Expectation of Privacy

This post was inspired by what I posted in this thread:  https://permies.com/t/135612/author-obligated-sign-book#1062934

It bothers me that someone has a right to take a picture of me or to videotape me simply because I left my house.  I don't feel that I can life a full and satisfying life without going out "in public" at least some of the time and it pisses me off that that gives people the right to take a picture of me and use it pretty much however they see fit.  This whole issue has been exacerbated by the increasing use of drones and the fact that even when we think we are alone, in the middle of our own property, we may not be.  We can expect privacy but we don't have the right to it and IMO, that's messed up.

I am a little bothered by it, I admit. But at the same time, I think that there's a lot that you can't do anything about without hermiting up in the middle of your property with an anti-drone shotgun.

Nobody needs to use a drone or scan through CCTV videos to track me, though. I use an android phone, and lots of google. Even if I turn off my location tracking, I am fairly certain that my approximate location is being tracked so as to make some maps services available, even if it's just based on which cell tower I'm using. So there goes my privacy right there.

Any time I go into someone's place of business, use public transit, enter a public facility, or walk on some streets, footage is being taken of me.

What's worse, any time I go anywhere there's another person, they can easily look at me. I have no control over what they do with my image in their mind.

I am less worried about that aspect, what people can do with my image, than I am about people being able to track my activities as they pertain to circumventing irrational and environmentally damaging laws and protocols. But even there, I don't do much of anything that anyone could find objectionable. Where I do, it's surreptitious. I think the worst thing I could be accused of is urinating into my composter when it needs a shot of nitrogen and heat, particularly in the early spring, or spreading my paper-based used rabbit bedding directly onto the soil, with some kitchen scraps sewn in underneath.

I would rather put on a show than worry about it. I think that we are too uptight about many things. This is not the entirety of the point, but I will analogise using nudity taboos. I think that doing away with any remnant of nudity and sexual taboos (taboos about sex between responsible consenting individuals), and specifically of the link between nudity and sexuality, would help us adapt better. After all, if there weren't such a taboo about the naked form, it would cease to be in any way shocking. There wouldn't exist that feeling of potential violation, because, so what? Someone got a picture of some side-boob. Someone got a shot of my boys out of confinement before I could readjust my shorts on a hot day. So what? If nobody cared at all about occasional slips of nudity, it would lose any significance.

Princess Diana was killed in an incident escaping the papparazzi. Celebrities can literally find it impossible to go places unless they do it secretly. I think CCTV and ending up in someone's background Insta-whatever don't really match up. Hell, I think that it pales in comparison to large companies collecting data on our purchasing and movement habits, and then trading their findings to other companies willing to pay for that data, don't you? I mean, what's more likely to be used against you effectively, or even to generate profit at your expense, your image, or your travel and purchasing patterns, and what you look at on the internet?

-CK

I'm very lucky that where I live, there's laws preventing videos and photos if there is "an expectation of privacy".  For example, it's illegal to take photos of my home, even if the photographer is standing on a public street (a situation where it is legal in most of The Commonwealth).  It's also illegal to take photos of people in a public space where there is an expectation of privacy - like some parks or a restaurant - unless you are the owner or have a licence (which costs money) to do so.  

I've been learning a lot about photography and street photography this year and it's fascinating how much the law favours the photographer - especially the press. But where I live, it doesn't.  


We had an incident with a wild animal a few years back which made the news, but thankfully the police were respectful of our wish to not be involved in the media and to have our name kept out.  We wanted the media to focus on how awesome the animal control officer was and how stupid some other people were.  We don't need glory especially when grieving.  The police were really good at keeping our info from the media and I'm really happy the way the coverage focused on educating the public as to how to behave around wild critters instead of training them to eat livestock and people (yeh, I'm still pretty cut up about that).

In most of the world, the police would be obligated to disclose that information to the media and we would have had to deal with the press on top of the sadness of the event.


I can see why The Sussex are thinking of moving to BC.  The people here are pretty private people.  I know at least one friend who saw him in a shop and quickly put the lens cap on the camera out of respect for Harry's privacy.

Chris Kott wrote:. I use an android phone, and lots of google. Even if I turn off my location tracking, I am fairly certain that my approximate location is being tracked so as to make some maps services available, even if it's just based on which cell tower I'm using. So there goes my privacy right there.

