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Summary

Paul sits down with some of his patreons (Julia, Katie, and Mark) to talk about an essay written by Derrek Jensen that became a precursor to Paul’s Building a Better World in your Backyard.

“And we shouldn’t pretend that solar photovoltaics, for example, exempt us from this: they still require mining and transportation infrastructures at every point in the production processes; the same can be said for every other so-called green technology” - Derrek

“I guess my approach is to make a long, long list of stuff that people can do themselves, in their back yard. Or in their house. Or on their homestead. And I hope to connect these ideas to millions of people. And I hope like minded people also share oodles of bits and bobs for others to do and they also connect those ideas to millions of people. And those millions tell millions more. And these ideas start to make their way to industry, because industry is loaded to the gills with people.  Further still, with a lot of these ideas I like to attach the word "permaculture". I hope that people will hear the word enough that they will think of looking toward permaculture to find a huge catalog of good ideas to explore.” - Paul

Julia points out that Derrek’s beliefs rely on nearly everyone being basically good and generous, whilst Paul’s acknowledges that not everyone will follow his path, but allows those that do to shine and attract anyone who wants a cheaper, more luxuriant life to follow along.  As a kind of proof of not everyone being nice, permaculture seems to attract such people to such concentration that about 1 in 10 members of the community are just around to cause problems and Paul had to address this in one of the pods a little way back.

Relevant Threads

Derrick Jensen: Forget Shorter Showers - Why personal change does not equal political change
Derrick Jensen "personal change vs. political change" - Paul's response

Building a Better World in your Backyard by Paul Wheaton and Shawn Klassen-Koop

Podcast 592 - Permaculture Smackdown 21 - Haters Gonna Hate - Part 1

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COMMENTS:
 
Inge Leonora-den Ouden
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Posts: 2155
Location: Meppel (Drenthe, the Netherlands)
666
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About 'great permaculture leaders' I have my own thoughts.
Firstly I think: we are all 'ordinary human beings', 'leaders' too, they are not better than others, they have their imperfections like all of us have.

Secondly my opinion is: we do not need 'great leaders'. We need many people who all do something that influences other people, or as Paul says 'infects the brains'.
F.e. If one person has a small backyard permaculture garden and tells the neighbour about permaculture and then the neighbour becomes interested in permaculture too ...
I think that's much better than a 'great leader' leading a large non-profit and giving lectures to large audiences, etc. When such a 'great leader' shows his/her imperfection in one small thing, there will be 'trolls' pointing at that one little thing (put it under a magnifying glass) and then they say: 'See! Permaculture is wrong, see what this permaculture leader does!'

When the person with a small permaculture garden does something wrong, maybe his/her neighbour will ask: 'What are you doing there now?! Is that permaculture too?' And then the first person can answer: 'Sorry, I did this because of ..., but it is not a good example.' The neighbour accepts, because they know each other, they both know they are 'ordinary imperfect human beings'.
 
paul wheaton
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Location: missoula, montana (zone 4)
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I think there are people that will state untrue things as facts - and thus gum up the works.  Effectively stopping permaculture or stopping some of the information for doing wholesome stuff.   So it takes a leader to provide clarity to improve greater, collective, forward velocity.

 
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