climate changing, in a few years I can possibly add more citrus trees of different kinds.

As for cross-pollination I guess for it to work those different varieties must be flowering at the same time right? If you have early flowering varieties and late ones I guess pollination may not work well.
Regards

 
David Livingston
steward
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Location: Anjou ,France
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Pollination gets a lot of folks hung up . I would not worry too much as there are simple ways to ensure your fruit is pollinated . For Example having a crab apple will pollinate all your apple trees Some wild plums will do the same for your plums etc etc . I have just grafted a bramley thanks to another person on permies these apples  need two polinators ( not the person on permies )  . I tell you some of these apples are really into kinky sex https://www.orangepippintrees.co.uk/articles/how-to-pollinate-bramley-apple-trees
Also having bees helps

David
 
Antonio Scotti
Posts: 30
Location: Spain
forest garden fungi urban
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David Livingston wrote: I would not worry too much as there are simple ways to ensure your fruit is pollinated . For Example having a crab apple will pollinate all your apple trees

David, excuse me for mi ignorance on the subject but: are you saying that for example the crab apple will be in flower for long enough time so that any apple variety in proximity would be pollinated regardless of whether they are an early variety or a late one? (same question for the prunus)
Cheers
 
David Livingston
steward
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In short yes
long answer I have not yet come across an apple that isnt . Bramley being triploid might need another polinator as well but thats a special case .. Here in France where the apple production is highly automated and they plant basically walls of apple trees , grown close together and of a limited height for easy picking , you can see crab apples grafted on top above the fruiting types to ensure polination .
As for the plums I am not so certain I just know I have never had problems .
 
David Livingston
steward
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If your space is limited then for me a quince is a must it looks great folks dont eat tonnes and tones but it addds spice to other dishes and looks great in the spring its self fertile  and is  easy to take hard wood cuttings you can use to graft apple and pear . Here is a picture of mine taken this week
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[Thumbnail for 054.JPG]
 
John Wolfram
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Location: Lafayette, Indiana
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My experience is that unless you are using a really dwarfing rootstock, one fruit tree regardless of type will produce enough fruit to make you sick of eating that type of fruit for a while. If you are planning on optimizing personal consumption, I would focus more on making sure you have evenly distributed harvest dates from the earliest ripening cherry to the latest ripening apple.
 
David Livingston
steward
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Location: Anjou ,France
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My own view is that I will have too much fruit when I run out of both ways to use it and friends/ family to give it too  and I dont think that is going to happen for some time yet . For instance I have yet to get into cider and vinegar production . ( Hypothetically I could also make spirits but since that is illegal here in France ...   anyone know where I can hypothetically buy a still here in europe ? )
 
2017 Permaculture Design Course at Wheaton Labs
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