Yes.   We voluntarily live in a "19Eighty4" world.  in frighteningly most every way.

And i don't do anything "objectionable" either.  i don't commit crimes.  So should i be concerned?  Yes.

Because the maleficent hackers ... criminals ... trolls can use what is available and 99% totally destroy someone's life.   But a maleficent governmental entity could cause 'Nazi Germany era" harm and destruction!

Smart phone... smart homes.... smart tv..... RFiD.... Apple watches.... street cams (CCtV) ... etc etc etc  

We have made our lives/movements/choices/etc readily available and out there.  Cyber Security.... what's that?  The Hackers are always on the leading edge of tech.  And if not them... the worst situation of supposedly 'good' governments...that have anti-terrorism open ended warrant/search and seizure "rights" (or blatant control as states like China have).  

We all need to give Orwell's book a fresh read.


l agree.... someone maybe sometime snapping a shot of your home or you..... is barely significant compared to the network of information/location gathering that most of us live in everyday.   At least practice a little 'operational security' and filter what you put up here on Permies or in Flakebook or Tweeter or email or to your home listening Al3xa unit.

Peace   :-{

I don't have any smart tech.  

Although I am thinking of getting a phone or similar because people don't carry cash anymore and I need to take credit card payments.  

I was talking about privacy in the cellphone shop and the woman suggested some makes were more respectful of privacy than others - but they all are invasive.  

In Oregon it is against the law to fly a drone over private property.https://www.nwnewsnetwork.org/post/oregon-senate-clarifies-rules-drones
What about online expectations of privacy? Great Britain has far more cameras than the US.
I'm guilty of talking smack about someone in Norwegian with my brother and being called out on it, embarassing but a true looking through the lens thing and self realization that I was out of line. private conversation yes, improper yes.

Robert Ray wrote:In Oregon it is against the law to fly a drone over private property.https://www.nwnewsnetwork.org/post/oregon-senate-clarifies-rules-drones
What about online expectations of privacy? Great Britain has far more cameras than the US.

I didn't know that, Robert. Thank you!

I've appreciated the thoughts expressed and will respond more when I can actually type.

I had a long list of the ways I protect my privacy listed in this post but then deleted it because I decided, ironically, that it was more than I wanted to share.

With very few exceptions, I go out of my way to use technology that doesn't track me.  I trade convenience for that and it's worth it.  

The bottom line is that my privacy matters to me.  That includes my picture, naked or not.  Not because I'm doing anything questionable or illegal or because I'm a prude but because my life isn't anyone's business unless I decide to share myself with them.  I think some of it comes from being introverted, although I know not everyone who is introverted feels the way I do.  Maybe it's my particular brand of introversion.  And although I don't believe that taking pictures of someone steals their soul in any real sense, in some ways, it feels like that to me.  Not just my picture, but all those things you all mentioned.  All the little details of the habits, beliefs, interests and actions that make up a person's life...

We are social creature and that means group info, like county records, that state, I own my lot, how much my lot is worth and taxes, I pay, am I married. Google, phone company and credit card company also know my gps info, my transaction info, my communication info via email/permies/search history/webhistory/credit-debit card purchases, etc. My voice signature when I go to my friends house with smart search always on. My license plate/car location or even face location via cctv and image recognition.


Way back in the village days, there was also no privacy, everyone was up in my business, and people would be slutshamed, stone actually at one point. Others would be called poor and shamed, other would be called weird herbal freaks who must be witch or nerdy scientist. We have always been nosy social creature, exploiting each others fears/needs/wants and making a profit. Learning each others habit and stealing when the owner isn't there.

Turns out I can't shoot down drones illegally flying on my property in NZ.
Bugger it would have been a good challenge.

Sometimes I leave my phone behind when I'm doing things or going places and I don't want any possibility of anyone tracing my movements.
I don't even trust it turned off.

As much as I despise the cameras and facial recognition software in big towns and cities it has solved a few crimes.

I entered a national competition this year and got through to the level before the finals.
Then reporters and the promotional people started ringing and asking all sorts of questions, at first I answered truthfully then I had to ask them to remove lots of things I didn't want to have out there for anyone to read.
The last interview I just made up answers.
My personal life is not the world's business.
Especially my relationship status.